6 ms·

Microsoft DreamSpark: Free Dev licenses for students

21 points by iamelgringo 18y ago

catfish 18y ago
Make darn sure you high school kids read this page.... http://www.microsoft.com/info/cpyright.mspx http://www.microsoft.com/info/cpyright.mspx And then go read this page for PHP/MYSQL/ECLIPSE/APACHE/ and every other open source project out there.... http://www.gnu.org/licenses/old-licenses/gpl-2.0.txt http://www.gnu.org/licenses/old-licenses/gpl-2.0.txt Note how the first sentence of the GPL says it all... The licenses for most software are designed to take away your freedom to share and change it... In the open source world no one has to verify your status as a student, threaten you for violating a license, or warn you not to share your ideas with them... Judge for yourself grasshopper. Choose your path wisely. There is no such thing as FREE when you choose the proprietary path of learning....
- DenisM 18y ago
  Welcome to Slashdot?
  - ashr 18y ago
    Ditto!
- kirse 18y ago
  Don't forget to remind the grasshopper that if he wants to eat he should probably consider learning the software that puts food on the table first. Edit: Right, and down-mod me because there is no truth to what I said. Someone remind me what percentage of open-source developers have their primary income come from their open source project.
  - calambrac 18y ago
    Open source is just as much an ecosystem to build a product in as Microsoft products are. Having an open source project that you develop in your spare time does not mean that you depend on MS for your income. I haven't touched an MS product in years, and I don't plan on ever doing so again.
- Sephr 18y ago
  I'm a high school student and I tried signing up for DreamSpark the initial day of it's public release and it says they only accept college students enrolled in the listed universities. Your comment made me think they started accepting high school students again and so I tried signing up again. The policy still hasn't changed. Don't give people false hopes like that. Edit: It seems they do allow high school students now, but I need to ask the superintendent or principal. The previous page ( https://www.dreamspark.com/wayf/StudentOption.aspx https://www.dreamspark.com/wayf/StudentOption.aspx ) says it just has to be any teacher from the school so I'm not really sure who I should ask. https://www.dreamspark.com/FAQ/HighSchoolStudentFaq.aspx https://www.dreamspark.com/FAQ/HighSchoolStudentFaq.aspx
- buro9 18y ago
  "There is no such thing as FREE when you choose the proprietary path of learning...." Sure... but as it put a nice copy of Windows Server 2008 on my laptop I quite like the program. It also has removed any ambiguity between my current employer and myself about just who was going to cover the license for a copy of Visual Studio 2008 on my home machine. Strangely I believe that our Gold Partnership includes a clause that allows developers to have a copy of software at home. But our IT department drag their knuckles on the floor and I was glad that doing a Computer Science MSc part-time gave me access to this program. And what do I do with all of this? Just work stuff really. What I'm actually working on is Python stuff on app-engine. But there's no doubt that I really appreciated the existence of this program to remove the doubt over the few things I did want soon (and didn't want to wait for a visit to the MS Corporate Shop to get). It's all rather bizarre... I work for a Gold Partner, I'm a Developer Advisory Council member, I sit on TAP programs, I get visits to the MS Corp Shop... and yet the student program is what actually gave me dev tools in a pain free way. Just as well... being stubborn I was refusing to pay and as much as Ubuntu is lovely it still is problematic working in a Windows shop on Ubuntu.
pj 18y ago
There's a similar program for startups called BizSpark. http://www.microsoft.com/BizSpark/ http://www.microsoft.com/BizSpark/
- rythie 18y ago
  Whilst we are talking about this type of thing, Sun do free software and heavily discounted servers etc. on the Startup essentials program http://www.sun.com/emrkt/startupessentials/ http://www.sun.com/emrkt/startupessentials/
yason 18y ago
Haven't they always provided free licenses for students but this single hub site is new? Or was the earlier offer the student pricing only? Can't remember. But it doesn't matter really. What is interesting is that over the year I've begun to repeatedly see signs of that Microsoft is no more. This is just another one of those. While I've been passively against Microsoft ever since 80's I've always considered them a credible opposing force to other stacks of software, such as FOSS or GNU, or Unix, or Macs. Eventhough I wasn't a Windows user I always knew what was new on the MS front, and what new features they would soon be selling. However, these days I hardly bother to raise my eyebrow anytime Microsoft announces something. I think it started with, or at around the time of, the anticipation of Vista. Vista was a bit everything and then quite much nothing: it didn't feel like a success and, indeed, now it seems that it never became a success either. This is not only because XP was deemed "good enough" but, to me, because Microsoft really hadn't figured out anything relevant to add to XP. They would have implemented it in Vista but it seems that since XP a Windows-like operating system had already reached a saturation point, both feature-wise and UI-wise. This means they must have stopped thinking about -- or run out of -- any juicy practical improvements in around 2000 or so: they still had something to be implemented in XP but then nothing much. People could run XP for a decade and they wouldn't miss anything important as long as they could install new versions of their browser. Unlike Vista, Windows 7 will probably break the XP dam and flood over to everywhere around the world. However, this doesn't mean there's much substance to it except the sheer brute force ramming the foundations of the 8-or-9-year-old XP. It will take a few years to change (merely the name of) the de facto Windows operating system but as XP will begin to suffer from fundamental aging problems such as lack of drivers the transition will punch through. However, unless Windows 7 is a total blunder there will be absolutely nothing from Microsoft that would replace it for the following ten years or even longer. Microsoft has had a hard time with XP already and they now have one chance to do one more force-update and then they're stuck. I don't think it would be unimaginable for Windows 7 to be the last major operating system from Microsoft. Similarly with IE: IE8 is better in many ways and delivers features that people have been waiting for since IE6. However, I didn't see people rejoicing together, queueing at stores, or slashdotting Microsoft's download site. IE8 is not a key player in the web browser market: it's just catching up. There's no disruptive energy behind IE8; people who have been fed up with IE6/IE7 have been using Firefox for years. IE8 doesn't make the difference anymore. IE7 and IE8 could just as well have been IE6.1 and IE6.2. Now, the student licenses! Even no more than five years ago I would have got a grumpy face from thinking about the horde of freshmen that would get Microsoft stuff for free and learn to think of the world of computing as equal to MS Windows, MS Visual Studio, MS languages, and MS tools. Now I'm not worried at all, for some reason. I don't feel their student licenses changing anything in the world even if they offered them for negative price. The smart guys have been using Linux/BSD or OS X for years already, and everything important is cross-platform or on the web these days so that there's no single Microsoft solution that would be the de facto environment for most tasks. Perhaps I just exclusively know and read people who I consider smart and are in the non-MS camp, or I'm missing some other reality check here, but I'm not worrying about this DreamSpark thing. It will take off because Microsoft is huge and a like a tanker it takes miles to come to a full stop. But as for the bleeding edge where new things are tried, Microsoft isn't and won't be a major player. Rather, the DreamSpark thing feels like a one last stretch to level the playing field to their favor, and those kind of stunts are bound to fail per definition. To exaggerate, Microsoft is effectively in the position as if they hadn't done or released anything after Windows XP. Not good. (For them, I mean. :))
silencio 18y ago
Just on a sidenote, ACM and IEEE Computer Society student members get access to a ton of free Microsoft software through MSDNAA, the same program lots of schools participate in for low cost/free MS software, including a lot of what is offered through DreamSpark. Something I've found out most people didn't even know existed, but I think it's a fairly new offering. I didn't even know some of the products available for download through there even existed. Not condoning Microsoft or anything, but perhaps someone needs it. :)
- norova 18y ago
  >> Not condoning Microsoft or anything, but perhaps someone needs it. :) I really don't get why people are afraid of "condoning" Microsoft. They're one choice in a sea of thousands; to each his own. That mentality really bothers me.
  - silencio 18y ago
    Well I saw the sea of dead posts about this topic here before I commented - I wasn't afraid of condoning the use of Microsoft software as much as one of those people would then maybe comment and start off something like that for a small comment I left in hopes that there might be someone else on HN that might find it useful. (And now I notice that more of the comments not-dead on this link are about Microsoft than the DreamSpark program itself...) I personally don't care what I use as long as I can use it for the task at hand, and I also don't care what others choose to use. I think that these tools that are normally fairly expensive now free for academic use to be a nice little touch, but then again I also appreciate that most commercial software is also available at low/no cost to students and educators. What does bother me is kneejerk reactions to being against Microsoft for no good reason. So I use Mac OS X mainly, and *bsd or Linux for servers, and I contribute to an open source project. I still find a use for Server 2008 and Windows Mobile and more..
gord 18y ago
All part of the lock in scheme - students have far more {interesting} opportunities to tinker with open source, imo.
- MrRage 18y ago
  Excuse me, but how does this "lock in" students? Once they become part of this program they always have to use MS products? Students should try to expose themselves to as many possible technologies as possible. Open source, Microsoft, Apple, etc. These sorts of programs help students do that.
  - gord 18y ago
    Sure... they don't have to... but they often DO - which is why M$ focus marketing there. Just my personal opinion but I think schools, universities should be promoting open source, rather than backing commercial products.
  - catfish 18y ago
    Spoken like a man who has never written code... You get locked in because after 2-3 years of churning out work you have both comfort with one technology, and a base of libraries and routines that took you 2-3 years to write, and know. Once your down that rabbit hole, switching becomes much harder as you have to abandon the mind share you created in the languages you used. And in the case of .NET since so much of what you do there is unique to MS alone, and mostly due to the "LOCK IN" to their OS, walking away from it is not FREE or EASY. Worse yet stay with it long enough and watch your world crumble to nothing when MS seeking revenue enhancement decides it needs to release the next great language, and obsolete years of your work, with an upgrade. Don't think so? Ask the VB 6.0 crowd and the thousands of COM component vendors whose industry disappeared overnight when MS pulled the plug on them and forced .NET as the standard. I don't agree that students should expose themselves to as many technologies as possible, if among their choices one technology could cause them harm...
steveis 18y ago
Being knee-jerk anti-Microsoft is so 80's....

21 points by iamelgringo 18y ago

Make darn sure you high school kids read this page.... http://www.microsoft.com/info/cpyright.mspx http://www.microsoft.com/info/cpyright.mspx And then go read this page for PHP/MYSQL/ECLIPSE/APACHE/ and every other open source project out there.... http://www.gnu.org/licenses/old-licenses/gpl-2.0.txt http://www.gnu.org/licenses/old-licenses/gpl-2.0.txt Note how the first sentence of the GPL says it all... The licenses for most software are designed to take away your freedom to share and change it... In the open source world no one has to verify your status as a student, threaten you for violating a license, or warn you not to share your ideas with them... Judge for yourself grasshopper. Choose your path wisely. There is no such thing as FREE when you choose the proprietary path of learning....

DenisM 18y ago
Welcome to Slashdot?
- ashr 18y ago
  Ditto!
kirse 18y ago
Don't forget to remind the grasshopper that if he wants to eat he should probably consider learning the software that puts food on the table first. Edit: Right, and down-mod me because there is no truth to what I said. Someone remind me what percentage of open-source developers have their primary income come from their open source project.
- calambrac 18y ago
  Open source is just as much an ecosystem to build a product in as Microsoft products are. Having an open source project that you develop in your spare time does not mean that you depend on MS for your income. I haven't touched an MS product in years, and I don't plan on ever doing so again.
Sephr 18y ago
I'm a high school student and I tried signing up for DreamSpark the initial day of it's public release and it says they only accept college students enrolled in the listed universities. Your comment made me think they started accepting high school students again and so I tried signing up again. The policy still hasn't changed. Don't give people false hopes like that. Edit: It seems they do allow high school students now, but I need to ask the superintendent or principal. The previous page ( https://www.dreamspark.com/wayf/StudentOption.aspx https://www.dreamspark.com/wayf/StudentOption.aspx ) says it just has to be any teacher from the school so I'm not really sure who I should ask. https://www.dreamspark.com/FAQ/HighSchoolStudentFaq.aspx https://www.dreamspark.com/FAQ/HighSchoolStudentFaq.aspx
buro9 18y ago
"There is no such thing as FREE when you choose the proprietary path of learning...." Sure... but as it put a nice copy of Windows Server 2008 on my laptop I quite like the program. It also has removed any ambiguity between my current employer and myself about just who was going to cover the license for a copy of Visual Studio 2008 on my home machine. Strangely I believe that our Gold Partnership includes a clause that allows developers to have a copy of software at home. But our IT department drag their knuckles on the floor and I was glad that doing a Computer Science MSc part-time gave me access to this program. And what do I do with all of this? Just work stuff really. What I'm actually working on is Python stuff on app-engine. But there's no doubt that I really appreciated the existence of this program to remove the doubt over the few things I did want soon (and didn't want to wait for a visit to the MS Corporate Shop to get). It's all rather bizarre... I work for a Gold Partner, I'm a Developer Advisory Council member, I sit on TAP programs, I get visits to the MS Corp Shop... and yet the student program is what actually gave me dev tools in a pain free way. Just as well... being stubborn I was refusing to pay and as much as Ubuntu is lovely it still is problematic working in a Windows shop on Ubuntu.

pj 18y ago

There's a similar program for startups called BizSpark. http://www.microsoft.com/BizSpark/ http://www.microsoft.com/BizSpark/

rythie 18y ago
Whilst we are talking about this type of thing, Sun do free software and heavily discounted servers etc. on the Startup essentials program http://www.sun.com/emrkt/startupessentials/ http://www.sun.com/emrkt/startupessentials/

yason 18y ago

Haven't they always provided free licenses for students but this single hub site is new? Or was the earlier offer the student pricing only? Can't remember. But it doesn't matter really. What is interesting is that over the year I've begun to repeatedly see signs of that Microsoft is no more. This is just another one of those. While I've been passively against Microsoft ever since 80's I've always considered them a credible opposing force to other stacks of software, such as FOSS or GNU, or Unix, or Macs. Eventhough I wasn't a Windows user I always knew what was new on the MS front, and what new features they would soon be selling. However, these days I hardly bother to raise my eyebrow anytime Microsoft announces something. I think it started with, or at around the time of, the anticipation of Vista. Vista was a bit everything and then quite much nothing: it didn't feel like a success and, indeed, now it seems that it never became a success either. This is not only because XP was deemed "good enough" but, to me, because Microsoft really hadn't figured out anything relevant to add to XP. They would have implemented it in Vista but it seems that since XP a Windows-like operating system had already reached a saturation point, both feature-wise and UI-wise. This means they must have stopped thinking about -- or run out of -- any juicy practical improvements in around 2000 or so: they still had something to be implemented in XP but then nothing much. People could run XP for a decade and they wouldn't miss anything important as long as they could install new versions of their browser. Unlike Vista, Windows 7 will probably break the XP dam and flood over to everywhere around the world. However, this doesn't mean there's much substance to it except the sheer brute force ramming the foundations of the 8-or-9-year-old XP. It will take a few years to change (merely the name of) the de facto Windows operating system but as XP will begin to suffer from fundamental aging problems such as lack of drivers the transition will punch through. However, unless Windows 7 is a total blunder there will be absolutely nothing from Microsoft that would replace it for the following ten years or even longer. Microsoft has had a hard time with XP already and they now have one chance to do one more force-update and then they're stuck. I don't think it would be unimaginable for Windows 7 to be the last major operating system from Microsoft. Similarly with IE: IE8 is better in many ways and delivers features that people have been waiting for since IE6. However, I didn't see people rejoicing together, queueing at stores, or slashdotting Microsoft's download site. IE8 is not a key player in the web browser market: it's just catching up. There's no disruptive energy behind IE8; people who have been fed up with IE6/IE7 have been using Firefox for years. IE8 doesn't make the difference anymore. IE7 and IE8 could just as well have been IE6.1 and IE6.2. Now, the student licenses! Even no more than five years ago I would have got a grumpy face from thinking about the horde of freshmen that would get Microsoft stuff for free and learn to think of the world of computing as equal to MS Windows, MS Visual Studio, MS languages, and MS tools. Now I'm not worried at all, for some reason. I don't feel their student licenses changing anything in the world even if they offered them for negative price. The smart guys have been using Linux/BSD or OS X for years already, and everything important is cross-platform or on the web these days so that there's no single Microsoft solution that would be the de facto environment for most tasks. Perhaps I just exclusively know and read people who I consider smart and are in the non-MS camp, or I'm missing some other reality check here, but I'm not worrying about this DreamSpark thing. It will take off because Microsoft is huge and a like a tanker it takes miles to come to a full stop. But as for the bleeding edge where new things are tried, Microsoft isn't and won't be a major player. Rather, the DreamSpark thing feels like a one last stretch to level the playing field to their favor, and those kind of stunts are bound to fail per definition. To exaggerate, Microsoft is effectively in the position as if they hadn't done or released anything after Windows XP. Not good. (For them, I mean. :))

silencio 18y ago

Just on a sidenote, ACM and IEEE Computer Society student members get access to a ton of free Microsoft software through MSDNAA, the same program lots of schools participate in for low cost/free MS software, including a lot of what is offered through DreamSpark. Something I've found out most people didn't even know existed, but I think it's a fairly new offering. I didn't even know some of the products available for download through there even existed. Not condoning Microsoft or anything, but perhaps someone needs it. :)

norova 18y ago
>> Not condoning Microsoft or anything, but perhaps someone needs it. :) I really don't get why people are afraid of "condoning" Microsoft. They're one choice in a sea of thousands; to each his own. That mentality really bothers me.
- silencio 18y ago
  Well I saw the sea of dead posts about this topic here before I commented - I wasn't afraid of condoning the use of Microsoft software as much as one of those people would then maybe comment and start off something like that for a small comment I left in hopes that there might be someone else on HN that might find it useful. (And now I notice that more of the comments not-dead on this link are about Microsoft than the DreamSpark program itself...) I personally don't care what I use as long as I can use it for the task at hand, and I also don't care what others choose to use. I think that these tools that are normally fairly expensive now free for academic use to be a nice little touch, but then again I also appreciate that most commercial software is also available at low/no cost to students and educators. What does bother me is kneejerk reactions to being against Microsoft for no good reason. So I use Mac OS X mainly, and *bsd or Linux for servers, and I contribute to an open source project. I still find a use for Server 2008 and Windows Mobile and more..

gord 18y ago

All part of the lock in scheme - students have far more {interesting} opportunities to tinker with open source, imo.

MrRage 18y ago
Excuse me, but how does this "lock in" students? Once they become part of this program they always have to use MS products? Students should try to expose themselves to as many possible technologies as possible. Open source, Microsoft, Apple, etc. These sorts of programs help students do that.
- gord 18y ago
  Sure... they don't have to... but they often DO - which is why M$ focus marketing there. Just my personal opinion but I think schools, universities should be promoting open source, rather than backing commercial products.
- catfish 18y ago
  Spoken like a man who has never written code... You get locked in because after 2-3 years of churning out work you have both comfort with one technology, and a base of libraries and routines that took you 2-3 years to write, and know. Once your down that rabbit hole, switching becomes much harder as you have to abandon the mind share you created in the languages you used. And in the case of .NET since so much of what you do there is unique to MS alone, and mostly due to the "LOCK IN" to their OS, walking away from it is not FREE or EASY. Worse yet stay with it long enough and watch your world crumble to nothing when MS seeking revenue enhancement decides it needs to release the next great language, and obsolete years of your work, with an upgrade. Don't think so? Ask the VB 6.0 crowd and the thousands of COM component vendors whose industry disappeared overnight when MS pulled the plug on them and forced .NET as the standard. I don't agree that students should expose themselves to as many technologies as possible, if among their choices one technology could cause them harm...

steveis 18y ago

Being knee-jerk anti-Microsoft is so 80's....