4 ms·

I'd encourage people to think of this less as "Wow, she misinterpreted a series of options and got progressively father from her goal state until it was unrecov

by patio11 13y ago

I'd encourage people to think of this less as "Wow, she misinterpreted a series of options and got progressively father from her goal state until it was unrecoverable; sucks to be her" to "This is computers as perceived by people who do not make a living making computers work, and we should anticipate them not always understanding our applications and design them to facilitate understanding when possible and make correction easy when not, to the maximum extent possible."

ramblerman 13y ago
You're just playing to the crowd now. As if anyone in the HN comments is going to side with google on this one.
- patio11 13y ago
  We have perhaps a different read of the current page of comments, where it strikes me that a lot of people are playing blame-the-user, a game which does not build companies.
yesimahuman 13y ago
Shit, I make a living making computers work, and managing my Google Apps Accounts hardly makes sense to me.
- mvzink 13y ago
  No computer science education or IT experience can save you from the hours of unnecessary struggle that are the real price of a Google Apps account.
pasbesoin 13y ago
As someone who's had to support "normal" people on Google products -- as well as other products with similar problems -- for some time, I couldn't agree more. "There is a way to do this" does not equate with the "average" user 1) Understanding this; 2) Remembering this especially when used infrequently; 3) Allowing themselves to be arsed with it when it's a cumbersome process. Further, product managers and "designers" keep changing the design. Even and especially designs that were meant to convey e.g. the existence of and validity of secure connections. Everyone wants the marketplace of "computing for the masses". Well, you need to design and engineer for those masses, as well. To some extent, this is being "resolved" by "the masses" already being onboarded and managing, through constant exposure, to somewhat keep up. However, this means of "dealing" with the problem leaves plenty of room for failures, some of which are pretty spectacular for the individuals and/or organizations involved. "Secure" your documents in our "perpetually" available and backed up online storage... "Whoops", they're gone! A blip on the map. Except for the user involved.
- ritchiea 13y ago
  Allow me to correct you, everyone wants to design for smart, advanced users who have the latest browsers that allow us to do cool stuff while we hope that the masses will get with the program / super users will tout our product so well the masses feel they must adopt it. Obviously that's an overgeneralization but I don't know very many people who actually want to design for the masses. Converting the masses is only something we value because we know it's necessary to make a lot of money, not because we believe reaching the masses by itself is a sign of great design or innovative work. For example most developers and almost all designers I know use macs and design for macs (e.g. web typography that looks fantastic next to Mac OS UI elements and out of place next to windows UI elements) even though many of their users may be using windows.
mbesto 13y ago
Highly relevant: https://plus.google.com/112678702228711889851/posts/eVeouesvaVX https://plus.google.com/112678702228711889851/posts/eVeouesv... (Steve Yegge's platform rant)

by patio11 13y ago

ramblerman 13y ago

You're just playing to the crowd now. As if anyone in the HN comments is going to side with google on this one.

patio11 13y ago
We have perhaps a different read of the current page of comments, where it strikes me that a lot of people are playing blame-the-user, a game which does not build companies.

yesimahuman 13y ago

Shit, I make a living making computers work, and managing my Google Apps Accounts hardly makes sense to me.

mvzink 13y ago
No computer science education or IT experience can save you from the hours of unnecessary struggle that are the real price of a Google Apps account.

pasbesoin 13y ago

As someone who's had to support "normal" people on Google products -- as well as other products with similar problems -- for some time, I couldn't agree more. "There is a way to do this" does not equate with the "average" user 1) Understanding this; 2) Remembering this especially when used infrequently; 3) Allowing themselves to be arsed with it when it's a cumbersome process. Further, product managers and "designers" keep changing the design. Even and especially designs that were meant to convey e.g. the existence of and validity of secure connections. Everyone wants the marketplace of "computing for the masses". Well, you need to design and engineer for those masses, as well. To some extent, this is being "resolved" by "the masses" already being onboarded and managing, through constant exposure, to somewhat keep up. However, this means of "dealing" with the problem leaves plenty of room for failures, some of which are pretty spectacular for the individuals and/or organizations involved. "Secure" your documents in our "perpetually" available and backed up online storage... "Whoops", they're gone! A blip on the map. Except for the user involved.

ritchiea 13y ago
Allow me to correct you, everyone wants to design for smart, advanced users who have the latest browsers that allow us to do cool stuff while we hope that the masses will get with the program / super users will tout our product so well the masses feel they must adopt it. Obviously that's an overgeneralization but I don't know very many people who actually want to design for the masses. Converting the masses is only something we value because we know it's necessary to make a lot of money, not because we believe reaching the masses by itself is a sign of great design or innovative work. For example most developers and almost all designers I know use macs and design for macs (e.g. web typography that looks fantastic next to Mac OS UI elements and out of place next to windows UI elements) even though many of their users may be using windows.

mbesto 13y ago

Highly relevant: https://plus.google.com/112678702228711889851/posts/eVeouesvaVX https://plus.google.com/112678702228711889851/posts/eVeouesv... (Steve Yegge's platform rant)