8 ms·

I'm torn between strongly agreeing with these points and wanting to comment pointing out that none of them matter..... I hate change for change's sake, but the

by Fuzzwah 13y ago

I'm torn between strongly agreeing with these points and wanting to comment pointing out that none of them matter..... I hate change for change's sake, but the new gmail compose window has made me more efficient. It took some getting used to however. Responses to the points made in the article: 1) I can’t easily delete my signatures. Forget about deleting your sig and generally cleaning up email threads. Decent email clients do this on their own and are we really that worried about a few extra bytes of data these days? 2) I can’t easily change my email subject. If its time to edit the subject of an email thread maybe it is time to hit the big read "compose" button and start from scratch anyway. 3) Ok, so what if you want to insert a link or something. Drag and drop from the address bar. So easy. 4) Rapportive doesn’t work. I've never used rapportive, it sounds awesome. Bummer on this one. 5) You can’t easily get access to people’s emails. (Also fonts and formatting) This one does bug me, because they've all become 3 clicks (or new shortcut keys to learn). An option to just always display these things would be good.... but I've evolved and learned the hotkeys. In conclusion, I've also been a long time gmail user who got cranky at the fact that the new compose form forced me to change my habits. I learned hotkeys and feel it has made me more efficient. Since I try to spend as little time in life being cranky and optimize efficiency I evolved and moved on. Full list of hotkeys: https://support.google.com/mail/answer/6594?hl=en https://support.google.com/mail/answer/6594?hl=en

kevingadd 13y ago
Saying 'hit the big red compose button' totally misses the point of why subjects get edited. If you'd ever participated in a discussion list, you'd know that sometimes a single discussion thread branches out into multiple smaller threads. The best way to handle this is to reply with a new subject so that threaded conversation views in email clients show it as a new thread, but all the participants stay on the reply-to list and the conversation history remains in the quotes. Drag and drop from the address bar to insert a link? What is this, Mac OS 9? I've literally never observed a user drag and drop from the address bar. I know it works, but I'm a power user. Do you really think it makes sense to remove an obvious button for a common operation (inserting a link) just because you assume that users know how to drag-and-drop a text selection from a 16 pixel high rectangle? Maybe all Google's user testers are dragging and dropping fiends so this actually is the reasoning behind it. I don't know how you would find precision drag-and-drop convenient on a typical laptop/chromebook touchpad, though.
- Fuzzwah 13y ago
  I said "maybe". I'm savvy to discussion lists. I can see times when you want to edit the subject. It is still possible. It takes two clicks...... Yes it could take 1 click. What about copy and paste is that beyond normal humans too? Frankly, this article was about power users and my responses were from my own personal point of view. I couldn't care less about if these changes are bad for ma's and pa's.
- toomuchtodo 13y ago
  What you're arguing for is better parent-child discussion relationship management in Gmail. Something like Gmail + Google Group at a much deeper integration level, with the Google Groups part not sucking like Google Groups does now. Also, I'd love if I could take a mailing list thread (like from NANOG), and with one-click blow it out onto a thread on something like Stack Exchange. Email needs to continue to evolve. It's role is to remove the friction of communicating tasks, thoughts, ideas, concepts, etc. We need work refining how those things are defined and moved between communication mediums. /endRant
  - endersshadow 13y ago
    A la Google Wave?
    - toomuchtodo 13y ago
      Sort of? I can definitely see design elements from Wave in what I'm suggesting; maybe more like a collaborative/group version of www.mailboxapp.com.
  - zaidf 13y ago
    What you're arguing for is better parent-child discussion relationship management in Gmail What? No! He just wants to edit the subject. Saying that we need better parent-child discussion relationship management is over complicating a problem with a simple solution that worked until some folks at gmail screwed it up.
sp332 13y ago
I rarely use the "make a link" button because Gmail automatically converts URL-looking strings into links. So I just paste the URL and get a link for free, no buttons required.
taigeair 13y ago
@Fuzzwah - regarding #4, I'm trying to insert a link. I don't see how you can do the drag and drop, especially if you want to make a word a link instead. Not http url. It seems you still can test links. For some reason, I couldn't do it for a period. Maybe they brought it back... In regards to learning hotkeys - there is no hotkey for changing subject line or getting access to emails. Otherwise I'd learn it. I think they should keep the simple UI for mobile and give the more full featured one for desktop (or at least an option).
- Fuzzwah 13y ago
  Gotcha. In general I detest html email so your #4 problem isn't something I've faced. My answer of dragging and dropping isn't actually something I do very much either. I normally just copy and paste the link into the email and don't format it in anyway. I'm totally with you on subject editing and accessing email addresses from the header. Adding clicks purely to minimize the design seems like a poor move to me too.
  - taigeair 13y ago
    Sorry I meant #3. Either way, I like to format my links. If there's a shortcut to pop out the message to compose mode, I'd totally learn that. I wonder what the gmail team is thinking with this new UI...
    - pfg 13y ago
      You can hold shift while you click on "Compose" or "Reply" to open it in a new window (if that's what you meant).
    - Fuzzwah 13y ago
      shift + r Alas, you'd then still need to click the formatting and header to make the changes you're talking about.
      - taigeair 13y ago
        @fuzzwah I meant as you are replying inline. e.g. http://www.taigeair.com/wp-content/uploads/2013/05/Edit-Subject-Gmail.jpg http://www.taigeair.com/wp-content/uploads/2013/05/Edit-Subj... I tried hitting shift+r but it just looks like inline reply in a new window. Obviously I use email a lot and care a lot about gmail.
scanr 13y ago
> If its time to edit the subject of an email thread maybe it is time to hit the big read "compose" button and start from scratch anyway. This isn't always the case. I quite often want to forward emails and edit the subject for clarity. Having to create a new mail and then copy the content from the previous mail (especially attachments) seems unnecessarily painful.
jlarocco 13y ago
> Drag and drop from the address bar. So easy. This is stupid. For starters, it means people can only insert links to sites they currently have open in their browser...
- sengstrom 13y ago
  I for one tend to open the link I'm about to send just to be sure I got the right one and it shows what I intend to communicate... So there it is, ready for drag and drop :)
joelhooks 13y ago
Rapportive works great for me, it is an awesome tool.
twistedpair 13y ago
Don't forget they're going after the Outlook crowd here. Did anyone else notice the new use of Outlook send key bindings? In the past you had to open lots of pop outs to write multiple mails. Now I can be composing 3 messages and reading another in the background. That's the point. Do more with your screen real estate.
- taeric 13y ago
  I don't get this. In the few times where I was writing multiple emails in the past, having them in multiple windows meant I could reliably use the keyboard to switch between them easily. Since this change, if I am going to do multiple emails, I have to reach over to the mouse a crap load more. To the point that I am glad this is not something I do often. Of course, this is the same reason I don't like chat in the gmail window. It winds up taking up too much of the real estate, and I never got the muscle memory to switch between popups.
Munksgaard 13y ago
> 1) I can’t easily delete my signatures. One easy way to do this (and reply in a bottom posted manner) is to press Ctrl+a followed by Ctrl+end. As someone who almost exclusively uses the keyboard to navigate the gmail interface, I've found that quite handy.
duaneb 13y ago
Thank you for showing me the error of my ways! Clearly google understands my needs better than I do myself.

by Fuzzwah 13y ago

kevingadd 13y ago

Saying 'hit the big red compose button' totally misses the point of why subjects get edited. If you'd ever participated in a discussion list, you'd know that sometimes a single discussion thread branches out into multiple smaller threads. The best way to handle this is to reply with a new subject so that threaded conversation views in email clients show it as a new thread, but all the participants stay on the reply-to list and the conversation history remains in the quotes. Drag and drop from the address bar to insert a link? What is this, Mac OS 9? I've literally never observed a user drag and drop from the address bar. I know it works, but I'm a power user. Do you really think it makes sense to remove an obvious button for a common operation (inserting a link) just because you assume that users know how to drag-and-drop a text selection from a 16 pixel high rectangle? Maybe all Google's user testers are dragging and dropping fiends so this actually is the reasoning behind it. I don't know how you would find precision drag-and-drop convenient on a typical laptop/chromebook touchpad, though.

Fuzzwah 13y ago
I said "maybe". I'm savvy to discussion lists. I can see times when you want to edit the subject. It is still possible. It takes two clicks...... Yes it could take 1 click. What about copy and paste is that beyond normal humans too? Frankly, this article was about power users and my responses were from my own personal point of view. I couldn't care less about if these changes are bad for ma's and pa's.
toomuchtodo 13y ago
What you're arguing for is better parent-child discussion relationship management in Gmail. Something like Gmail + Google Group at a much deeper integration level, with the Google Groups part not sucking like Google Groups does now. Also, I'd love if I could take a mailing list thread (like from NANOG), and with one-click blow it out onto a thread on something like Stack Exchange. Email needs to continue to evolve. It's role is to remove the friction of communicating tasks, thoughts, ideas, concepts, etc. We need work refining how those things are defined and moved between communication mediums. /endRant
- endersshadow 13y ago
  A la Google Wave?
  - toomuchtodo 13y ago
    Sort of? I can definitely see design elements from Wave in what I'm suggesting; maybe more like a collaborative/group version of www.mailboxapp.com.
- zaidf 13y ago
  What you're arguing for is better parent-child discussion relationship management in Gmail What? No! He just wants to edit the subject. Saying that we need better parent-child discussion relationship management is over complicating a problem with a simple solution that worked until some folks at gmail screwed it up.

sp332 13y ago

I rarely use the "make a link" button because Gmail automatically converts URL-looking strings into links. So I just paste the URL and get a link for free, no buttons required.

taigeair 13y ago

@Fuzzwah - regarding #4, I'm trying to insert a link. I don't see how you can do the drag and drop, especially if you want to make a word a link instead. Not http url. It seems you still can test links. For some reason, I couldn't do it for a period. Maybe they brought it back... In regards to learning hotkeys - there is no hotkey for changing subject line or getting access to emails. Otherwise I'd learn it. I think they should keep the simple UI for mobile and give the more full featured one for desktop (or at least an option).

Fuzzwah 13y ago
Gotcha. In general I detest html email so your #4 problem isn't something I've faced. My answer of dragging and dropping isn't actually something I do very much either. I normally just copy and paste the link into the email and don't format it in anyway. I'm totally with you on subject editing and accessing email addresses from the header. Adding clicks purely to minimize the design seems like a poor move to me too.
- taigeair 13y ago
  Sorry I meant #3. Either way, I like to format my links. If there's a shortcut to pop out the message to compose mode, I'd totally learn that. I wonder what the gmail team is thinking with this new UI...
  - pfg 13y ago
    You can hold shift while you click on "Compose" or "Reply" to open it in a new window (if that's what you meant).
  - Fuzzwah 13y ago
    shift + r Alas, you'd then still need to click the formatting and header to make the changes you're talking about.
    - taigeair 13y ago
      @fuzzwah I meant as you are replying inline. e.g. http://www.taigeair.com/wp-content/uploads/2013/05/Edit-Subject-Gmail.jpg http://www.taigeair.com/wp-content/uploads/2013/05/Edit-Subj... I tried hitting shift+r but it just looks like inline reply in a new window. Obviously I use email a lot and care a lot about gmail.

scanr 13y ago

> If its time to edit the subject of an email thread maybe it is time to hit the big read "compose" button and start from scratch anyway. This isn't always the case. I quite often want to forward emails and edit the subject for clarity. Having to create a new mail and then copy the content from the previous mail (especially attachments) seems unnecessarily painful.

jlarocco 13y ago

> Drag and drop from the address bar. So easy. This is stupid. For starters, it means people can only insert links to sites they currently have open in their browser...

sengstrom 13y ago
I for one tend to open the link I'm about to send just to be sure I got the right one and it shows what I intend to communicate... So there it is, ready for drag and drop :)

joelhooks 13y ago

Rapportive works great for me, it is an awesome tool.

twistedpair 13y ago

Don't forget they're going after the Outlook crowd here. Did anyone else notice the new use of Outlook send key bindings? In the past you had to open lots of pop outs to write multiple mails. Now I can be composing 3 messages and reading another in the background. That's the point. Do more with your screen real estate.

taeric 13y ago
I don't get this. In the few times where I was writing multiple emails in the past, having them in multiple windows meant I could reliably use the keyboard to switch between them easily. Since this change, if I am going to do multiple emails, I have to reach over to the mouse a crap load more. To the point that I am glad this is not something I do often. Of course, this is the same reason I don't like chat in the gmail window. It winds up taking up too much of the real estate, and I never got the muscle memory to switch between popups.

Munksgaard 13y ago

> 1) I can’t easily delete my signatures. One easy way to do this (and reply in a bottom posted manner) is to press Ctrl+a followed by Ctrl+end. As someone who almost exclusively uses the keyboard to navigate the gmail interface, I've found that quite handy.

duaneb 13y ago

Thank you for showing me the error of my ways! Clearly google understands my needs better than I do myself.