5 ms·

You seem to know much more about this situation than me, but given my experience in the left, I would be very surprised if the people involved in an open air dr

You seem to know much more about this situation than me, but given my experience in the left, I would be very surprised if the people involved in an open air drug den had much to do with the people attending and organizing this protest. And there seems to be a discrepancy between the extreme danger you claim I would be in, and the claims of other people that this is a harmless gathering. Can you shed some light on this? No sarcasm intended there, I really am surprised by how you characterize the situation because in my experience, no one provoking left wingers is ever in serious danger.

potatolicious 13y ago
These aren't left wingers in the liberal left winger sense. Practically everyone in San Francisco is a liberal left winger. These are militant left wingers (the photos of the event seem to suggest this, based on my experiences in the neighborhood). I would not be surprised if there were more than a few violent folks in the crowd. Keep in mind what happened the last time there was an anti-gentrification protest in the Mission. Ostensibly it's a peaceful gathering to march against gentrification. It turned into smashing windows of local independent businesses and massive vandalism. Every leftist protest or demonstration in San Francisco seems to have a bad habit of turning violent. This isn't to say that everyone there is violent, or that their cause isn't worthwhile, but rather that if you see these marches or protests, the Black Bloc is always close at hand, so I'd watch right the fuck out. > "I would be very surprised if the people involved in an open air drug den had much to do with the people attending and organizing this protest." There's not much of an intersection. The whole open-air drug den thing isn't to associate the protesters with the crackheads of the neighborhood, but rather to say that this isn't like any street corner in San Francisco. This is a street corner that the police effectively have no control over. If you get jumped by a Black Bloc asshole with a bone to pick with Googlers, you are fending for yourself. Though, reading the article, it looks like the cops were on hand for this one, which is a nice change for the corner of 16th and Mission. All in all, don't be so cavalier with your own safety. While San Francisco isn't ruled by the Khmer Rouge, the Mission is not a safe neighborhood. Don't let the bistros and boutique coffee shops fool you. If you mind your own business you'll be fine. If you go looking for trouble, the Mission has no problem delivering trouble to your face, fast.
- mc-lovin 13y ago
  You make some good points, and I will bear them in mind when dealing with these people. However, what you say makes the complaints by the protesters about the heavy police presence seem ridiculous: it cannot be the case that this protest is "peaceful" and yet anyone present who appears to be against hem would be in serious danger.
  - potatolicious 13y ago
    Even disregarding the personal danger aspect, the police presence is well justified simply by looking at similar protests in the past. A bunch of people rallying around hating another group of people is, following San Francisco patterns, highly likely to result in violence, property destruction, vandalism, or some combination of the above. I feel very much that the Black Bloc and anarchist protesters that infest every cause and protest in San Francisco is a huge part of why the city is the way it is. Otherwise legitimate, worthwhile causes can garner no public support because a highly visible minority of their base takes every chance they get to smash shit up. They become politically untenable to support for city politicians lest they look like they are soft on crime - because protesting is synonymous with crime thanks to these people. They also drive away moderates as no one really wants to be caught on the wrong side of a riot (is there a right side to being in a riot?).
- gruseom 13y ago
  I lived in the Mission for many years and I find your description overwrought.
  - tptacek 13y ago
    Really? When did you live in SF?

potatolicious 13y ago

These aren't left wingers in the liberal left winger sense. Practically everyone in San Francisco is a liberal left winger. These are militant left wingers (the photos of the event seem to suggest this, based on my experiences in the neighborhood). I would not be surprised if there were more than a few violent folks in the crowd. Keep in mind what happened the last time there was an anti-gentrification protest in the Mission. Ostensibly it's a peaceful gathering to march against gentrification. It turned into smashing windows of local independent businesses and massive vandalism. Every leftist protest or demonstration in San Francisco seems to have a bad habit of turning violent. This isn't to say that everyone there is violent, or that their cause isn't worthwhile, but rather that if you see these marches or protests, the Black Bloc is always close at hand, so I'd watch right the fuck out. > "I would be very surprised if the people involved in an open air drug den had much to do with the people attending and organizing this protest." There's not much of an intersection. The whole open-air drug den thing isn't to associate the protesters with the crackheads of the neighborhood, but rather to say that this isn't like any street corner in San Francisco. This is a street corner that the police effectively have no control over. If you get jumped by a Black Bloc asshole with a bone to pick with Googlers, you are fending for yourself. Though, reading the article, it looks like the cops were on hand for this one, which is a nice change for the corner of 16th and Mission. All in all, don't be so cavalier with your own safety. While San Francisco isn't ruled by the Khmer Rouge, the Mission is not a safe neighborhood. Don't let the bistros and boutique coffee shops fool you. If you mind your own business you'll be fine. If you go looking for trouble, the Mission has no problem delivering trouble to your face, fast.

mc-lovin 13y ago
You make some good points, and I will bear them in mind when dealing with these people. However, what you say makes the complaints by the protesters about the heavy police presence seem ridiculous: it cannot be the case that this protest is "peaceful" and yet anyone present who appears to be against hem would be in serious danger.
- potatolicious 13y ago
  Even disregarding the personal danger aspect, the police presence is well justified simply by looking at similar protests in the past. A bunch of people rallying around hating another group of people is, following San Francisco patterns, highly likely to result in violence, property destruction, vandalism, or some combination of the above. I feel very much that the Black Bloc and anarchist protesters that infest every cause and protest in San Francisco is a huge part of why the city is the way it is. Otherwise legitimate, worthwhile causes can garner no public support because a highly visible minority of their base takes every chance they get to smash shit up. They become politically untenable to support for city politicians lest they look like they are soft on crime - because protesting is synonymous with crime thanks to these people. They also drive away moderates as no one really wants to be caught on the wrong side of a riot (is there a right side to being in a riot?).
gruseom 13y ago
I lived in the Mission for many years and I find your description overwrought.
- tptacek 13y ago
  Really? When did you live in SF?