8 ms·

A good read, for sure. As someone outside of the US, it makes me wonder if Instagram's succes would have been possible if it was a non-US company, or even a sta

A good read, for sure. As someone outside of the US, it makes me wonder if Instagram's succes would have been possible if it was a non-US company, or even a startup outside of California?

crimsonzagar 13y ago
Direct answer: no. Indirect answer: no. The probability is low because guys outside of bay area don't build app to dent anything. They don't aim to build an app that is cool: to them, their friends, their investors, their users, and ultimately their suitors and acquirer. They build it to mint money, which is why this story inspires them too.
- dualogy 13y ago
  Suuure, everyone outside the valley builds apps only for "money minting", not for "cool to everyone". Nice Cali bubble you live in ;D
  - deleted 13y ago
    [deleted]
  - crimsonzagar 13y ago
    Even if an individual tries to do it for coolness, and is passionate about it, the rest of the guys around him are not. And that can be a significant cultural influence. You're living in a bubble, if you can't see that.
- omegant 13y ago
  It also counts that you are in a habitat where having beers with Zuck or being one of the first employees of google or twitter( or just name one..) is easy. If you need a 500000$ seed investment? No problem, I will talk to Andressen and it'll be done in a week.. Of course it's not always like this but SV is the place where this may happen. The biggest difference I notice with other places beyond the easier access to investment (I am from Spain), is that people there has a "can do" attitude that is almost completely missing everywhere else. If you go to Stanford, it is expected from you to go and make something big just because of that. Also there is the glorification of failure as a learning experience. Here in Spain I am seeing lots of good Ideas to start a small bussines or a Start up for almost no money, but even in the middle of the crisis, people who doesn't have a job gives me a blank stare every time I talk about them. They'll just keep looking for a simple job at a big company, as it that is the only possible way. The think that most impacts me of this article is how they get 25000 users the first day. How do you do that?. Is due to having a huge net of early adopters as friends? Edit: twitter spelling!(tweeter...)
  - smackay 13y ago
    The can-do attitude is something to be envied but the dynamism and opportunities available in the Valley and generally in the USA make a big difference. If your big idea doesn't pan out then the (almost) worst case scenario is that you simply go and work for somebody else. I don't think other country's economies are nearly as developed in that respect. In many cases developers are hired on the basis of cost and anything that the might prejudice that in the eyes of managers and employers (for example being a little too dynamic or independently minded) removes a lot of the cushion you have and makes going for the safe, corporate type of job more practical, not necessarily more desirable.
    - brazzy 13y ago
      Don't forget the other side of the coin: that "can do attitude" and that environment can also, if you buy into it too far and don't get lucky, have you broke and homeless. It's partially a gamble, and magazines write articles only about the winners.
      - omegant 13y ago
        I agree with that, but that´s true anywhere in the world. In Spain if your company fails you may be personally liable of the debt. Recently a bank removed 3000€ from my grandmother account because of a debt dated from 1993 of my deceased grandfather´s company. My grandmother is 97 years old, and the funniest part is that debt was settled long ago. Also if you fail nobody is going to trust in you any more, you are done. I know that SV is not the golden city that this articles paint, but it is way ahead when we speak of entrepreneurship and startups.
        brazzy 13y ago
        My point was not so much about SV but about the "can do attitude" - when taken too far it will have you go deeper into debt and chasing pipe dreams rather than cut your losses. It can kill good companies too, if it leads you to ignore risks.
will1000 13y ago
As someone in the US and in California, but !in the bay area and !in rapport with the likes of Marc Andreessen, Jack Dorsey and Mark Zuckerberg, I too wonder if Instagram-like success would be possible for a startup that is not in that position. And if it isn't possible, perhaps the rest of us should think twice about aspiring to that specific type of success.
- logicallee 13y ago
  It's kind of your fault. That's a provocative statement, here's the justification: Instagram had "only" 18 employees. Wherever you are, will1000, hiring 18 employees of the caliber who built Instagram for 18 months would cost you $2M. Instagram was able to pay for them with equity, instesad of starting with $2M in the bank. The direct reason that this doesn't work outside silicon valley is that outside silicon valley you, will1000, will not work for me for equity instead of a market salary. That is only possible in Silicon Valley. In other words, you don't want to believe that a % is worth anything, and that's why you won't accept equity based compensation (outside silicon vallye). look in your heart and you know it's true. what's the lowest salary + equity compensation you would accept? Could instagram have afforded you?
  - jacquesm 13y ago
    > The direct reason that this doesn't work outside silicon valley is that outside silicon valley you, will1000, will not work for me for equity and no salary. That is only possible in Silicon Valley. Right, because only in Silicon Valley will people work for equity and no salary. They live off the air. Explain to me how talented coder 'x' (whoever, maybe will1000) will be able to live without any compensation whatsoever during 18 months. Even in SV that's an exception, not a rule, and even in SV people need to eat. So the more commonly employed scenario is that there is a bit of funding which is made to stretch as far as it will go by compensating key employees with equity rather than salary for some portion of their total package. 0 salary and just equity is an exception.
    - logicallee 13y ago
corford 13y ago
Reading between the lines, it seems the major contributing factors to their success were the connections they had to other ex-Stanford alumni (Zuckerberg himself being one of them), the internship at Twitter and the stint at Google. A more interesting question (at least for me) is: Would Instagram's success have been possible (or that fast) if the founders had not gone to Stanford?
- replicatorblog 13y ago
  Zuckerberg is a gentleman of Harvard! I say good day!
  - corford 13y ago
    Ha good point! I always forget he didn't attend Stanford.

A good read, for sure. As someone outside of the US, it makes me wonder if Instagram's succes would have been possible if it was a non-US company, or even a startup outside of California?

crimsonzagar 13y ago

Direct answer: no. Indirect answer: no. The probability is low because guys outside of bay area don't build app to dent anything. They don't aim to build an app that is cool: to them, their friends, their investors, their users, and ultimately their suitors and acquirer. They build it to mint money, which is why this story inspires them too.

dualogy 13y ago
Suuure, everyone outside the valley builds apps only for "money minting", not for "cool to everyone". Nice Cali bubble you live in ;D
- deleted 13y ago
  [deleted]
- crimsonzagar 13y ago
  Even if an individual tries to do it for coolness, and is passionate about it, the rest of the guys around him are not. And that can be a significant cultural influence. You're living in a bubble, if you can't see that.
omegant 13y ago
It also counts that you are in a habitat where having beers with Zuck or being one of the first employees of google or twitter( or just name one..) is easy. If you need a 500000$ seed investment? No problem, I will talk to Andressen and it'll be done in a week.. Of course it's not always like this but SV is the place where this may happen. The biggest difference I notice with other places beyond the easier access to investment (I am from Spain), is that people there has a "can do" attitude that is almost completely missing everywhere else. If you go to Stanford, it is expected from you to go and make something big just because of that. Also there is the glorification of failure as a learning experience. Here in Spain I am seeing lots of good Ideas to start a small bussines or a Start up for almost no money, but even in the middle of the crisis, people who doesn't have a job gives me a blank stare every time I talk about them. They'll just keep looking for a simple job at a big company, as it that is the only possible way. The think that most impacts me of this article is how they get 25000 users the first day. How do you do that?. Is due to having a huge net of early adopters as friends? Edit: twitter spelling!(tweeter...)
- smackay 13y ago
  The can-do attitude is something to be envied but the dynamism and opportunities available in the Valley and generally in the USA make a big difference. If your big idea doesn't pan out then the (almost) worst case scenario is that you simply go and work for somebody else. I don't think other country's economies are nearly as developed in that respect. In many cases developers are hired on the basis of cost and anything that the might prejudice that in the eyes of managers and employers (for example being a little too dynamic or independently minded) removes a lot of the cushion you have and makes going for the safe, corporate type of job more practical, not necessarily more desirable.
  - brazzy 13y ago
    Don't forget the other side of the coin: that "can do attitude" and that environment can also, if you buy into it too far and don't get lucky, have you broke and homeless. It's partially a gamble, and magazines write articles only about the winners.
    - omegant 13y ago
      I agree with that, but that´s true anywhere in the world. In Spain if your company fails you may be personally liable of the debt. Recently a bank removed 3000€ from my grandmother account because of a debt dated from 1993 of my deceased grandfather´s company. My grandmother is 97 years old, and the funniest part is that debt was settled long ago. Also if you fail nobody is going to trust in you any more, you are done. I know that SV is not the golden city that this articles paint, but it is way ahead when we speak of entrepreneurship and startups.
      - brazzy 13y ago
        My point was not so much about SV but about the "can do attitude" - when taken too far it will have you go deeper into debt and chasing pipe dreams rather than cut your losses. It can kill good companies too, if it leads you to ignore risks.

will1000 13y ago

As someone in the US and in California, but !in the bay area and !in rapport with the likes of Marc Andreessen, Jack Dorsey and Mark Zuckerberg, I too wonder if Instagram-like success would be possible for a startup that is not in that position. And if it isn't possible, perhaps the rest of us should think twice about aspiring to that specific type of success.

logicallee 13y ago
It's kind of your fault. That's a provocative statement, here's the justification: Instagram had "only" 18 employees. Wherever you are, will1000, hiring 18 employees of the caliber who built Instagram for 18 months would cost you $2M. Instagram was able to pay for them with equity, instesad of starting with $2M in the bank. The direct reason that this doesn't work outside silicon valley is that outside silicon valley you, will1000, will not work for me for equity instead of a market salary. That is only possible in Silicon Valley. In other words, you don't want to believe that a % is worth anything, and that's why you won't accept equity based compensation (outside silicon vallye). look in your heart and you know it's true. what's the lowest salary + equity compensation you would accept? Could instagram have afforded you?
- jacquesm 13y ago
  > The direct reason that this doesn't work outside silicon valley is that outside silicon valley you, will1000, will not work for me for equity and no salary. That is only possible in Silicon Valley. Right, because only in Silicon Valley will people work for equity and no salary. They live off the air. Explain to me how talented coder 'x' (whoever, maybe will1000) will be able to live without any compensation whatsoever during 18 months. Even in SV that's an exception, not a rule, and even in SV people need to eat. So the more commonly employed scenario is that there is a bit of funding which is made to stretch as far as it will go by compensating key employees with equity rather than salary for some portion of their total package. 0 salary and just equity is an exception.
  - logicallee 13y ago

corford 13y ago

Reading between the lines, it seems the major contributing factors to their success were the connections they had to other ex-Stanford alumni (Zuckerberg himself being one of them), the internship at Twitter and the stint at Google. A more interesting question (at least for me) is: Would Instagram's success have been possible (or that fast) if the founders had not gone to Stanford?

replicatorblog 13y ago
Zuckerberg is a gentleman of Harvard! I say good day!
- corford 13y ago
  Ha good point! I always forget he didn't attend Stanford.