3 ms·

This is my biggest fear for myself.

Zenst 14y ago
Secret I ofund out myself is do not mix what you like to do with what you are paid to do. If you like your job fine, but remember you are paid the same. Many many companies will not reward that extra mile and many performance reviews are completely insulting as everybody gets the same % in so many companies and the variation between poor peope and good is probably an extra .5% pay rise. So unless you are working for yourself, then work to rule will keep you sane. Use your hindsight to plan holidays, if managment don't listern in a timely manner about a potentual problem then just plan that week off down the line and let them suffer - sadly it is the only way you can stay sane and they can pay for there mistakes. Its hard out there, don't make it harder on yourself.
- notimetorelax 14y ago
  > let them suffer I agree to that. If management doesn't feel pain of its mistakes it does not have an incentive to improve.
  - corwinstephen 14y ago
    This is going to sound insulting and I don't mean it that way, but does anyone ever wonder about the fact that managers are frequently considerably less intelligent than the people they manage? I think that's what drives the frustration a lot of the time. The thing is, just because they're less intelligent doesn't mean they're not good managers, but it think it certainly makes it a lot harder for programmers, who are usually very bright, to accept the choices their managers make when they don't particularly agree with them. Having said that, I think a good compromise would be to make sure that the people who get assigned to managerial positions have formerly had the job of the people they manage. That way they're likely to understand the pinpoints and the frustrations and be motivated to eliminate them. Obviously not all programmers will qualify for this job, but some certainly will.
    - virtualwhys 14y ago
      Completely agree, a manger without a technical (coding, sysadmin, etc.) background has a weak foundation: how can they make decisions without knowing the domain itself? Not so sure coders trump managers in the intelligence dept. After all, managers tend to earn more, and do less; I'd say they're brilliant in this respect ;-)
    - JanezStupar 14y ago
      I guess that you are still a novice. Usually managers did the work of their underlings. However seldomly a competent person gets promoted - as you need someone to do the work. And since the less competent person will be relatively better manager than producer in comparison to the competent person, the less competent guy gets the promotion. I strongly advise everyone to read the Putt's Law, where this phenomena is broken down in great depth.
      - UK-AL 14y ago
        "managers did the work of their underlings." - only in very traditional companies that promote on seniority. Its not uncommon for someone straight out of college, working as an "ideas" man to manage programmers.
        JanezStupar 14y ago
        I apologize. My comment refers to the managers ascended from the developer ranks. People without technical knowledge in the roles of technical managers are in a league of their own when it comes to suck.
    - PakG1 14y ago
      The fact of the matter is that a lot of technical people who are geniuses technically do not have the qualities necessary to be good managers. Good managing requires ability to communicate up, down, and across the corporate hierarchy and the political minefield that comes with it. Good managers will balance out good technical people in terms of skillset, and help their team to do their job, while also coaching them in the areas where they are weak (and if the manager is weak technically, then obviously technical coaching is not in scope). Good managers will filter what reaches inside their team from the outside and protect their team from crap while captaining the ship forward. They know their weaknesses and also know that good leadership requires hiring people who are smarter than you are, and then helping to facilitate the magic that can happen when good people get together. Having managers who are strong both technically and in a business sense is rare. There are only so many Elon Musks in the world. But when you work with one, your work becomes very enjoyable. At the end of the day, team members don't have visibility as to what managers do every day. This blog is great for understanding this stuff: http://randsinrepose.com http://randsinrepose.com http://www.randsinrepose.com/cat_management.html http://www.randsinrepose.com/cat_management.html
  - Ygg2 14y ago
    I don't think that works because if management is incompetent enough to neglect problems they are creating, do you think they are competent enough to realize they are causing them?
    - notimetorelax 14y ago
      Sure there are many shades of gray. But, for example, if you keep telling your management (as in writing e-mails with CC to higher management or have it written in the meeting minutes) that we need more file servers because we might run out of space and they ignore it, then when it happens and you're not around to fix this next time they may think twice before ignoring your advice. On the other hand if you resolve the issue yourself it can happen that no-one will notice.
      - nasmorn 14y ago
        Very true. My client was always talking about how much better development could move forward if we worked with a bigger agency, so I stopped stalling it and let him spend a bit of his money to learn firsthand how much "better" everything gets. Afterwards I fixed everything they broke (paid by the hour of course) and haven't heard complaints since.
  - blablabla123 14y ago
    >> let them suffer >I agree to that. If management doesn't feel pain of its mistakes it does not have an incentive to improve. This makes sense, but how do you do that without hurting yourself?
    - Zenst 14y ago
      By planning your holidays. 1) Identify issue and alert manager that it needs addressing - say ew say clock changes for summertime as a poor obvious example. 2) manager ignores it with it will be fine mentality as nothing is on fire at the time 3) you book holiday when you expect shit to hit fan Shit hits fan, you have issue documented as you alerted your manager and got response not an issue so you booked holiday and not there. With that you can not be blamed. Also ALL IT people worth there salt work above and beyond what there contract states - so if your contract is for DBA work, that is not sys admin work, that is not crawling under desks networking or desktop support - but you help out and do those things. So with that if it is outside your scope of your work contract then again you have the ability to ignore it as well. But the holiday approach is the best. But there are 3 types of managers - those that can do your job, those that think they can do your job and those that will admit they have no idea. Then ontop of that there are those that can balance dealing with you and sheilding you from HR and the other crap and then there are those that just look after themselfs and smile to your face and say all sorts behind your back. As a rule a manager that can do your job is one you will get on with, ones that can not do your job are less likely to be good managers I have found, though have met some that are and there is no hard and fast rule or way to single the good from the bad sadly until your few months into a job.
- ekianjo 14y ago
  > Secret I found out myself is do not mix what you like to do with what you are paid to do A very good advice I have always followed. This may not be true if you have your own company, however - since you will need a lot of drive to make things move forward.
adaml_623 14y ago
I think you'll find that it's a common fear. But not so common a thing to happen. Lots of sensible things like exercise and leisure activities will work wonders to distract you from your stresses and worries

Zenst 14y ago

Secret I ofund out myself is do not mix what you like to do with what you are paid to do. If you like your job fine, but remember you are paid the same. Many many companies will not reward that extra mile and many performance reviews are completely insulting as everybody gets the same % in so many companies and the variation between poor peope and good is probably an extra .5% pay rise. So unless you are working for yourself, then work to rule will keep you sane. Use your hindsight to plan holidays, if managment don't listern in a timely manner about a potentual problem then just plan that week off down the line and let them suffer - sadly it is the only way you can stay sane and they can pay for there mistakes. Its hard out there, don't make it harder on yourself.

notimetorelax 14y ago
> let them suffer I agree to that. If management doesn't feel pain of its mistakes it does not have an incentive to improve.
- corwinstephen 14y ago
  This is going to sound insulting and I don't mean it that way, but does anyone ever wonder about the fact that managers are frequently considerably less intelligent than the people they manage? I think that's what drives the frustration a lot of the time. The thing is, just because they're less intelligent doesn't mean they're not good managers, but it think it certainly makes it a lot harder for programmers, who are usually very bright, to accept the choices their managers make when they don't particularly agree with them. Having said that, I think a good compromise would be to make sure that the people who get assigned to managerial positions have formerly had the job of the people they manage. That way they're likely to understand the pinpoints and the frustrations and be motivated to eliminate them. Obviously not all programmers will qualify for this job, but some certainly will.
  - virtualwhys 14y ago
    Completely agree, a manger without a technical (coding, sysadmin, etc.) background has a weak foundation: how can they make decisions without knowing the domain itself? Not so sure coders trump managers in the intelligence dept. After all, managers tend to earn more, and do less; I'd say they're brilliant in this respect ;-)
  - JanezStupar 14y ago
    I guess that you are still a novice. Usually managers did the work of their underlings. However seldomly a competent person gets promoted - as you need someone to do the work. And since the less competent person will be relatively better manager than producer in comparison to the competent person, the less competent guy gets the promotion. I strongly advise everyone to read the Putt's Law, where this phenomena is broken down in great depth.
    - UK-AL 14y ago
      "managers did the work of their underlings." - only in very traditional companies that promote on seniority. Its not uncommon for someone straight out of college, working as an "ideas" man to manage programmers.
      - JanezStupar 14y ago
        I apologize. My comment refers to the managers ascended from the developer ranks. People without technical knowledge in the roles of technical managers are in a league of their own when it comes to suck.
  - PakG1 14y ago
    The fact of the matter is that a lot of technical people who are geniuses technically do not have the qualities necessary to be good managers. Good managing requires ability to communicate up, down, and across the corporate hierarchy and the political minefield that comes with it. Good managers will balance out good technical people in terms of skillset, and help their team to do their job, while also coaching them in the areas where they are weak (and if the manager is weak technically, then obviously technical coaching is not in scope). Good managers will filter what reaches inside their team from the outside and protect their team from crap while captaining the ship forward. They know their weaknesses and also know that good leadership requires hiring people who are smarter than you are, and then helping to facilitate the magic that can happen when good people get together. Having managers who are strong both technically and in a business sense is rare. There are only so many Elon Musks in the world. But when you work with one, your work becomes very enjoyable. At the end of the day, team members don't have visibility as to what managers do every day. This blog is great for understanding this stuff: http://randsinrepose.com http://randsinrepose.com http://www.randsinrepose.com/cat_management.html http://www.randsinrepose.com/cat_management.html
- Ygg2 14y ago
  I don't think that works because if management is incompetent enough to neglect problems they are creating, do you think they are competent enough to realize they are causing them?
  - notimetorelax 14y ago
    Sure there are many shades of gray. But, for example, if you keep telling your management (as in writing e-mails with CC to higher management or have it written in the meeting minutes) that we need more file servers because we might run out of space and they ignore it, then when it happens and you're not around to fix this next time they may think twice before ignoring your advice. On the other hand if you resolve the issue yourself it can happen that no-one will notice.
    - nasmorn 14y ago
      Very true. My client was always talking about how much better development could move forward if we worked with a bigger agency, so I stopped stalling it and let him spend a bit of his money to learn firsthand how much "better" everything gets. Afterwards I fixed everything they broke (paid by the hour of course) and haven't heard complaints since.
- blablabla123 14y ago
  >> let them suffer >I agree to that. If management doesn't feel pain of its mistakes it does not have an incentive to improve. This makes sense, but how do you do that without hurting yourself?
  - Zenst 14y ago
    By planning your holidays. 1) Identify issue and alert manager that it needs addressing - say ew say clock changes for summertime as a poor obvious example. 2) manager ignores it with it will be fine mentality as nothing is on fire at the time 3) you book holiday when you expect shit to hit fan Shit hits fan, you have issue documented as you alerted your manager and got response not an issue so you booked holiday and not there. With that you can not be blamed. Also ALL IT people worth there salt work above and beyond what there contract states - so if your contract is for DBA work, that is not sys admin work, that is not crawling under desks networking or desktop support - but you help out and do those things. So with that if it is outside your scope of your work contract then again you have the ability to ignore it as well. But the holiday approach is the best. But there are 3 types of managers - those that can do your job, those that think they can do your job and those that will admit they have no idea. Then ontop of that there are those that can balance dealing with you and sheilding you from HR and the other crap and then there are those that just look after themselfs and smile to your face and say all sorts behind your back. As a rule a manager that can do your job is one you will get on with, ones that can not do your job are less likely to be good managers I have found, though have met some that are and there is no hard and fast rule or way to single the good from the bad sadly until your few months into a job.
ekianjo 14y ago
> Secret I found out myself is do not mix what you like to do with what you are paid to do A very good advice I have always followed. This may not be true if you have your own company, however - since you will need a lot of drive to make things move forward.

adaml_623 14y ago

I think you'll find that it's a common fear. But not so common a thing to happen. Lots of sensible things like exercise and leisure activities will work wonders to distract you from your stresses and worries