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As a former contract web developer myself, these are excellent points Trevor. You need to find a way for every potential client for every freelancer out there

by timjahn 13y ago

As a former contract web developer myself, these are excellent points Trevor. You need to find a way for every potential client for every freelancer out there to read this. :) Actionable feedback is so key for working with creative talent in general - we can't read your mind! We actually built some of these ideas into the core of matchist (http://matchist.com/talent http://matchist.com/talent). Specifically, milestones and paying your developer quickly. All projects on matchist are milestone based and the client can pay developers in 2 seconds by just clicking a button.

trevmckendrick 13y ago
Thanks Tim. It's too true that people assume because they're paying they can be lazy and assume the contractor will handle every little detail. Of course not everyone's that way, but you sure can make friends much faster by treating your contractors well.
robmclarty 13y ago
I can't count the number of times a client has asked me something like "I want my website to be more dynamic. How much would you charge?" I don't know! Why does anyone expect a specific answer to a non-specific question? This usually turns into multiple back-and-forths to flesh out what the client really needs, and usually requires a lot of thinking on the developer's part (me) to nail down an actionable solution that could potentially be estimated in terms of $$$. I was hesitant reading Trevor's article thinking what he was suggesting was devaluing dev work, but when he emphasized the importance of specificity I was on board with him. If a client has fully thought out their idea to the point of step by step mockups, that takes a LOT of the pain, frustration, and effort out of the equation which translates to the required work not costing as much. Developers are one step away from computers (literally) and require a lot of the same rigour when interacting with them. Know what you want and be able to explain what you want (in detail) before engaging them ;)
- trevmckendrick 13y ago
  "Developers are one step away from computers (literally) and require a lot of the same rigour when interacting with them." Great point. Most people are not used to the level of specificity required to be a developer.
- auctiontheory 13y ago
  Why does anyone expect a specific answer to a non-specific question? The more you can learn to help the client work through ambiguity, rather than expect the client to match your technical understanding and then be frustrated when they don't, the more successful you will be.
  - beat 13y ago
    Ultimately, software is about getting specific answers to non-specific questions.
    - ptaipale 13y ago
      Absolutely, but that's more than just coding.
  - robmclarty 13y ago
    Granted, that goes with the territory of being in the service business. My gripe is that clients expect to pay for "just the coding" rather than the entire process of discovery, consultation, and strategy + coding.
  - marknow 13y ago
    "The more you can learn to help the client work through ambiguity..." This assistance implies expertise beyond just being a code monkey; higher-level thinking and problem-solving should definitely come at a higher price.

by timjahn 13y ago

trevmckendrick 13y ago

Thanks Tim. It's too true that people assume because they're paying they can be lazy and assume the contractor will handle every little detail. Of course not everyone's that way, but you sure can make friends much faster by treating your contractors well.

robmclarty 13y ago

I can't count the number of times a client has asked me something like "I want my website to be more dynamic. How much would you charge?" I don't know! Why does anyone expect a specific answer to a non-specific question? This usually turns into multiple back-and-forths to flesh out what the client really needs, and usually requires a lot of thinking on the developer's part (me) to nail down an actionable solution that could potentially be estimated in terms of $$$. I was hesitant reading Trevor's article thinking what he was suggesting was devaluing dev work, but when he emphasized the importance of specificity I was on board with him. If a client has fully thought out their idea to the point of step by step mockups, that takes a LOT of the pain, frustration, and effort out of the equation which translates to the required work not costing as much. Developers are one step away from computers (literally) and require a lot of the same rigour when interacting with them. Know what you want and be able to explain what you want (in detail) before engaging them ;)

trevmckendrick 13y ago
"Developers are one step away from computers (literally) and require a lot of the same rigour when interacting with them." Great point. Most people are not used to the level of specificity required to be a developer.
auctiontheory 13y ago
Why does anyone expect a specific answer to a non-specific question? The more you can learn to help the client work through ambiguity, rather than expect the client to match your technical understanding and then be frustrated when they don't, the more successful you will be.
- beat 13y ago
  Ultimately, software is about getting specific answers to non-specific questions.
  - ptaipale 13y ago
    Absolutely, but that's more than just coding.
- robmclarty 13y ago
  Granted, that goes with the territory of being in the service business. My gripe is that clients expect to pay for "just the coding" rather than the entire process of discovery, consultation, and strategy + coding.
- marknow 13y ago
  "The more you can learn to help the client work through ambiguity..." This assistance implies expertise beyond just being a code monkey; higher-level thinking and problem-solving should definitely come at a higher price.