4 ms·

I totally disagree with this. There's a really succinct test case on the bug: "Visit a local PC store, Attempt to buy a machine without any proprietary software

I totally disagree with this. There's a really succinct test case on the bug: "Visit a local PC store, Attempt to buy a machine without any proprietary software". So "the submitter" (Mark) wants to be able to go into a PC store and buy a PC without proprietary software. Even in those general terms, the bug is clearly still evident and clearly has not been fixed: saying "ah, but you can go into a shop and buy an Android tablet" is pretty unsatisfying.

mikeash 13y ago
That's supposed to demonstrate the bug, but it's not necessarily the end-all and be-all of fixing it. In a hypothetical world where Apple somehow took over the PC market, would this bug be fixed? The title suggests yes. The first paragraph suggests yes. The rest suggests no. The bug is vague and contradictory.
- ealexhudson 13y ago
  Apple taking over is a hypothetical state in which you could argue the bug is fixed. I don't see anything in the actual state of things which allows that argument. Vagueness is a continuum, not an absolute. The bug could be less vague, sure. I don't think it needs to be less vague in order to evaluate it right now, though.
  - mikeash 13y ago
    The vagueness which applies to the actual situation today is: did they really mean desktop PCs only, or did they mean consumer computing, with desktop PCs being the only pertinent example of it in 2004? And, did they mean no proprietary software on a majority, or just no MS software? Because right now, MS does not have a majority in consumer computing, but the majority is no longer desktop PCs, and the majority still ships with plenty of proprietary software. It's not possible to know whether or not this fits with the intent of the bug, because it's not sufficiently clear.
mhaymo 13y ago
> saying "ah, but you can go into a shop and buy an Android tablet" is pretty unsatisfying. Particularly because it's doubtful that you could buy one without pre-installed software which is not only proprietary, but reports a great deal of information about you and your contacts to Google.
arkdrag 13y ago
"Fixing the bug ideally requires more resources than we have available, but here is a simple workaround" is actually a pretty common bug resolution.
yawaramin 13y ago
Who cares what crapware is on the machine? You can wipe it out and install whatever free OS you like. I would argue that your test case isn't particularly relevant any more.
- Ntrails 13y ago
  Not without accepting microsofts terms of service you can't..

mikeash 13y ago

That's supposed to demonstrate the bug, but it's not necessarily the end-all and be-all of fixing it. In a hypothetical world where Apple somehow took over the PC market, would this bug be fixed? The title suggests yes. The first paragraph suggests yes. The rest suggests no. The bug is vague and contradictory.

ealexhudson 13y ago
Apple taking over is a hypothetical state in which you could argue the bug is fixed. I don't see anything in the actual state of things which allows that argument. Vagueness is a continuum, not an absolute. The bug could be less vague, sure. I don't think it needs to be less vague in order to evaluate it right now, though.
- mikeash 13y ago
  The vagueness which applies to the actual situation today is: did they really mean desktop PCs only, or did they mean consumer computing, with desktop PCs being the only pertinent example of it in 2004? And, did they mean no proprietary software on a majority, or just no MS software? Because right now, MS does not have a majority in consumer computing, but the majority is no longer desktop PCs, and the majority still ships with plenty of proprietary software. It's not possible to know whether or not this fits with the intent of the bug, because it's not sufficiently clear.

mhaymo 13y ago

> saying "ah, but you can go into a shop and buy an Android tablet" is pretty unsatisfying. Particularly because it's doubtful that you could buy one without pre-installed software which is not only proprietary, but reports a great deal of information about you and your contacts to Google.

arkdrag 13y ago

"Fixing the bug ideally requires more resources than we have available, but here is a simple workaround" is actually a pretty common bug resolution.

yawaramin 13y ago

Who cares what crapware is on the machine? You can wipe it out and install whatever free OS you like. I would argue that your test case isn't particularly relevant any more.

Ntrails 13y ago
Not without accepting microsofts terms of service you can't..