4 ms·

> Graffiti is reported to cost Deutsche Bahn about 7.6m euros (£6.5m; $10m) a year. or leave it alone and it will cost you close to zero and still look better.

by zalew 13y ago

> Graffiti is reported to cost Deutsche Bahn about 7.6m euros (£6.5m; $10m) a year. or leave it alone and it will cost you close to zero and still look better. wholecars ara PITA for travellers so windows need to get cleaned, but I thought that vandal squad hysteria after the 90s graffiti boom has ended. I guess somebody needs to pump up their budget requirements.

nuttendorfer 13y ago
No there are few few pieces that would deserve to stay on. Most isn't more than ugly names (at least not tags). But what I hate most is when they cover the windows, seriously?
- zalew 13y ago
  yeah, I just added the bit about wholecars. well, I don't believe graffiti is a bigger "problem" now than in the 90s when it spread as a subcultural phenomenon around Europe (just like in the 70s-80s in the US). I remember how I was amazed at how Berlin looked back in the day. Warsaw trains are also 'clean' now. I sincerely believe it's an excuse for some political experiments with drones, than fighting graffiti.
- cmsd2 13y ago
  DB could supply free masking tape and plastic sheeting to cover the windows while the artists work. Why not go further and put up the train carriage specs/dimensions in an easy to use template online, so you can lay out your design in advance to take account of the windows. Going any further like sponsoring chosen designs might backfire because then it all gets viewed as too commercial, and we'll get people defacing the corporate graffiti.
  - zalew 13y ago
    > Why not go further and put up the train carriage specs/dimensions in an easy to use template online, so you can lay out your design in advance to take account of the windows. such stuff has been available in graffiti shops for decades :) but a little hint: nobody cares about windows :) > Going any further like sponsoring chosen designs might backfire because then it all gets viewed as too commercial, and we'll get people defacing the corporate graffiti. yes. google for 'adisux', an Adidas' Warsaw fiasco when they covered part of the horse racing track wall (longest graffiti gallery in Europe) for an ad and got trashed to the point the scandal got to tv, their pr firm got into panic mode for a week and in general, how to say it, their marketing campaign didn't work out.
  - mseebach 13y ago
    Here's the thing: The trains have already been decorated by artists that have laid out their designs in a way that takes account of the windows. When those design were applied, the windows were covered by masking tape and plastic sheeting provided by DB. In fact, the trains were taken out of service and placed in a depot for the application of the artwork. Pretty awesome, huh?
- nwh 13y ago
  To this end, trains in Melbourne won't even run if there is graffiti on any surface. Creates some incredible delays, but people have all but stopped touching public trains here due to it.
  - probably_wrong 13y ago
    If I'm not mistaken, neither will German trains.
mih 13y ago
This might change your mind http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=_gLrwaXfeLg http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=_gLrwaXfeLg. While the problem is definitely less nowadays, the difficult to reach places where graffiti appears around German stations sometimes makes you appreciate how much motivation and effort the artists(?) must have.
- qb45 13y ago
  This was quite bad and IMO it shows that they have some bigger problem that surveillance isn't going to solve.
- odiroot 13y ago
  This is really painful to watch. Stupidity like this saddens me. Hope they'll figure out how to catch these people or at least teach them a lesson.
  - probably_wrong 13y ago
    > Stupidity like this saddens me Then here's something a little sadder: this guys are more or less considered heroes. I've never seen the video, but I've heard the story from a tourist guide, who made it clear that this was an awesome stunt that should be admired. Then again, keep in mind that Berlin has a rather complicated story with Graffiti (the city owes a lot to its starving artists), so the Western point of view is not the only one to keep in consideration.
    - odiroot 13y ago
      Well, I'm from the eastern bloc and we have (had?) similar problems in Poland. Though I doubt anyone here would glorify or even excuse these guys. Really thought vandalism is rare and less tolerated west of us.
- zalew 13y ago
  > http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=_gLrwaXfeLg http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=_gLrwaXfeLg. this one's better http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=AMuEagQbk9k http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=AMuEagQbk9k
mseebach 13y ago
Having a bottle of spray paint isn't a license to decide what other people's property should look like. Deutsche Bahn, and I wouldn't be surprised if a huge majority of their customers agrees with them, thinks trains should look in the way they've painted the trains to look.
the_mitsuhiko 13y ago
How exactly does Graffiti look better than a clean train or wall?
- coldtea 13y ago
  Are you kidding me? We're not talking painting the Guggenheim or the Parthenon here. Have you even seen the kind of buildings that get painted? Clean wall: http://4.bp.blogspot.com/_sIjqDD2mNLA/TUaraGIrWsI/AAAAAAAACiw/QPptzQGyzgo/s1600/615px-Nestinghouse_003.jpg http://4.bp.blogspot.com/_sIjqDD2mNLA/TUaraGIrWsI/AAAAAAAACi... Graffiti: http://photos1.blogger.com/blogger/5509/979/1600/graffiti_pop_art_building.jpg http://photos1.blogger.com/blogger/5509/979/1600/graffiti_po... http://cdn4.vtourist.com/4/4851534-Graffiti_Building_Amsterdam.jpg http://cdn4.vtourist.com/4/4851534-Graffiti_Building_Amsterd... http://2.bp.blogspot.com/_NC_JoI7fecY/S4EFOrE4ISI/AAAAAAAABYg/72Uj-_Jm3Ok/s400/GRAFFITI+BUILDING.JPG http://2.bp.blogspot.com/_NC_JoI7fecY/S4EFOrE4ISI/AAAAAAAABY... http://ih1.redbubble.net/image.11426410.1185/flat,550x550,075,f.jpg http://ih1.redbubble.net/image.11426410.1185/flat,550x550,07...

by zalew 13y ago

nuttendorfer 13y ago

No there are few few pieces that would deserve to stay on. Most isn't more than ugly names (at least not tags). But what I hate most is when they cover the windows, seriously?

zalew 13y ago
yeah, I just added the bit about wholecars. well, I don't believe graffiti is a bigger "problem" now than in the 90s when it spread as a subcultural phenomenon around Europe (just like in the 70s-80s in the US). I remember how I was amazed at how Berlin looked back in the day. Warsaw trains are also 'clean' now. I sincerely believe it's an excuse for some political experiments with drones, than fighting graffiti.
cmsd2 13y ago
DB could supply free masking tape and plastic sheeting to cover the windows while the artists work. Why not go further and put up the train carriage specs/dimensions in an easy to use template online, so you can lay out your design in advance to take account of the windows. Going any further like sponsoring chosen designs might backfire because then it all gets viewed as too commercial, and we'll get people defacing the corporate graffiti.
- zalew 13y ago
  > Why not go further and put up the train carriage specs/dimensions in an easy to use template online, so you can lay out your design in advance to take account of the windows. such stuff has been available in graffiti shops for decades :) but a little hint: nobody cares about windows :) > Going any further like sponsoring chosen designs might backfire because then it all gets viewed as too commercial, and we'll get people defacing the corporate graffiti. yes. google for 'adisux', an Adidas' Warsaw fiasco when they covered part of the horse racing track wall (longest graffiti gallery in Europe) for an ad and got trashed to the point the scandal got to tv, their pr firm got into panic mode for a week and in general, how to say it, their marketing campaign didn't work out.
- mseebach 13y ago
  Here's the thing: The trains have already been decorated by artists that have laid out their designs in a way that takes account of the windows. When those design were applied, the windows were covered by masking tape and plastic sheeting provided by DB. In fact, the trains were taken out of service and placed in a depot for the application of the artwork. Pretty awesome, huh?
nwh 13y ago
To this end, trains in Melbourne won't even run if there is graffiti on any surface. Creates some incredible delays, but people have all but stopped touching public trains here due to it.
- probably_wrong 13y ago
  If I'm not mistaken, neither will German trains.

mih 13y ago

This might change your mind http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=_gLrwaXfeLg http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=_gLrwaXfeLg. While the problem is definitely less nowadays, the difficult to reach places where graffiti appears around German stations sometimes makes you appreciate how much motivation and effort the artists(?) must have.

qb45 13y ago
This was quite bad and IMO it shows that they have some bigger problem that surveillance isn't going to solve.
odiroot 13y ago
This is really painful to watch. Stupidity like this saddens me. Hope they'll figure out how to catch these people or at least teach them a lesson.
- probably_wrong 13y ago
  > Stupidity like this saddens me Then here's something a little sadder: this guys are more or less considered heroes. I've never seen the video, but I've heard the story from a tourist guide, who made it clear that this was an awesome stunt that should be admired. Then again, keep in mind that Berlin has a rather complicated story with Graffiti (the city owes a lot to its starving artists), so the Western point of view is not the only one to keep in consideration.
  - odiroot 13y ago
    Well, I'm from the eastern bloc and we have (had?) similar problems in Poland. Though I doubt anyone here would glorify or even excuse these guys. Really thought vandalism is rare and less tolerated west of us.
zalew 13y ago
> http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=_gLrwaXfeLg http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=_gLrwaXfeLg. this one's better http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=AMuEagQbk9k http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=AMuEagQbk9k

mseebach 13y ago

Having a bottle of spray paint isn't a license to decide what other people's property should look like. Deutsche Bahn, and I wouldn't be surprised if a huge majority of their customers agrees with them, thinks trains should look in the way they've painted the trains to look.

the_mitsuhiko 13y ago

How exactly does Graffiti look better than a clean train or wall?

coldtea 13y ago
Are you kidding me? We're not talking painting the Guggenheim or the Parthenon here. Have you even seen the kind of buildings that get painted? Clean wall: http://4.bp.blogspot.com/_sIjqDD2mNLA/TUaraGIrWsI/AAAAAAAACiw/QPptzQGyzgo/s1600/615px-Nestinghouse_003.jpg http://4.bp.blogspot.com/_sIjqDD2mNLA/TUaraGIrWsI/AAAAAAAACi... Graffiti: http://photos1.blogger.com/blogger/5509/979/1600/graffiti_pop_art_building.jpg http://photos1.blogger.com/blogger/5509/979/1600/graffiti_po... http://cdn4.vtourist.com/4/4851534-Graffiti_Building_Amsterdam.jpg http://cdn4.vtourist.com/4/4851534-Graffiti_Building_Amsterd... http://2.bp.blogspot.com/_NC_JoI7fecY/S4EFOrE4ISI/AAAAAAAABYg/72Uj-_Jm3Ok/s400/GRAFFITI+BUILDING.JPG http://2.bp.blogspot.com/_NC_JoI7fecY/S4EFOrE4ISI/AAAAAAAABY... http://ih1.redbubble.net/image.11426410.1185/flat,550x550,075,f.jpg http://ih1.redbubble.net/image.11426410.1185/flat,550x550,07...