3 ms·

DVRs were supposed to undermine television. They have done the opposite

24 points by HSO 18y ago

mbrubeck 18y ago
Funny they don't mention that the exact same arguments were made about the VCR in the 1980s.
amalcon 18y ago
There's another factor that the article doesn't mention explicitly: DVRs erode some of the benefits of pirating TV shows. People pirate TV shows (that are available on air where they live) largely because they want to watch them when they want, they want to be able to pause when they need to, and they don't want to sit through five minute blocks of the same advertisements they've seen three times already in the program. I suspect Hulu exists because someone noticed this and wanted to erode more of said benefits.
- rythie 18y ago
  Essentially their approach is to make something good enough that is legal to prevent the illegal method taking hold. The music industry could have done with getting that 10 years ago.
  - blhack 18y ago
    The music industry is doing a pretty good job of that right now. It has gotten to the point, for me, that I wouldn't even know where to go to bootleg music anymore. With things like imeem or pandora, I don't need to. In fact, there was an album I wanted a week or so ago; I had to ask one of my little sisters what was the current tool that people were using to get music (she is in high school). Not wanting to jump through hoops (the website she linked me to was basically a front-end of ? intitle:index.of on google, I fucking loathe peerguardian and didn't feel like renewing my usenet subscription), I just bought the album on iTunes, ran it through qtfairuse (you'll need to downgrade to itunes V6 to do it) and called it good. They really are starting to figure it out. If you want an example, go to whitelabel.net. It is a tool for DJs to freely download new tracks (and sometimes albums) before they hit store shelves. There are no intrusive sign-up proceedures, just a username/password form, and a download page. That said, I believe that the RIAA is going to be going away very soon (the arm of it that it suing people, not th arm of it that regulates audio standards...kindof like the IEEE). The "temple" studio model is all but dead. The cost of entry into the music production world has gotten to a point that the small, studio next to your favorite bar (if you're in tempe az, you know what I'm talking about) is cranking out music that is on par with the stuff that the megacorp is.
rythie 18y ago
I figure either DVD players or probably DVRs will soon connect to the internet to play flash content there. I currently use my Wii to connect to BBC iPlayer but it only has Flash 7 which limits it's use. What could be disruptive about that is if content companies sell their content directly cutting out the TV network middle man.
frossie 18y ago
"Families with DVRs seem to spend 15-20% of their viewing time watching pre-recorded shows, and skip only about half of all advertisements. This means only about 5% of television is time-shifted and less than 3% of all advertisements are skipped." I boggle. We never, ever watch live TV under normal circumstances (barring election nights, 9/11, and so on), and the only time ads aren't skipped is when there is nobody in the room to skip them (or watch them). Even with high-interest sporting events broadcast live we start watching half an hour late so that we can skip the ads. I am at loss to explain those numbers. Edit: good point below. We have a Dish DVR, and it really is very well done useability-wise.
- James125 18y ago
  Having used both a Tivo and a Comcast Cable DVR, I'm sure the poor numbers have to do with usability. It sounds cool to have a DVR and for $5 a month the cable company makes it easy. The cable company DVR experience is painful at best. Most commonly it is frustrating and difficult to use, not including the trust that a DVR must earn before you let it time shift your favorite shows. Using Tivo for the past 4+ years I shudder when I use a cable company DVR.
gojomo 18y ago
I'm surprised at the (Turner Broadcasting-supplied) stats on DVR usage. Since I got a TiVo, watching 'live' TV has become practically intolerable. Even when I want to see something ASAP, I'll do something else for 15-20 minutes to get enough of a buffer I can skip all commercials.

24 points by HSO 18y ago

Funny they don't mention that the exact same arguments were made about the VCR in the 1980s.

There's another factor that the article doesn't mention explicitly: DVRs erode some of the benefits of pirating TV shows. People pirate TV shows (that are available on air where they live) largely because they want to watch them when they want, they want to be able to pause when they need to, and they don't want to sit through five minute blocks of the same advertisements they've seen three times already in the program. I suspect Hulu exists because someone noticed this and wanted to erode more of said benefits.

rythie 18y ago
Essentially their approach is to make something good enough that is legal to prevent the illegal method taking hold. The music industry could have done with getting that 10 years ago.
- blhack 18y ago
  The music industry is doing a pretty good job of that right now. It has gotten to the point, for me, that I wouldn't even know where to go to bootleg music anymore. With things like imeem or pandora, I don't need to. In fact, there was an album I wanted a week or so ago; I had to ask one of my little sisters what was the current tool that people were using to get music (she is in high school). Not wanting to jump through hoops (the website she linked me to was basically a front-end of ? intitle:index.of on google, I fucking loathe peerguardian and didn't feel like renewing my usenet subscription), I just bought the album on iTunes, ran it through qtfairuse (you'll need to downgrade to itunes V6 to do it) and called it good. They really are starting to figure it out. If you want an example, go to whitelabel.net. It is a tool for DJs to freely download new tracks (and sometimes albums) before they hit store shelves. There are no intrusive sign-up proceedures, just a username/password form, and a download page. That said, I believe that the RIAA is going to be going away very soon (the arm of it that it suing people, not th arm of it that regulates audio standards...kindof like the IEEE). The "temple" studio model is all but dead. The cost of entry into the music production world has gotten to a point that the small, studio next to your favorite bar (if you're in tempe az, you know what I'm talking about) is cranking out music that is on par with the stuff that the megacorp is.

rythie 18y ago

I figure either DVD players or probably DVRs will soon connect to the internet to play flash content there. I currently use my Wii to connect to BBC iPlayer but it only has Flash 7 which limits it's use. What could be disruptive about that is if content companies sell their content directly cutting out the TV network middle man.

frossie 18y ago

"Families with DVRs seem to spend 15-20% of their viewing time watching pre-recorded shows, and skip only about half of all advertisements. This means only about 5% of television is time-shifted and less than 3% of all advertisements are skipped." I boggle. We never, ever watch live TV under normal circumstances (barring election nights, 9/11, and so on), and the only time ads aren't skipped is when there is nobody in the room to skip them (or watch them). Even with high-interest sporting events broadcast live we start watching half an hour late so that we can skip the ads. I am at loss to explain those numbers. Edit: good point below. We have a Dish DVR, and it really is very well done useability-wise.

James125 18y ago
Having used both a Tivo and a Comcast Cable DVR, I'm sure the poor numbers have to do with usability. It sounds cool to have a DVR and for $5 a month the cable company makes it easy. The cable company DVR experience is painful at best. Most commonly it is frustrating and difficult to use, not including the trust that a DVR must earn before you let it time shift your favorite shows. Using Tivo for the past 4+ years I shudder when I use a cable company DVR.

gojomo 18y ago

I'm surprised at the (Turner Broadcasting-supplied) stats on DVR usage. Since I got a TiVo, watching 'live' TV has become practically intolerable. Even when I want to see something ASAP, I'll do something else for 15-20 minutes to get enough of a buffer I can skip all commercials.