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One of the sharpest developers I have ever worked with -- was 63. He did only mobile development and only would agree to work 30 hours a week. When I pressed

One of the sharpest developers I have ever worked with -- was 63. He did only mobile development and only would agree to work 30 hours a week. When I pressed him on it, he explained that he liked to constantly be working on both Android and iOS projects, 30 hours a week each, and that kept his backlog of waiting clients happy. EDIT: He completed the iOS application under budget with wonderful tests.

zerr 13y ago
I really wonder at what rates one might work at these ages.
- ihsw 13y ago
  At that age the rates are irrelevant compared to the health insurance compensation. Most people at that age would be willing to take a pay cut in exchange for generous health benefits and flexible hours.
  - jarek 13y ago
    I must have missed the part where MetaCosm stated his developer was buying health insurance in an age-discriminating market.
    - MetaCosm 13y ago
      He was in the US (Arizona if I remember correctly), and had been incorporated for a number of years... but I have no idea about his health care situation... the joy of contractors, I don't have to care. I give him $180 an hour for X hours, he gives me a wonderful product, everyone goes home happy.
      - rbanffy 13y ago
        > the joy of contractors, I don't have to care. Not really. If the contractor gets sick, it's still your problem. I care for my contractors and always make sure they are paid enough to afford good medical care and a stable financial situation. It makes sense, even from a deeply selfish point of view - the less time they spend worrying about such things, the more they spend working.
        MetaCosm 13y ago
        First of all, I don't think it is my responsibility to ensure contractors are paid X, that is their responsibility, they set the rate. I decide if I think their skills match their rate. I can't decide what is "good" medical care for them, nor can I decide how much it costs (maybe he has a medical condition and needs 20k a month just for insurance). I can't decide what a stable financial situation is for someone either. The arrogance of someone who thinks they can baffles me. I might think 200k is plenty, but I have no idea about what contractor X consider "plenty" and to assume is simply projecting. As for him being my problem. If a contractor can't work, you replace them, depending on how the contract was setup, you might collect some insurance to help get over the ugly transition.
        rbanffy 13y ago
        Even if it's not your responsibility, it's your problem. Replacing a contractor is not like replacing a cog in a machine. As for deciding what's enough for a stable financial condition, I can't. What you I do, as a manager is to pay attention for warning signs. Years ago, I had a programmer, young and very bright, who kept entering lousy freelance projects on the side. He was under great pressure because he had financial problems. I didn't want to lose him, but burnout was already on the horizon. When performance review time came, I enrolled him on a personal finance course. Within six months, the freelance jobs went away, he started coming in earlier and the already good quality of his work improved further. He had more time to study, more time for his family and more attention for his work.
- MetaCosm 13y ago
  He was relatively expensive, $180 an hour. But his estimate was about 40% duration versus other ones, and he delivered quicker than expected. Probably closer to 35%. So, while a lot of the bids we got were at $85, him working at $180 for 35% of the hours was still cheaper (by a good bit) -- and we got a rock solid result. Rates are meaningless until multiplied by hours.
wallflower 13y ago
> EDIT: He completed the iOS application under budget with wonderful tests. If you don't mind me asking, age aside, what tests qualified as wonderful? Coverage? Integration or unit? I am curious. Which framework? Also, was he one of those rare individuals who could make the app UI look beautiful on both iOS and Android?
- MetaCosm 13y ago
  Tests: Two tier, he used an tool we ended up buying for the UI testing (actual phone automation, cool stuff, trying to remember company name), and full unit test with deep (not 100% coverage). UI was presetup by a designer, so he didn't have much choice in that, but he implemented it pixel perfect. No idea on Android, he was only doing iOS for us.
  - wallflower 13y ago
    Thanks, that is a helpful answer.
    - MetaCosm 13y ago
      http://www.testplant.com/products/eggplant/mobile/ http://www.testplant.com/products/eggplant/mobile/ was the testing platform for mobile. (I think it had a different name a few years ago, but could just be my fuzzy recollection)

zerr 13y ago

I really wonder at what rates one might work at these ages.

ihsw 13y ago
At that age the rates are irrelevant compared to the health insurance compensation. Most people at that age would be willing to take a pay cut in exchange for generous health benefits and flexible hours.
- jarek 13y ago
  I must have missed the part where MetaCosm stated his developer was buying health insurance in an age-discriminating market.
  - MetaCosm 13y ago
    He was in the US (Arizona if I remember correctly), and had been incorporated for a number of years... but I have no idea about his health care situation... the joy of contractors, I don't have to care. I give him $180 an hour for X hours, he gives me a wonderful product, everyone goes home happy.
    - rbanffy 13y ago
      > the joy of contractors, I don't have to care. Not really. If the contractor gets sick, it's still your problem. I care for my contractors and always make sure they are paid enough to afford good medical care and a stable financial situation. It makes sense, even from a deeply selfish point of view - the less time they spend worrying about such things, the more they spend working.
      - MetaCosm 13y ago
        First of all, I don't think it is my responsibility to ensure contractors are paid X, that is their responsibility, they set the rate. I decide if I think their skills match their rate. I can't decide what is "good" medical care for them, nor can I decide how much it costs (maybe he has a medical condition and needs 20k a month just for insurance). I can't decide what a stable financial situation is for someone either. The arrogance of someone who thinks they can baffles me. I might think 200k is plenty, but I have no idea about what contractor X consider "plenty" and to assume is simply projecting. As for him being my problem. If a contractor can't work, you replace them, depending on how the contract was setup, you might collect some insurance to help get over the ugly transition.
        rbanffy 13y ago
        Even if it's not your responsibility, it's your problem. Replacing a contractor is not like replacing a cog in a machine. As for deciding what's enough for a stable financial condition, I can't. What you I do, as a manager is to pay attention for warning signs. Years ago, I had a programmer, young and very bright, who kept entering lousy freelance projects on the side. He was under great pressure because he had financial problems. I didn't want to lose him, but burnout was already on the horizon. When performance review time came, I enrolled him on a personal finance course. Within six months, the freelance jobs went away, he started coming in earlier and the already good quality of his work improved further. He had more time to study, more time for his family and more attention for his work.
MetaCosm 13y ago
He was relatively expensive, $180 an hour. But his estimate was about 40% duration versus other ones, and he delivered quicker than expected. Probably closer to 35%. So, while a lot of the bids we got were at $85, him working at $180 for 35% of the hours was still cheaper (by a good bit) -- and we got a rock solid result. Rates are meaningless until multiplied by hours.

wallflower 13y ago

> EDIT: He completed the iOS application under budget with wonderful tests. If you don't mind me asking, age aside, what tests qualified as wonderful? Coverage? Integration or unit? I am curious. Which framework? Also, was he one of those rare individuals who could make the app UI look beautiful on both iOS and Android?

MetaCosm 13y ago
Tests: Two tier, he used an tool we ended up buying for the UI testing (actual phone automation, cool stuff, trying to remember company name), and full unit test with deep (not 100% coverage). UI was presetup by a designer, so he didn't have much choice in that, but he implemented it pixel perfect. No idea on Android, he was only doing iOS for us.
- wallflower 13y ago
  Thanks, that is a helpful answer.
  - MetaCosm 13y ago
    http://www.testplant.com/products/eggplant/mobile/ http://www.testplant.com/products/eggplant/mobile/ was the testing platform for mobile. (I think it had a different name a few years ago, but could just be my fuzzy recollection)