4 ms·

As someone with a BS and MS in CS (having written a thesis for the latter), it was amazing to see how weak some of the other grad students were. At my school, m

by zedpm 13y ago

As someone with a BS and MS in CS (having written a thesis for the latter), it was amazing to see how weak some of the other grad students were. At my school, many of the foreign grad students didn't have an undergrad CS degree and it showed. This isn't a knock on foreign students, just an observation that they comprised the bulk of the grad students who took the path that omitted the undergraduate work and consequently exhibited shocking failures to understand CS basics. I'd certainly think very hard about hiring a MS-only candidate, particularly if he/she didn't have publications.

enraged_camel 13y ago
I'm thinking about doing an MS in CS within the next five years, and I don't have a BS in CS. I studied Informatics in undergrad. http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Informatics_(academic_field) http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Informatics_(academic_field) You talked about "shocking failures to understand CS basics." What would you recommend learning for someone like me before they start an MS in BS?
- zedpm 13y ago
  Without knowing what program you've been through, what program you're planning on entering, and what focus or purpose you have in seeking a MS in CS, I can only describe things based on the program I went through. A student ought to have studied and understand discrete math, data structures, and fundamental concepts of computing and programming languages. CS isn't about programming, but for your mind to be in the right place and in order to participate in the program you really ought to be a strong coder with at least one language under your belt. Research will almost certainly require significant coding, even if the work is theoretical in nature. Beyond that it really depends on what program you're doing and what your focus will be. In many cases you'll want significant mathematics background, including areas like abstract algebra (important for crypto studies), numerical analysis, experience with proofs (useful for theory of computations studies)...it goes on and on.
- Dewie 13y ago
  Did you study in an English-speaking country or somewhere else? Because it seems that "informatics" is often a synonym for computer science, only that it is a more direct translation of the name of field from the original language. I've personally taken a lot of courses at an institute at my university which is called "institute of informatics", but I haven't found much mismatch from the course-material there and the subjects that are usually thought of as computer science.
  - enraged_camel 13y ago
    See here: https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=5788410 https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=5788410
- 205guy 13y ago
  As someone who has studied in the US and France, informatics and computer science are the same thing. Informatics is generally a European term and computer science is used predominently in the US--not sure about UK. There could be slight nuance of definition (infomratics not being hardware based, and CS starting with transistors), but my experience, both covered hardware and software. So I think you're the perfect candidate for an MS in CS. What worries me more are the options mentioned in the article and the comments for non-CS/informatics degrees to do an MS in CS. Maybe there is some thinking that someone with a BS degree in any science shouldn't have to do undergrad CS work, but it seems to me they should earn a BS in CS not an MS. I also get that some cross-pollination between similar fields (say robotics and CS, applied math and CS, etc.) can be beneficial to the students and the program in general, but make those students take extra undergad courses to catch up. Dumbing down MS coursework for non-CS people really defeats the purpose of the MS for everyone. That would be my main issue with the topics in the article (having a research-oriented and a non-research MS seems fine to me).
  - enraged_camel 13y ago
    I studied at University of Washington in Seattle. That said, it was different than Computer Science. Besides one introductory programming course, there was no programming required. Even for our capstone projects, wireframes were sufficient. We didn't actually need to code anything. To give you an idea, here's the curriculum: http://ischool.uw.edu/academics/informatics/curriculum http://ischool.uw.edu/academics/informatics/curriculum My main concern with doing an MS in CS is that I wasn't exposed to a lot of traditional computer science concepts, such as operating systems, hardware, compilers, algorithms, etc. And the highest level of math I've taken is Calculus I (and a 300-level statistics course which was frankly a joke).
    - 205guy 13y ago
      Thanks for the link to the curriculum, I haven't looked into CS education in a long time. My observation is that CS is getting to be a huge field. There was a time when it wasn't much more than OS and compilers (I exaggerate). Now they try to cover the more recent (web apps) and more practical (database retrieval) topics that are directly applicable to new hires. I think that's fine, and your curriculum certainly looks robust (and has some very relevant new topics such as "information ethics and policies"). However, I would still expect you to be able to program after your 2 programming and web technologies classes. And those intro to programming classes are pretty light if they did not cover algorithms. To take a recent example here on HN: did you cover big-O notation? To me that is fundamental, and the BS programs are cutting corners if they're leaving that out.

by zedpm 13y ago

enraged_camel 13y ago

I'm thinking about doing an MS in CS within the next five years, and I don't have a BS in CS. I studied Informatics in undergrad. http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Informatics_(academic_field) http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Informatics_(academic_field) You talked about "shocking failures to understand CS basics." What would you recommend learning for someone like me before they start an MS in BS?

zedpm 13y ago
Without knowing what program you've been through, what program you're planning on entering, and what focus or purpose you have in seeking a MS in CS, I can only describe things based on the program I went through. A student ought to have studied and understand discrete math, data structures, and fundamental concepts of computing and programming languages. CS isn't about programming, but for your mind to be in the right place and in order to participate in the program you really ought to be a strong coder with at least one language under your belt. Research will almost certainly require significant coding, even if the work is theoretical in nature. Beyond that it really depends on what program you're doing and what your focus will be. In many cases you'll want significant mathematics background, including areas like abstract algebra (important for crypto studies), numerical analysis, experience with proofs (useful for theory of computations studies)...it goes on and on.
Dewie 13y ago
Did you study in an English-speaking country or somewhere else? Because it seems that "informatics" is often a synonym for computer science, only that it is a more direct translation of the name of field from the original language. I've personally taken a lot of courses at an institute at my university which is called "institute of informatics", but I haven't found much mismatch from the course-material there and the subjects that are usually thought of as computer science.
- enraged_camel 13y ago
  See here: https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=5788410 https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=5788410
205guy 13y ago
As someone who has studied in the US and France, informatics and computer science are the same thing. Informatics is generally a European term and computer science is used predominently in the US--not sure about UK. There could be slight nuance of definition (infomratics not being hardware based, and CS starting with transistors), but my experience, both covered hardware and software. So I think you're the perfect candidate for an MS in CS. What worries me more are the options mentioned in the article and the comments for non-CS/informatics degrees to do an MS in CS. Maybe there is some thinking that someone with a BS degree in any science shouldn't have to do undergrad CS work, but it seems to me they should earn a BS in CS not an MS. I also get that some cross-pollination between similar fields (say robotics and CS, applied math and CS, etc.) can be beneficial to the students and the program in general, but make those students take extra undergad courses to catch up. Dumbing down MS coursework for non-CS people really defeats the purpose of the MS for everyone. That would be my main issue with the topics in the article (having a research-oriented and a non-research MS seems fine to me).
- enraged_camel 13y ago
  I studied at University of Washington in Seattle. That said, it was different than Computer Science. Besides one introductory programming course, there was no programming required. Even for our capstone projects, wireframes were sufficient. We didn't actually need to code anything. To give you an idea, here's the curriculum: http://ischool.uw.edu/academics/informatics/curriculum http://ischool.uw.edu/academics/informatics/curriculum My main concern with doing an MS in CS is that I wasn't exposed to a lot of traditional computer science concepts, such as operating systems, hardware, compilers, algorithms, etc. And the highest level of math I've taken is Calculus I (and a 300-level statistics course which was frankly a joke).
  - 205guy 13y ago
    Thanks for the link to the curriculum, I haven't looked into CS education in a long time. My observation is that CS is getting to be a huge field. There was a time when it wasn't much more than OS and compilers (I exaggerate). Now they try to cover the more recent (web apps) and more practical (database retrieval) topics that are directly applicable to new hires. I think that's fine, and your curriculum certainly looks robust (and has some very relevant new topics such as "information ethics and policies"). However, I would still expect you to be able to program after your 2 programming and web technologies classes. And those intro to programming classes are pretty light if they did not cover algorithms. To take a recent example here on HN: did you cover big-O notation? To me that is fundamental, and the BS programs are cutting corners if they're leaving that out.