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I'm thinking: how can this be exploited? Can someone just say they're building a new way to shorten urls and need two years in the country to build their busine

by yan 18y ago

I'm thinking: how can this be exploited? Can someone just say they're building a new way to shorten urls and need two years in the country to build their business to fruition? And what defines success or progress?

pclark 18y ago
investment
pg 18y ago
That's why you use investors as the test. I don't think you need to define progress.
- shiro 18y ago
  There are big companies hungry for H-1Bs; could they exploit this new visa by "investing" small amount of money and then outsourcing some of their work into this newly created "company"?
  - pg 18y ago
    They wouldn't be certified as startup investors.
    - jam 18y ago
      Google Ventures seems like a good proxy for this behavior.
tomsaffell 18y ago
If someone did apply under false pretenses, get here, and do nothing, then what would be the negative impact on the country? PG's suggestion was that they cannot work for other companies, so they are not depriving anyone of a job. They will have to live somehow (on whomever's money they have), and that will go into the local economy. If you add a clause to the visa that they cannot claim any type of social welfare, then I think the potential downside of 'gaming' nowhere near outweighs* all the potential upsides. * - opportunity cost of the 10,000 spots excepted, which is why you have the right folks picking the 10,000.
- calambrac 18y ago
  Maybe add a requirement to hold in escrow enough money to ship the person back, for the case where their startup fails?
- erlanger 18y ago
  I worked full-time is a freelancer for quite a while. Nobody asked for my papers, and I won't say anything about taxes. I could've easily laid low when (the few) clients called asking for info (SSN, etc.) for my 1099s, as income was distributed well enough that none would think it a big deal to not send me one. There's an underground economy, and it doesn't always involve narcotics/guns/prostitutes/dog fighting/etc. While I deposited checks (one potential obstacle), I don't think anybody would have quaffed if I asked them to pay me via PayPal, where I could transfer the money to a friend's ("accomplice's") bank account.
gills 18y ago
Here's a random attack vector. Step 1. Pay lobbyist to add the following clause to the rules: "Treasury will provide 20:1 non-recourse loans to participating investors" -- to attract the 'hot money' and foreign capital, of course. Just copy the clause right from PPIP, in case you think it's not possible. Step 2. Wealthy foreign investor: send random minion on 2-year luxury vacation to the U.S. Invest in minion's "startup" through some convoluted channel (perhaps a Wall St. Bank's unofficial immigrant startup investment fund). Step 3. Sell "consulting services" to minion's startup using your U.S. shell company. Step 4. Free Money. Obviously there are good and easy ways to prevent this absurd little tinfoil hat scenario I've constructed in the bat-filled cavern where my brain should be. But considering the recent track record of our government botching up finance-related issues, I wouldn't expect anything less...

by yan 18y ago

pclark 18y ago

investment

pg 18y ago

That's why you use investors as the test. I don't think you need to define progress.

shiro 18y ago
There are big companies hungry for H-1Bs; could they exploit this new visa by "investing" small amount of money and then outsourcing some of their work into this newly created "company"?
- pg 18y ago
  They wouldn't be certified as startup investors.
  - jam 18y ago
    Google Ventures seems like a good proxy for this behavior.

tomsaffell 18y ago

If someone did apply under false pretenses, get here, and do nothing, then what would be the negative impact on the country? PG's suggestion was that they cannot work for other companies, so they are not depriving anyone of a job. They will have to live somehow (on whomever's money they have), and that will go into the local economy. If you add a clause to the visa that they cannot claim any type of social welfare, then I think the potential downside of 'gaming' nowhere near outweighs* all the potential upsides. * - opportunity cost of the 10,000 spots excepted, which is why you have the right folks picking the 10,000.

calambrac 18y ago
Maybe add a requirement to hold in escrow enough money to ship the person back, for the case where their startup fails?
erlanger 18y ago
I worked full-time is a freelancer for quite a while. Nobody asked for my papers, and I won't say anything about taxes. I could've easily laid low when (the few) clients called asking for info (SSN, etc.) for my 1099s, as income was distributed well enough that none would think it a big deal to not send me one. There's an underground economy, and it doesn't always involve narcotics/guns/prostitutes/dog fighting/etc. While I deposited checks (one potential obstacle), I don't think anybody would have quaffed if I asked them to pay me via PayPal, where I could transfer the money to a friend's ("accomplice's") bank account.

gills 18y ago

Here's a random attack vector. Step 1. Pay lobbyist to add the following clause to the rules: "Treasury will provide 20:1 non-recourse loans to participating investors" -- to attract the 'hot money' and foreign capital, of course. Just copy the clause right from PPIP, in case you think it's not possible. Step 2. Wealthy foreign investor: send random minion on 2-year luxury vacation to the U.S. Invest in minion's "startup" through some convoluted channel (perhaps a Wall St. Bank's unofficial immigrant startup investment fund). Step 3. Sell "consulting services" to minion's startup using your U.S. shell company. Step 4. Free Money. Obviously there are good and easy ways to prevent this absurd little tinfoil hat scenario I've constructed in the bat-filled cavern where my brain should be. But considering the recent track record of our government botching up finance-related issues, I wouldn't expect anything less...