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It is amazing the lengths the PRC takes to cover up this issue[1]. You would think at some point the party would disavow the actions of their predecessors or tr

It is amazing the lengths the PRC takes to cover up this issue[1]. You would think at some point the party would disavow the actions of their predecessors or try and marginalize connections to the past event rather than keep sweeping it under the rug. Next year will be the 25th anniversary, that will be interesting. [1] http://www.businessinsider.com/chinese-censors-block-big-yellow-duck-2013-6 http://www.businessinsider.com/chinese-censors-block-big-yel...

darkarmani 13y ago
But it is working so "well!" Is this a cultural mechanism or just the poor way that the PRC handles it?
- sageikosa 13y ago
  All the important things get stored in the memory hole.
- ajross 13y ago
  Sustained double-digit growth rates work very well as an unrest suppresion device. Seriously: the Chinese people are simply too busy being vastly wealthier than their parents to notice their lack of personal freedoms or representation in government. It's sad, but true. But it will correct itself eventually, hopefully with less bloodshed this time.
  - sageikosa 13y ago
    Parts of the Chinese nation are too busy being vastly wealthier than their parents. China has a decent-sized first and comparatively large second world economy embedded in the world's largest third-world economy.
    - ajross 13y ago
      This is true, but the third world economy is not the one that tends to revolt. Tiananmen was driven by students. And that demographic has been effectively pacified by the fantastic urban growth China has experienced over the last two decades.
      - sageikosa 13y ago
        Putting aside the reasons the third-world economy doesn't revolt or isn't seen actively revolting (being too busy trying to survive, having to deal with local officials and police that are part of the Confucian machinery, not having any significant outbound information channels in their geographic area, etc), the demographic of "student" is a constantly shifting one, and one that has been blocked from learning anything about Tienanmen for a quarter of a century. It is hard to form concepts about something that has been so effectively and actively suppressed, right to the level of the Great Firewall. By contrast, we can still talk about the various Occupy movements (some of which continue to smolder in various corners of urban centers), just most people don't really care that much, the street theater got stale; that sort of effect is real, and could conceivably contribute to a nonchalant attitude in China towards Tienanmen today, but we won't know, because the Party has decided that everyone must not care by keeping anyone from trying to learn about it.
narrator 13y ago
It's amazing the dogged persistence of the west in digging up events from more than 20 years ago and trying to carve the narrative of Chinese history of 1 billion people over the last 30 years around this event that lasted maybe two weeks and involved a few thousand. Think of the billions of people, their lives changing, the greatest mass migration in history to the cities, the greatest uplift in economic standards of people in world history and all that matters is this one event. The issue here is focus. What events are picked out of the trillions and magnified to encompass the whole expanse of our understanding about a particular topic and which ones are completely ignored yet hugely significant to people's lives?
- blake8086 13y ago
  But the PRC is still censoring it, right?
  - narrator 13y ago
    And the west is still endlessly editorializing about it. Excessive repetition is a kind of intellectual violence.
    - kps 13y ago
      I can understand how it must hurt to get run over by an intellectual tank.
    - sageikosa 13y ago
      Since "the west" isn't a secret cabal, but rather a generally broad and open concensus opinion; I'd say that "their" editorializing on the actions of a secretive cabal to suppress information is rightfully poignant.
- ghshephard 13y ago
  If the PRC didn't go to so much effort to censor this event (which was, beyond just the human cost, a very pivotal moment in authoritarian china development), it would likely get less attention. Streisand effect, writ large.
bangkoknights 13y ago
The media always shows a close-up photo of a man standing in front of three tanks. This photo might surprise you. http://imgur.com/N6mpnPY http://imgur.com/N6mpnPY

darkarmani 13y ago

But it is working so "well!" Is this a cultural mechanism or just the poor way that the PRC handles it?

sageikosa 13y ago
All the important things get stored in the memory hole.
ajross 13y ago
Sustained double-digit growth rates work very well as an unrest suppresion device. Seriously: the Chinese people are simply too busy being vastly wealthier than their parents to notice their lack of personal freedoms or representation in government. It's sad, but true. But it will correct itself eventually, hopefully with less bloodshed this time.
- sageikosa 13y ago
  Parts of the Chinese nation are too busy being vastly wealthier than their parents. China has a decent-sized first and comparatively large second world economy embedded in the world's largest third-world economy.
  - ajross 13y ago
    This is true, but the third world economy is not the one that tends to revolt. Tiananmen was driven by students. And that demographic has been effectively pacified by the fantastic urban growth China has experienced over the last two decades.
    - sageikosa 13y ago
      Putting aside the reasons the third-world economy doesn't revolt or isn't seen actively revolting (being too busy trying to survive, having to deal with local officials and police that are part of the Confucian machinery, not having any significant outbound information channels in their geographic area, etc), the demographic of "student" is a constantly shifting one, and one that has been blocked from learning anything about Tienanmen for a quarter of a century. It is hard to form concepts about something that has been so effectively and actively suppressed, right to the level of the Great Firewall. By contrast, we can still talk about the various Occupy movements (some of which continue to smolder in various corners of urban centers), just most people don't really care that much, the street theater got stale; that sort of effect is real, and could conceivably contribute to a nonchalant attitude in China towards Tienanmen today, but we won't know, because the Party has decided that everyone must not care by keeping anyone from trying to learn about it.

narrator 13y ago

It's amazing the dogged persistence of the west in digging up events from more than 20 years ago and trying to carve the narrative of Chinese history of 1 billion people over the last 30 years around this event that lasted maybe two weeks and involved a few thousand. Think of the billions of people, their lives changing, the greatest mass migration in history to the cities, the greatest uplift in economic standards of people in world history and all that matters is this one event. The issue here is focus. What events are picked out of the trillions and magnified to encompass the whole expanse of our understanding about a particular topic and which ones are completely ignored yet hugely significant to people's lives?

blake8086 13y ago
But the PRC is still censoring it, right?
- narrator 13y ago
  And the west is still endlessly editorializing about it. Excessive repetition is a kind of intellectual violence.
  - kps 13y ago
    I can understand how it must hurt to get run over by an intellectual tank.
  - sageikosa 13y ago
    Since "the west" isn't a secret cabal, but rather a generally broad and open concensus opinion; I'd say that "their" editorializing on the actions of a secretive cabal to suppress information is rightfully poignant.
ghshephard 13y ago
If the PRC didn't go to so much effort to censor this event (which was, beyond just the human cost, a very pivotal moment in authoritarian china development), it would likely get less attention. Streisand effect, writ large.

bangkoknights 13y ago

The media always shows a close-up photo of a man standing in front of three tanks. This photo might surprise you. http://imgur.com/N6mpnPY http://imgur.com/N6mpnPY