4 ms·

> 2. Cheerleading - Overt sexualisation of teenaged and pre-teen girls. Sheesh. Really? Is it a popular opinion in the UK or just author's touchiness?

by zalew 14y ago

ColinWright 14y ago
I've just done a straw poll in my office. Of about 30 people, 5 didn't know what I was talking about, 6 didn't express an opinion, and 15 or so think it's creepy, sleezy, or both. Added in edit: You seem to have been downvoted, which is a shame given an honest question about a cultural difference, so I've upvoted you.
- zalew 14y ago
  for me it's creepy to put it in a sexual context. how many of those people frequent games that have cheerleaders? I guess some day political correctness will lead to female beach volleyball teams playing in jumpsuits.
  - ColinWright 14y ago
    > how many of those people frequent games that have cheerleaders? Probably none, and that's the point. In the UK we don't (usually) have cheerleaders. Therefore people don't go to games that have cheerleaders. Therefore when they see cheerleaders they think "What? Why are these scantily clad, nubile females flouncing around?" Because the UK culture doesn't have cheerleading (in this sense) they have no other context for it, and so it's interpreted - probably purely subconsciously - as having sexual overtones.
  - summerdown2 14y ago
    > for me it's creepy to put it in a sexual context. For me as a Brit, the only connection I have with cheerleaders is the web portrayal, and from what I can see they are popularly portrayed in a sexual content. A quick googling gives this sort of thing: http://bleacherreport.com/articles/560723-nfl-sexiest-cheerleaders-playoff-edition http://bleacherreport.com/articles/560723-nfl-sexiest-cheerl... Frankly I'm astonished you don't see them as sexualised.
    - zalew 14y ago
      OP said "Cheerleading - Overt sexualisation of teenaged and pre-teen girls" like it's per definition. Seriosly, there is no overt sexualization in dancing or performing acrobatics only because she wears a skirt. Maybe out of the US (I'm not American too), as you imply, cheerleaders are more of a porn fantasy girl stereotype because there is less of them in sports and they know them only from porn and comedies? I don't know. To me it sounded like it's op's imagination playing a role here. BTW none of my text search results for 'cheerleader' alone show anything even remotely erotic, and google knows I'm not a prude. When you attach 'hot' or 'sexy' to it and look at images, they won't be much different to when you attach these words to 'secretary', while first result for secretary is a movie about a stereotypically sexist portrayal of this job position with high-heeled legs on the poster.
      - summerdown2 14y ago
        I imagine you're right. I am not interested in American sports, so probably never see them in the right cultural context for America. I always presumed sites like Cracked and Huffington post were transmitting the US view to me: http://www.huffingtonpost.com/2012/11/09/dallas-mavericks-dancers-cheerleaders-uniforms-outfits_n_2100468.html http://www.huffingtonpost.com/2012/11/09/dallas-mavericks-da... http://www.cracked.com/funny-2072-cheerleaders/ http://www.cracked.com/funny-2072-cheerleaders/ Certainly in the UK it seems to me that there's a general presumption it's sexualised. For example the tabloids: http://metro.co.uk/2011/03/30/crystal-palace-fans-defend-sexy-cheerleaders-as-a-good-luck-charm-647565/ http://metro.co.uk/2011/03/30/crystal-palace-fans-defend-sex... http://www.mirror.co.uk/sport/other-sports/athletics/hottest-and-sexiest-athletes-fans-and-cheerleaders-1201517 http://www.mirror.co.uk/sport/other-sports/athletics/hottest... and even the Guardian: http://www.guardian.co.uk/sport/2006/mar/15/ussport.stevenwells http://www.guardian.co.uk/sport/2006/mar/15/ussport.stevenwe... As a single extra data point, I asked my wife about it and obvious sexuality was the first thing she mentioned. I think this may be a peculiarly British view, though. By the way, I don't think I'm a prude either. If girls over the age of consent (16 in the UK) want to be sexual I don't have a problem with it. My surprise is a cultural one that it could be viewed any other way.
arethuza 14y ago
I have to say that it does seem a bit odd to me - but an awful lot of stuff around sports in the US seem odd to me!
Osmium 14y ago
Yeah -- cheerleading is definitely seen as odd.

> 2. Cheerleading - Overt sexualisation of teenaged and pre-teen girls. Sheesh. Really? Is it a popular opinion in the UK or just author's touchiness?

by zalew 14y ago

> 2. Cheerleading - Overt sexualisation of teenaged and pre-teen girls. Sheesh. Really? Is it a popular opinion in the UK or just author's touchiness?

ColinWright 14y ago

I've just done a straw poll in my office. Of about 30 people, 5 didn't know what I was talking about, 6 didn't express an opinion, and 15 or so think it's creepy, sleezy, or both. Added in edit: You seem to have been downvoted, which is a shame given an honest question about a cultural difference, so I've upvoted you.

zalew 14y ago
for me it's creepy to put it in a sexual context. how many of those people frequent games that have cheerleaders? I guess some day political correctness will lead to female beach volleyball teams playing in jumpsuits.
- ColinWright 14y ago
  > how many of those people frequent games that have cheerleaders? Probably none, and that's the point. In the UK we don't (usually) have cheerleaders. Therefore people don't go to games that have cheerleaders. Therefore when they see cheerleaders they think "What? Why are these scantily clad, nubile females flouncing around?" Because the UK culture doesn't have cheerleading (in this sense) they have no other context for it, and so it's interpreted - probably purely subconsciously - as having sexual overtones.
- summerdown2 14y ago
  > for me it's creepy to put it in a sexual context. For me as a Brit, the only connection I have with cheerleaders is the web portrayal, and from what I can see they are popularly portrayed in a sexual content. A quick googling gives this sort of thing: http://bleacherreport.com/articles/560723-nfl-sexiest-cheerleaders-playoff-edition http://bleacherreport.com/articles/560723-nfl-sexiest-cheerl... Frankly I'm astonished you don't see them as sexualised.
  - zalew 14y ago
    OP said "Cheerleading - Overt sexualisation of teenaged and pre-teen girls" like it's per definition. Seriosly, there is no overt sexualization in dancing or performing acrobatics only because she wears a skirt. Maybe out of the US (I'm not American too), as you imply, cheerleaders are more of a porn fantasy girl stereotype because there is less of them in sports and they know them only from porn and comedies? I don't know. To me it sounded like it's op's imagination playing a role here. BTW none of my text search results for 'cheerleader' alone show anything even remotely erotic, and google knows I'm not a prude. When you attach 'hot' or 'sexy' to it and look at images, they won't be much different to when you attach these words to 'secretary', while first result for secretary is a movie about a stereotypically sexist portrayal of this job position with high-heeled legs on the poster.
    - summerdown2 14y ago
      I imagine you're right. I am not interested in American sports, so probably never see them in the right cultural context for America. I always presumed sites like Cracked and Huffington post were transmitting the US view to me: http://www.huffingtonpost.com/2012/11/09/dallas-mavericks-dancers-cheerleaders-uniforms-outfits_n_2100468.html http://www.huffingtonpost.com/2012/11/09/dallas-mavericks-da... http://www.cracked.com/funny-2072-cheerleaders/ http://www.cracked.com/funny-2072-cheerleaders/ Certainly in the UK it seems to me that there's a general presumption it's sexualised. For example the tabloids: http://metro.co.uk/2011/03/30/crystal-palace-fans-defend-sexy-cheerleaders-as-a-good-luck-charm-647565/ http://metro.co.uk/2011/03/30/crystal-palace-fans-defend-sex... http://www.mirror.co.uk/sport/other-sports/athletics/hottest-and-sexiest-athletes-fans-and-cheerleaders-1201517 http://www.mirror.co.uk/sport/other-sports/athletics/hottest... and even the Guardian: http://www.guardian.co.uk/sport/2006/mar/15/ussport.stevenwells http://www.guardian.co.uk/sport/2006/mar/15/ussport.stevenwe... As a single extra data point, I asked my wife about it and obvious sexuality was the first thing she mentioned. I think this may be a peculiarly British view, though. By the way, I don't think I'm a prude either. If girls over the age of consent (16 in the UK) want to be sexual I don't have a problem with it. My surprise is a cultural one that it could be viewed any other way.

arethuza 14y ago

I have to say that it does seem a bit odd to me - but an awful lot of stuff around sports in the US seem odd to me!

Osmium 14y ago

Yeah -- cheerleading is definitely seen as odd.