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I see your point but I think "forgo" is a strong word. I have made and will continue to make a great salary with great benefits and be able to choose companies

I see your point but I think "forgo" is a strong word. I have made and will continue to make a great salary with great benefits and be able to choose companies based on cultural fit. That's something that I would never give up for an extra 50k a year.

jshen 13y ago
For an extra $100k a year? I think a lot of programmers don't realize how much some other programmers get paid once you factor in other incentives outside of salary.
- cantankerous 13y ago
  Agree with you there. I have some friends that do the kinda dev I feel is radioactive, but then they tell me about their benefits and wages and I'm like "where's the hazmat suit?"
- djKianoosh 13y ago
  some benefits are hard to quantify and/or equate to $. For example, each person would value commute time differently, but how many people actually compute the cost of a longer commute beyond just gas and time? What about its effect on your health and mental state? Sometimes we neglect/forget to take these things into account, but sometimes it's just hard to factor them in altogether...
tomkarlo 13y ago
Yes, but you're also hanging around on HN. :) I'm thinking more of the other guy, who was just as smart as you but perhaps not in love with tech, and had to decide if he wants to give up 50K to be an engineer. (I think you're referring to choosing between engineering jobs - I meant choosing between career paths.) Also: it's sad that beyond the comp issue, they're often sacrificing prestige, at least in the US. It's just as hard to become a qualified engineer at top firm, but the general public just doesn't find that as impressive as being a lawyer, doctor or banker. I know lots of lawyers and bankers for whom a big reason they're in that job was the prestige and ego-boost associated with it.
- rayiner 13y ago
  That's why you need to move to Silicon Valley, where being a programmer is considered prestigious by people in barbershops.
  - tomkarlo 13y ago
    I did.
- jshen 13y ago
  I've been doing this a while, and have found that prestige from non techis, for us engineers, is based on the company we work for. Tell someone you're an engineer at google or facebook and you get the prestige. Tell them you're a programmer at some startup they've never heard of and their like "yeah, whatever". I think a lot of it has to do with people overusing the term "engineer". I know people with that work for the phone company that have lower skill jobs but still get the title "network engineer" or some such. Normal people can't distinguish between this and the hard profession.

jshen 13y ago

For an extra $100k a year? I think a lot of programmers don't realize how much some other programmers get paid once you factor in other incentives outside of salary.

cantankerous 13y ago
Agree with you there. I have some friends that do the kinda dev I feel is radioactive, but then they tell me about their benefits and wages and I'm like "where's the hazmat suit?"
djKianoosh 13y ago
some benefits are hard to quantify and/or equate to $. For example, each person would value commute time differently, but how many people actually compute the cost of a longer commute beyond just gas and time? What about its effect on your health and mental state? Sometimes we neglect/forget to take these things into account, but sometimes it's just hard to factor them in altogether...

tomkarlo 13y ago

Yes, but you're also hanging around on HN. :) I'm thinking more of the other guy, who was just as smart as you but perhaps not in love with tech, and had to decide if he wants to give up 50K to be an engineer. (I think you're referring to choosing between engineering jobs - I meant choosing between career paths.) Also: it's sad that beyond the comp issue, they're often sacrificing prestige, at least in the US. It's just as hard to become a qualified engineer at top firm, but the general public just doesn't find that as impressive as being a lawyer, doctor or banker. I know lots of lawyers and bankers for whom a big reason they're in that job was the prestige and ego-boost associated with it.

rayiner 13y ago
That's why you need to move to Silicon Valley, where being a programmer is considered prestigious by people in barbershops.
- tomkarlo 13y ago
  I did.
jshen 13y ago
I've been doing this a while, and have found that prestige from non techis, for us engineers, is based on the company we work for. Tell someone you're an engineer at google or facebook and you get the prestige. Tell them you're a programmer at some startup they've never heard of and their like "yeah, whatever". I think a lot of it has to do with people overusing the term "engineer". I know people with that work for the phone company that have lower skill jobs but still get the title "network engineer" or some such. Normal people can't distinguish between this and the hard profession.