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My First Year in the App Store
- jacoblyles 13y agoIs that a scroll bar down the right side? Seems poorly placed if you expect people to touch on the right side to advance a page.
- trevmckendrick 13y agoGreat point. The navigation between chapters is still being decided.
- callmeed 13y agoI'm curious what translation you used (I signed up for the rest of the posts but haven't got through them). Most modern English translations of the Bible are copyrighted and often you can only quote/print a limited number of verses without paying licensing. (I think the best public domain version is probably the ASV from 1901). Did you license a spanish version of the Bible? Pay someone to translate a modern one? If so, were there legal hurdles to translating a copyrighted version?
- trevmckendrick 13y agoYou're right that most well known Bible translations are copyrighted. I found one that is in the public domain so it was game on.
- prewett 13y agoThe NET translation (bible.org) is widely used in free Bible apps, so while it is not public domain, it seems to be free. It's a nice translation, and also has lots of notes (if the app provides them). The ESV translation has a free app, too, although that might not help someone trying to add it in their Bible app.
- aeontech 13y agoFascinating example of finding and successfully filling an under-served niche. I would have never thought of creating this kind of app. It makes me contemplate - how can you break out of your filter bubble to come up with and test product ideas for markets you can't even imagine exist because they are so far from your experience?
- trevmckendrick 13y agoMy two cents: I scrolled through tons and tons of top ranking apps in each category. That was where the initial brainstorm began: profitable apps that didn't look very good.
- dhruvmittal 13y agoI was actually really excited by the "...you can get the next 9 posts delivered to your email by signing up here:" at the bottom. I like it. I like email, because I can read it anywhere and filter it any way I want. I dislike unsubscribing from email updates about as much as I dislike getting updates I'll never read. By making it easy to get emailed only about a story I've already demonstrated interest in (by reading all the way through), you've made sure I'll come back for your next 9 posts. I'd like to see more people use something like this. Or, if I've misunderstood how this works...well, the concept was exciting.
- trevmckendrick 13y agoVery kind words. Glad you liked it. Indeed, fewer people sign up, but you know they're the ones who value the content the most.
- grecy 13y agoGiven that you're using wordpress, is that a plugin for the "sign up by email"? Thanks,
- trevmckendrick 13y agoIt's just HTML that Mailchimp gave me that I stuck in the post.
- firekesti 13y agoI use Blogtrottr to email me when my RSS feeds update, for much the same reason.
- drivers99 13y agoThat's what I use spamgourmet for. I give out a different address to various sites without fear. The address you give out includes a number which is the number of emails you will allow them to send to you at first. You can reload that number whenever you want to allow them to send more messages, or you can whitelist the sender if you want to keep receiving messages without it counting down.
- nathanbarry 13y agoNicely done! I'd love to hear more about the marketing efforts that went into promoting the app.
- trevmckendrick 13y agoThanks for the comment Nathan. Initially it was all via search. Since then I've started collecting email addresses the very 1st time the app launches. I'm up to over 30,000 emails now so every new product launch starts relatively well.
- nanijoe 13y agoImpressive...How do you collect the email email addresses? Do you just ask people for their addresses?
- trevmckendrick 13y agoYep. When the app launches the very first time I ask for their 1st name and email if they want to hear about deals/offers, new apps, etc. They can cancel out easily and never see the form again. But when you have a free app that quite a few people download, email addresses start accumulating pretty quickly.
- Paul_D_Santana 13y agoI was under the impression that this was a paid app. How does it generate so much revenue while still being free? I signed up for future posts (extremely well-placed sign-up form by the way!), but I didn't see a description of in-app purchases or other revenue model as a topic for a future post, which is why I ask. I am also using Android. Thank you for this post by the way. This is amazing and I'm excited to read your future posts!
- trevmckendrick 13y agoGreat questions. Revenue is where it's at! Initially it was just a paid download for the text of the Bible. With more research in the App Store though I realized audio Bibles were selling much more than I was. So I outsourced the audio (mentioned in the post I think) and now the model is that users download the original app (with the text) for free, and then can buy the audio as an IAP. This works great on multiple fronts: I collect more email address, I rank better in search because I get more downloads, and the audio sells better as an IAP than as a stand alone app.
- jordan_clark 13y agoIs there a link to the app on the app store? Or did I miss it?
- jkira 13y agoI'd be interested to hear how you marketed the app. Just building an app seems to be only half (or less) of the battle these days, as far as App Store success goes. I've got seven apps on the App Store, and combined they usually don't even bring in $200/mo. Discouraging.
- trevmckendrick 13y agoI'll talk about that in one of the upcoming posts, but basically: I started with an app niche that I knew people were already searching for. And I knew that because there were crappy Spanish Bible apps already making money in the App Store. Since then I have started collecting users' email addresses which helps with promotions and new app launches, but initially all my traction was through search.
- SurfScore 13y agoSounds like any successful business I've ever heard of. Find a niche with an unsatisfied need, then grow organically. Good for you.
- trevmckendrick 13y agoThanks!
- pc86 13y ago> And I knew that because there were crappy Spanish Bible apps already making money in the App Store. How did you know that? Just judging by the reviews or did you actually buy some to try them out?
- trevmckendrick 13y agoAll of the above. I bought quite a few of them. It doesn't take too long to get a feel for how good an app is.
- 13y ago
- jebek 13y agoI'm sure you'll make it clear in later posts, but are you a developer?
- trevmckendrick 13y agoI'm not a dev or a designer. I'm tech savvy enough that I'm still the computer repair guy for my entire extended family, but I'm def not fluent in Objective C.
- schrodinger 13y agoDid you develop it yourself, or outsource it?
- trevmckendrick 13y agoI did the initial mockups by hand and some of the debugging. Other than that all outsourced.
- bluedino 13y agoIs it possible that the guys you outsourced it to could just make their own version and put it on the store? I haven't read a HN article titled "How foobar consulting stole my iPhone app and re-branded it as their own"
- trevmckendrick 13y agoThat has definitely crossed my mind more than once. There's a few reasons this isn't as scary as one might think: 1. Contractors work on tons of apps, the vast majority of which don't make any money. Their business is making apps, not selling them. 2. Focus on long-term relationships. If the contractor knows you're going to hire them in the future for more work they'll be less likely to screw you over now. 3. Last resort: you can report pirated apps to Apple.
- ujsfdo 13y ago
- austenallred 13y agoThe coolest part of this post, IMO, is that by finding that niche you freed yourself up to work on whatever you want to work on. Legitimate residual income.
- trevmckendrick 13y agoThanks, and yes and no. When I realized I'd found a decent sized niche I had to make a decision: do I let it sit and coast/build something else, or do I invest more here? I've decided with the latter, which will play out for at least the next year. Jury still out whether it was the right decision.
- sillysaurus 13y agoIf you completely abandoned the project as it currently exists, do you think your income would drop off sharply? In other words, how much of an ongoing effort is it to ensure your income stays high? Does search favor apps that are being updated constantly? Or is there any reason not to eventually just stop working on the app?
- trevmckendrick 13y agoIt wouldn't drop off. In fact there's many apps in the App Store that haven't been touched in years that continue to bring in money. My thoughts are that I have so much to improve upon, and there's a lot of low hanging fruit left for me, so it's likely worth the additional investment. I compared investing more time/money in this niche, vs in other unvalidated ideas I have and it made sense to stick with this for now.
- andrewljohnson 13y agoWhenever anyone complains to me that its hard to make money on software, and/or the App Store is rigged, I always tell them I think anyone can make a living by making a bible app. You don't even have to be the best one, just pretty good, and iterate - it's the canonical product that you know has a big audience, willing buyers, and poor competition on the low end of the market. Case proven by this guy! The next time you think to yourself that there is anything needed to make money on software besides persistence, thoughtfulness, and picking something you know people want, you're in a trap of your own creation. People who don't make money on their apps typically fail because they try to be too novel, try to make the app too good, or they don't stick in there long enough.
- trevmckendrick 13y agoI agree with everything except your last clause. :) Most people do over think. But it really depends on your goals. If you're only looking for a small side income there's no reason to try something 100% new. Sticking it out too long on these small projects can be dangerous though. We probably agree here more than not, but the trick is knowing when to drop something. If it's not selling and there's nothing fatally wrong with it, I say stop and move on. Just my two cents though.
- andrewljohnson 13y agoWhen to give up is certainly one of the most interesting questions in start-up land, and side projects are certainly easier to give up on than businesses that involve other people. Maybe it's the persistence of business that makes so much invention come from commerce. People in their garage get bored, people at work get paid to keep trying.
- zerr 13y agoYes, but what about those "lucky" developers who live in countries where selling apps is not available in both - apple appstore and google play markets? Are there any other channels for selling apps? I "Ask HN"-ed this but didn't get much attention...
- scottluptowski 13y agoThis sounds very interesting and I'm looking forward to reading more. How much time did you spend researching potential app categories? Was your category decision driven by any hard data, other than anecdotal knowledge that Spanish bibles were a category that was selling and had search volume?
- trevmckendrick 13y agoGreat question. No hard data. I saw that Spanish Bibles were ranking in the Reference and Book categories, like you said. Also important (but not "hard data") is that when I searched "la biblia" relatively few apps appeared in the search results compared to other search phrases.
- mansigandhi 13y agotrevmckendrick - good to see the app do well! If you remember I (Sleepyhead) helped with the email forms. We pleasantly surprised to see the post here :)
- trevmckendrick 13y agoHello! You guys did great work; those forms have done perfectly... over 30,000 signups so far. Thanks for saying hi!
- trevmckendrick 13y agoMy server is struggling, here's a cached version for the interested: http://webcache.googleusercontent.com/search?q=cache:http://www.trevormckendrick.com/my-first-year-in-the-app-store/ http://webcache.googleusercontent.com/search?q=cache:http://...
- orangethirty 13y agoReligious products are big sellers. Specially anything that has to do with the bible or prayers. I used to sell bibles as a teenager. Made more money than drug dealers. It was funny. But then I went ad turned atheist. I could no longer sell itwith a clean conscience.
- greenranger 13y agoSeems like an atheist would have less of a moral problem profiting from the sale of bibles then someone who believes they are sacred texts.
- yoster 13y agoNice! Even the most frugal of people will shell out some money when it comes to religion.
- trevmckendrick 13y agoTrue about the copycats. Although there are a few things you have to do right in the app that most people don't know. Most versions of the Bible are copyrights for example. And I also speak Spanish. I can't imagine doing this app in a different language. The text has to be perfect and it's (obviously?) hard to tell what's wrong when you can't read it.
- fuddle 13y agoGreat idea, did it cost much to record the Bible as an audiobook?
- trevmckendrick 13y agoYes. The most expensive part of the app by far.
- jacalata 13y agoSo the $73k is net revenue after Apple but before costs, correct?
- trevmckendrick 13y agoThat is correct.
- alexvr 13y agoIt's a good reminder to me, as a developer, that people simply buy (or use) what they want, not what I think they want.
- trevmckendrick 13y agoAmen! (no pun intended :) )
- ronyeh 13y agoCongrats on the success! Can you share a link to your app? Also, do you think the only way to get discovered (for indie devs) is to pick app ideas that will match nicely to keywords that users search for? If you don't have a marketing budget, is there any other way to get discovered?
- monkey_slap 13y agoI'm going to be doing a similar writeup as my app launches in 2 weeks. I've got a small budget. All the design+dev was me, but I'm spending about $300-$400 on marketing. We'll see how that goes. If anything I believe you should be spending more on marketing nowadays. There's no real way, at least to my knowledge, to search for a niche hole with keywords. I do, however, like to think of an app idea and then spend an hour search various keywords and seeing the results/competition. https://appstorerankings.net/ https://appstorerankings.net/ is a good website to find the keywords of an app. I combined common keywords in the app that I'm releasing with common keywords that are missing among competitors that yield few results. Again, I haven't launched this app (my 7th) yet, but I'll be doing some analysis of its success using the marketing budget and keyword research.
- trevmckendrick 13y agoI agree it's hard to do really detailed research similar to, say, the Google Keyword Tool. It's mostly a gut check. "Does this have a lot of competition? Does this keyword appear to get a lot of searches?" What's your app name?
- monkey_slap 13y agoPoetreat. Aiming for May 7. Week of polish then submission. http://poetreatapp.com/ http://poetreatapp.com/
- autotravis 13y agoNice landing page.
- deleted 13y ago[deleted]
- speedyapoc 13y agoVery surprised by that type of revenue. What kind of marketing did you put into it? Without marketing, my first app on the store went as follows: > The next morning (and literally every day since) I woke up and first thing checked my email for that magical message from AppFigures. My total day one net sales? $0.70. Admittedly not very much.
- trevmckendrick 13y agoAs far as I know, all downloads are based on search.
- timack 13y agoI thought the App Store had a rule that you couldn't submit an app that was essentially a 'book or a film' how did you get around that?
- trevmckendrick 13y agoGreat point. I've actually run into that problem. On some updates they would reject me and I'd have to add a few features to be approved. That's part of the reason I'm redoing the entire app from scratch with tons of extra functionality, etc.
- danenania 13y agoThanks for writing this. It's very insightful. One question - do you have any interest in spanish and/or the bible, or is this purely a business exercise?
- unreal37 13y agoGreat first article in the series. Can't wait for the rest.
- nicholassmith 13y agoNice work for sure. One thing that rang true, $73k isn't the sort of money that gets VCs going but that's full time salary for a lot of people. Making money on the app store is definitely possible, but we're no longer seeing the half a million in sales in one month figures we did at the start. Does that mean you can't make living from the App Store? No, it just means being realistic.