7 ms·

I loved Camino back in the 10.1 / 10.2 days. It was truly epic , and so much better than the god awful IE for Mac.

by fleitz 13y ago

GigabyteCoin 13y ago
IE for Mac? That has to be an oxy moron of some sort.
- theatrus2 13y ago
  It also was the most standards compliant and performant IE of its time, being a totally different code base.
  - yuhong 13y ago
    Eg. transparent PNGs.
  - duaneb 13y ago
    Possibly because they had to please Apple AND Microsoft?
    - brokenparser 13y ago
      No. It's because MSIE for Windows wouldn't run on MacOS and they couldn't use Wine. (MSFT would never do that.)
      - jonny_eh 13y ago
        Wine wouldn't have worked either since OSX was PowerPC based at the time.
        brokenparser 13y ago
        That and the fact that wine only runs on *nix, so it'd require another compatibility layer to provide POSIX and BSD functionality under classic MacOS. OSX didn't even exist at the time IE for Mac was written. They'd also have to come up with a visual theme layer so they could at least pretend it's a Mac program, long before they introduced one in Windows. All of that still wouldn't get them menu bar support, though. In hindsight, I didn't think it through at all when I mentioned wine. They do have MS-Office ports for Mac, so that product was probably written with much better separation of concerns.
      - duaneb 13y ago
        I guess there's no reason for Microsoft to decouple their browser from their OS, I guess....
- dietrichepp 13y ago
  For a surprisingly long window of time, IE Mac was the best browser around. Apparently, it did not share a code base with Windows IE, which explains why IE Mac had all the features people were drooling over in 2001 like full PNG transparency and good CSS support. PNG support even included color correction, and IE Mac did not suffer from the "box model" bug that affected IE on Windows. I think the Mac version of IE had something like 99% compliance on the first Acid test, before other browsers had robust CSS support. You could even find a copy of the Acid test in an easter egg in the browser. It was a fantastic browser at the time, but didn't align with Microsoft's future interests and the development team was reassigned.
  - yuhong 13y ago
    Yea, it was one of the first browsers to implement DOCTYPE switching.
  - terhechte 13y ago
    In 2001 I, for the first time in my life, had access to Macs running Mac OS 9. While I didn't like the operating system much (I was using Linux and Windows at home, the idea of having to assign memory to application manually felt so 80s) I instantly fell in love with IE for Mac. Back then, in PC land, Netscape Navigator and IE 5.5 were the dominant browser, and IE for Mac supported all these fantastic CSS properties that I knew about, but that I could not use in NN4 or IE5.5. I spend hours buliding pure CSS websites without images, simply utilizing unicode fonts, and CSS properties. Ah, those were the days.
  - iSnow 13y ago
    Unfortunately it had the most annoying bug in that it did not reload CSS files. Back in the day, I developed with a text editor on mac PowerBook and after changing one CSS statement, I had to close the browser and restart it.
    - brokenparser 13y ago
      MacOS had a built-in web server. You could've used that.
- derleth 13y ago
  There was an IE for UNIX back in the 1990s, which meant Solaris and HP-UX. The last version was IE5. http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Internet_Explorer_for_UNIX http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Internet_Explorer_for_UNIX And before that, MicroSoft was best known for its BASIC implementation that wound up on a whole range of eight-bit microcomputers. https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Microsoft_BASIC https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Microsoft_BASIC The versions for 6502-based micros shared a codebase: http://www.pagetable.com/?p=46 http://www.pagetable.com/?p=46 And, in some versions, they had an easter egg hidden in the constants used to implement SIN: http://www.pagetable.com/?p=43 http://www.pagetable.com/?p=43
masklinn 13y ago
I still love it. To this day it remains my primary browser, through its aged rendering, through its lockups on JS-heavy sites, through its dated icons, through everything. Because the UI of every other browser just feels wrong. Aside from Safari maybe, but Safari's tab bar makes it impossible to handle 50+ tabs.
- progrock 13y ago
  Pick any of the main browsers, the main advance in the UI is the slimming down of controls. Even Opera went from a g'zillion toolbars down to a slim default interface. The rendering engines receive loads of attention while the basic browser UI is just plain boring and out dated. Camino doesn't really look that out of place even today. Has Firefox gone completely native then on OSX? From what I can tell on Linux is that Firefox and Opera stand out (and even Chrome that shuns your system title bar..) These three apps are out of place on my desktop. At least Camino blended in.
- lttlrck 13y ago
  50+ tabs!!
  - twic 13y ago
    I know! How does he manage to have so few?
    - as_if 13y ago
      he's one of the people who partly (because he's still over 10 tabs) gets the current bookmark-systems in browsers. For most users the bookmarks seem to be broken/too complex. Never had the problem, maybe because I'm going crazy when I got over 10 tabs and want to get rid of them ASAP. :\
      - masklinn 13y ago
        I have absolutely no idea what you're talking about. I don't use bookmarks, I used to put things in there and never find them when I needed them, so I've stopped doing that.

I loved Camino back in the 10.1 / 10.2 days. It was truly epic , and so much better than the god awful IE for Mac.

by fleitz 13y ago

I loved Camino back in the 10.1 / 10.2 days. It was truly epic , and so much better than the god awful IE for Mac.

GigabyteCoin 13y ago

IE for Mac? That has to be an oxy moron of some sort.

theatrus2 13y ago
It also was the most standards compliant and performant IE of its time, being a totally different code base.
- yuhong 13y ago
  Eg. transparent PNGs.
- duaneb 13y ago
  Possibly because they had to please Apple AND Microsoft?
  - brokenparser 13y ago
    No. It's because MSIE for Windows wouldn't run on MacOS and they couldn't use Wine. (MSFT would never do that.)
    - jonny_eh 13y ago
      Wine wouldn't have worked either since OSX was PowerPC based at the time.
      - brokenparser 13y ago
        That and the fact that wine only runs on *nix, so it'd require another compatibility layer to provide POSIX and BSD functionality under classic MacOS. OSX didn't even exist at the time IE for Mac was written. They'd also have to come up with a visual theme layer so they could at least pretend it's a Mac program, long before they introduced one in Windows. All of that still wouldn't get them menu bar support, though. In hindsight, I didn't think it through at all when I mentioned wine. They do have MS-Office ports for Mac, so that product was probably written with much better separation of concerns.
    - duaneb 13y ago
      I guess there's no reason for Microsoft to decouple their browser from their OS, I guess....
dietrichepp 13y ago
For a surprisingly long window of time, IE Mac was the best browser around. Apparently, it did not share a code base with Windows IE, which explains why IE Mac had all the features people were drooling over in 2001 like full PNG transparency and good CSS support. PNG support even included color correction, and IE Mac did not suffer from the "box model" bug that affected IE on Windows. I think the Mac version of IE had something like 99% compliance on the first Acid test, before other browsers had robust CSS support. You could even find a copy of the Acid test in an easter egg in the browser. It was a fantastic browser at the time, but didn't align with Microsoft's future interests and the development team was reassigned.
- yuhong 13y ago
  Yea, it was one of the first browsers to implement DOCTYPE switching.
- terhechte 13y ago
  In 2001 I, for the first time in my life, had access to Macs running Mac OS 9. While I didn't like the operating system much (I was using Linux and Windows at home, the idea of having to assign memory to application manually felt so 80s) I instantly fell in love with IE for Mac. Back then, in PC land, Netscape Navigator and IE 5.5 were the dominant browser, and IE for Mac supported all these fantastic CSS properties that I knew about, but that I could not use in NN4 or IE5.5. I spend hours buliding pure CSS websites without images, simply utilizing unicode fonts, and CSS properties. Ah, those were the days.
- iSnow 13y ago
  Unfortunately it had the most annoying bug in that it did not reload CSS files. Back in the day, I developed with a text editor on mac PowerBook and after changing one CSS statement, I had to close the browser and restart it.
  - brokenparser 13y ago
    MacOS had a built-in web server. You could've used that.
derleth 13y ago
There was an IE for UNIX back in the 1990s, which meant Solaris and HP-UX. The last version was IE5. http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Internet_Explorer_for_UNIX http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Internet_Explorer_for_UNIX And before that, MicroSoft was best known for its BASIC implementation that wound up on a whole range of eight-bit microcomputers. https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Microsoft_BASIC https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Microsoft_BASIC The versions for 6502-based micros shared a codebase: http://www.pagetable.com/?p=46 http://www.pagetable.com/?p=46 And, in some versions, they had an easter egg hidden in the constants used to implement SIN: http://www.pagetable.com/?p=43 http://www.pagetable.com/?p=43

masklinn 13y ago

I still love it. To this day it remains my primary browser, through its aged rendering, through its lockups on JS-heavy sites, through its dated icons, through everything. Because the UI of every other browser just feels wrong. Aside from Safari maybe, but Safari's tab bar makes it impossible to handle 50+ tabs.

progrock 13y ago
Pick any of the main browsers, the main advance in the UI is the slimming down of controls. Even Opera went from a g'zillion toolbars down to a slim default interface. The rendering engines receive loads of attention while the basic browser UI is just plain boring and out dated. Camino doesn't really look that out of place even today. Has Firefox gone completely native then on OSX? From what I can tell on Linux is that Firefox and Opera stand out (and even Chrome that shuns your system title bar..) These three apps are out of place on my desktop. At least Camino blended in.
lttlrck 13y ago
50+ tabs!!
- twic 13y ago
  I know! How does he manage to have so few?
  - as_if 13y ago
    he's one of the people who partly (because he's still over 10 tabs) gets the current bookmark-systems in browsers. For most users the bookmarks seem to be broken/too complex. Never had the problem, maybe because I'm going crazy when I got over 10 tabs and want to get rid of them ASAP. :\
    - masklinn 13y ago
      I have absolutely no idea what you're talking about. I don't use bookmarks, I used to put things in there and never find them when I needed them, so I've stopped doing that.