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We had exactly the same frustrations with online outsourcing (being on both sides of the table), and now we have built https://codeable.io https://codeable.io (

by tzaman 13y ago

We had exactly the same frustrations with online outsourcing (being on both sides of the table), and now we have built https://codeable.io https://codeable.io (focused only on WordPress for the time being) - 4 months after launch, we have more than 900 jobs posted, half of them completed, excellent reviews, more than $45k in revenue. I'm very proud of what we achieved so far, because we eliminated the biggest "pains" of online outsourcing; There is no bidding, our (invited and reviewed) contractors form a single estimate which is then presented to the client. And we focus on sub-$500 tasks, because the margin for error is significantly smaller, so if a client comes in with a huge job, we help him break it down into smaller pieces. We also maintain client/contractor ratio, so there is no need for contractors to compete with one another, anyone who wants to work, can work.

jpdoctor 13y ago
> so there is no need for contractors to compete with one another Why would buyers desire this?
- tzaman 13y ago
  Because first and foremost, we want to keep contractors happy. If they are paid well (by well I don't mean ripping clients off), they will come back and perform more work. Our long-term goal is to establish a trusted network of developers that always go that extra mile to satisfy clients - I must admit, so far, this approach has paid off in dividends. We're currently re-designing the landing page, and we will put client testimonials on that prove it.
  - jpdoctor 13y ago
    > and we will put client testimonials on that prove it. I'll be curious to see which client gives you a testimonial that thinks non-competing contractors is a great idea.
    - tzaman 13y ago
      Each and every, in fact. Because they don't come to us to see how (or not) our system works but to get their problems fixed in time, and by a top quality expert. (I'm saying this because we do a lot of research on both sides, and transparency is part of our business, so all involved know how the system works)
      - jpdoctor 13y ago
        > Because they don't come to us to see how (or not) our system works but to get their problems fixed in time, and by a top quality expert. I notice the word "price" is not present in that testimonial.
    - klibertp 13y ago
      Do you think that darwinian fight of everyone with everyone else is the best possible way to finding cost-effective solutions?
- illumen 13y ago
  No need to waste a week weeding through bids, when the whole job could be done by then. Outsourcing is supposed to save you time, bidding wastes your valuable time.
  - jpdoctor 13y ago
    > bidding wastes your valuable time. Why does it waste more of my time in this bidding process than any other aspect of the marketplace? It's how you minimize costs, and any smart seller that realizes you're not going through the bidding process jacks up the price to milk you for all you're worth.
    - jtbigwoo 13y ago
      > It's how you minimize costs, and any smart seller that realizes you're not going through the bidding process jacks up the price to milk you for all you're worth. Honestly, I rarely get more than one or two bids when I'm looking for someone to work for me. I've been around long enough to have built relationships with vendors for various tasks. I know about how much I expect something to cost and if the bid comes in significantly higher or lower then the vendor and I talk it over and negotiate either a lower price or a changed scope. They don't jack up the price because the cost to acquire customers is very high. I'm guessing I saved 100 hours last year by not putting every last task out for bid.
    - tzaman 13y ago
      Bidding is the best way to get rid of the best contractors, because most of them won't want to invest significant time to compete with others for the jobs, so what you're left with are the most desperate or mediocre ones. And even those will realize in long-term that it's just not worth their time or either leave or perform poorly. So in my experience, bidding doesn't do any good, to either party.
- pi18n 13y ago
  One benefit may be that contractors won't be in a race to the bottom, so they won't feel like they should half-ass it. On one of the other websites, they seem to want to install a spyware on your computer so the employers can see what you are doing at any given moment. I doubt a great coder would put up with that (I'm merely good and I wouldn't) and the odds of finding one there are lower. On the other hand, I think a great coder would be more likely to freelance on a site that has consistent work which they don't need to fight over. So that's my speculation.
  - tzaman 13y ago
    Your speculation explains it perfectly!
  - jpdoctor 13y ago
    > One benefit may be that contractors won't be in a race to the bottom It's obviously of benefit to the contractors, I meant the other side of the transaction.
    - pi18n 13y ago
      I explained it further, if you had bothered to read the rest of the comment; that sort of thing may attract higher-quality developers.

by tzaman 13y ago

jpdoctor 13y ago

> so there is no need for contractors to compete with one another Why would buyers desire this?

tzaman 13y ago
Because first and foremost, we want to keep contractors happy. If they are paid well (by well I don't mean ripping clients off), they will come back and perform more work. Our long-term goal is to establish a trusted network of developers that always go that extra mile to satisfy clients - I must admit, so far, this approach has paid off in dividends. We're currently re-designing the landing page, and we will put client testimonials on that prove it.
- jpdoctor 13y ago
  > and we will put client testimonials on that prove it. I'll be curious to see which client gives you a testimonial that thinks non-competing contractors is a great idea.
  - tzaman 13y ago
    Each and every, in fact. Because they don't come to us to see how (or not) our system works but to get their problems fixed in time, and by a top quality expert. (I'm saying this because we do a lot of research on both sides, and transparency is part of our business, so all involved know how the system works)
    - jpdoctor 13y ago
      > Because they don't come to us to see how (or not) our system works but to get their problems fixed in time, and by a top quality expert. I notice the word "price" is not present in that testimonial.
  - klibertp 13y ago
    Do you think that darwinian fight of everyone with everyone else is the best possible way to finding cost-effective solutions?
illumen 13y ago
No need to waste a week weeding through bids, when the whole job could be done by then. Outsourcing is supposed to save you time, bidding wastes your valuable time.
- jpdoctor 13y ago
  > bidding wastes your valuable time. Why does it waste more of my time in this bidding process than any other aspect of the marketplace? It's how you minimize costs, and any smart seller that realizes you're not going through the bidding process jacks up the price to milk you for all you're worth.
  - jtbigwoo 13y ago
    > It's how you minimize costs, and any smart seller that realizes you're not going through the bidding process jacks up the price to milk you for all you're worth. Honestly, I rarely get more than one or two bids when I'm looking for someone to work for me. I've been around long enough to have built relationships with vendors for various tasks. I know about how much I expect something to cost and if the bid comes in significantly higher or lower then the vendor and I talk it over and negotiate either a lower price or a changed scope. They don't jack up the price because the cost to acquire customers is very high. I'm guessing I saved 100 hours last year by not putting every last task out for bid.
  - tzaman 13y ago
    Bidding is the best way to get rid of the best contractors, because most of them won't want to invest significant time to compete with others for the jobs, so what you're left with are the most desperate or mediocre ones. And even those will realize in long-term that it's just not worth their time or either leave or perform poorly. So in my experience, bidding doesn't do any good, to either party.
pi18n 13y ago
One benefit may be that contractors won't be in a race to the bottom, so they won't feel like they should half-ass it. On one of the other websites, they seem to want to install a spyware on your computer so the employers can see what you are doing at any given moment. I doubt a great coder would put up with that (I'm merely good and I wouldn't) and the odds of finding one there are lower. On the other hand, I think a great coder would be more likely to freelance on a site that has consistent work which they don't need to fight over. So that's my speculation.
- tzaman 13y ago
  Your speculation explains it perfectly!
- jpdoctor 13y ago
  > One benefit may be that contractors won't be in a race to the bottom It's obviously of benefit to the contractors, I meant the other side of the transaction.
  - pi18n 13y ago
    I explained it further, if you had bothered to read the rest of the comment; that sort of thing may attract higher-quality developers.