I can't compete with you on details of Pakistan! But, somehow while supposedly trying to help the US bring peace to Afghanistan, Bin Laden lived in a relativel

I can't compete with you on details of Pakistan! But, somehow while supposedly trying to help the US bring peace to Afghanistan, Bin Laden lived in a relatively large and nice house for some years about a good golf shot from the Pakistan army college. And no one knew he was there? And when President Clinton fired cruise missiles at the Bin Laden training camp in Afghanistan, US Secretary of State Albright (also known as Half-bright) informed the Pakistan government since the missiles would have to fly over Pakistan territory. Then somehow Half-bright's information made it to Bin Laden who was well out of the area when the missiles arrived. Of course Islam is not all there is to it, not in Turkey, Indonesia, Pakistan, or even Afghanistan. And clearly economics is also important. But my point was about 'culture'. Or just why have US efforts to create democracy in Afghanistan failed? My answer, culture: There's no real basis for democracy in Afghanistan culture. Does this mean that Afghanistan has no culture? No, they do. They have a strong culture, one that runs nearly everything, Islam. Get rid of Islam and they don't have much except maybe a few goats, some poppies, some rusty AK-47s. So, they don't get rid of Islam. Not all of Islam is against democracy, but the culture in Afghanistan is Islam with no foundation for democracy. This thread (sorry about the times I typed 'tread' instead) has mentioned that in part the Taliban act like the Mafia in Italy and at times parts of the US. That's some of what I thought, and, yes, it's not from Islam. But the main reason for a Mafia is that there is no good alternative system of police and government. With a good system of police, when a Mafia guy comes to a store owner and asks for a monthly payment, the store owner can go to the police who will be waiting when the Mafia guy comes and accepts the money and then ... lock up the Mafia guy for a long time. But this system needs a good culture to support such good police and, thus, good police to protect the citizens. In contrast, all Afghanistan has in culture is just Islam; Islam doesn't provide good support of police that support the citizens; there's no other culture; so the Taliban get to use Mafia tactics. Neither the Taliban nor the villagers believe that a democracy should be better. So, Islam and Mafia tactics are what's there. It's not that Islam is against good police protection; it's mostly just that Islam doesn't provide good police protection, and in Afghanistan Islam is essentially all the culture. So, no good police protection. And it's not that an Islamic country can't have good police protection; I can believe that some Islamic countries have some very strong police. But in Afghanistan, about all there is is Islam and next to nothing about good police or democracy. And the Islamic clerics? It's not in their interest to see the growth of strong, secular institutions such as good police. So, again, no good police force can grow up. Or Islamic Sharia law: Try to implement something descended from Napoleonic law or British Common law, etc., and, in a country that has essentially only Islam, many Muslims will keep asking for Sharia law. So, get a 500 year old legal system. Education? Try to set up a 21st century, or 20th century, education system, and, in a country that has essentially only Islam, a lot of Muslims will insist on Islamic education instead. Halt: Again out of date by 500 years. Look, if Islam were only religion, then it would be much less of a road block to progress in Afghanistan. Instead, Islam is running nearly everything there and, thus, is able to block nearly any change or progress. A big point about Islam for people in the US is that Islam is not just religion but is also how to dress, what to eat, how to run a marriage, education, architecture, system of laws, government, etc. So, in the less developed Islamic countries, Islam is a roadblock to change. E.g., in Iraq, there are two sides to Islam, the Shiites and the Sunnis. So, since they have little more important in their lives than just their religion, they fight. They would just rather have a civil war than get on with pumping oil and living a life of milk and honey. They did that already in Europe, been there, done that, got the T-shirt, and had the rivers running red for hundreds of years from religious wars. Finally they learned: Have politics and government separate from and largely independent of religion; have freedom of religion; and don't fight over religion. Done. When the Muslims in, say, Iraq learn that lesson, they will be ahead some hundreds of years.