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I think this is a problem with eBay. For some reason, sellers desperately need and want your good feedback, and a single bad feedback, even for something as tin

I think this is a problem with eBay. For some reason, sellers desperately need and want your good feedback, and a single bad feedback, even for something as tiny as a $1.44 postage stamp, seems to have a very bad impact on the seller. In real life, one bad review about something like this on someone with a good track record doesn't hurt the slightest bit. Why does it hurt so much in the eBay review system, and can't they improve that? (So that I don't have to feel guilty when not saying "super awesome 5 stars" to a seller who was just "good").

DanBC 14y ago
I've just started using ebay. I look at the feedback because I realise (from years of reading Amazon reviews) that people sometimes give bad feedback for something outside the seller's control, even if the seller tried to correct the error. So this bad feedback wouldn't have bothered me. But I guess some / many people don't check the details. When you have two sellers listing the same item with similar 'buy it now' prices and packaging I guess feedback is the only other metric someone can check. Since ebay sellers cut costs and profits as far as possible having similar prices is pretty common.
- shiftpgdn 14y ago
  It actually expands far, far beyond that. eBay is extraordinarily merchant hostile and just a few back feedback over the course of a thousand auctions can trigger automated blocks that prevent you from listing more than a handful of auctions at a time[1]. For a major eBay seller this is basically a death sentence. Additionally your detailed seller rating or DSR determine how much of a discount you get on the extremely steep eBay feed[2]. Again for major sellers, especially people selling ultra low margin items such as phone accessories the 20% discount on ebay's final value fee will mean the difference between being able to competitively price their product and simply going out of business. [1]http://www.aspkin.com/forums/ebay-suspensions/29924-ebay-account-limited-please-help.html http://www.aspkin.com/forums/ebay-suspensions/29924-ebay-acc... [2]http://pages.ebay.com/services/buyandsell/powerseller/benefits/discounts_faq.html#4 http://pages.ebay.com/services/buyandsell/powerseller/benefi...
- claudius 14y ago
  > something outside the seller's control It depends. For me, the seller is fully responsible for shipping, and any added postage, while well outside the seller’s control, is attributed to the seller. I also do not want the seller to correct an error, I want the seller not to make an error. If you fail at that, I will leave bad feedback, and if it causes you to go out of business, I couldn’t care less. Do your job better next time.
  - MDCore 14y ago
    > If you fail at that, I will leave bad feedback, and if it causes you to go out of business, I couldn’t care less. Do your job better next time. Wow. One small mistake and they should go out of business. Are you treated that way in your job?
    - speeder 14y ago
      How you dare forget this ; and break the build? You are fired.
      - DanBC 14y ago
        ...and in this case it's not even the seller who forgot the semi-colon. The seller asked if a semi-colon was needed and was told it wasn't, only for the build to break on compile, leaving Bob to edit the source. But the seller offered to edit the source for Bob.
    - pc86 14y ago
      Of course. If he was he'd be here on HN crying about how the evil corporation doesn't care about its employees. Pure hypocrisy.
    - mcherm 14y ago
      Accurately stating that the seller failed to cover $1.44 of postage is a VALID reason to leave bad feedback. It is not a valid reason to put someone out of business. If eBay chooses to put someone out of business over a one-line review that reveals a $1.44 oversight, then eBay is the culprit here, not the complainant. The person complaining shouldn't have to care: it's not their fault that others are overreacting.
tachion 14y ago
Perhaps there should be some weight parameter added to both positive and negative feedback, where the value of the sale is being compared to total sold goods value makes the feedback more or less relevant: if you're mostly dealing with expensive laptops, and then you've sold broken pair of cheap headphones, then it should matter less, than when you're selling cheap headphones and you've sold broken expensive laptop. This is from top of my head, but I bet there are many other ways to improve rather old, and no more ideal eBay feedback system.
ScottWhigham 14y ago
What you see as a problem, I see as a positive. This is clearly an edge case - it's not the norm by far. The norm is that sellers make darn sure that their product is "as advertised" so that they've set the expectations correctly. This results in higher feedback for the seller. Sure, you have some slime ball sellers there who say, "Give me 5 stars!" but that, again, is not the norm.
- rallison 14y ago
  And, in the case of this seller, it appears this was not an isolated incident. In their reply to the one star review, they state: Sorry- no idea there was postage due. This has happened alot from USPS lately. http://feedback.ebay.com/ws/eBayISAPI.dll?ViewFeedback2&userid=med_express_sales&iid=-1&de=off&items=25&which=negative&interval=180&_trkparms=negative_180 http://feedback.ebay.com/ws/eBayISAPI.dll?ViewFeedback2&...
  - yebyen 14y ago
    So, where is the case against USPS? Clearly they are the ones at fault. Also not an isolated incident. Does this really happen? You take the package to the post office, they weigh the package, charge you money, give you a receipt, and then later demand money from the recipient in order to finally deliver the package?
    - Karunamon 14y ago
      Nah, the package isn't weighed twice. More likely than not the seller weighed it themselves and used a calculator (either on eBay's website or with an app like Stamps.com) to figure the amount, which was off by a bit.
jonaldomo 14y ago
I think this could be solved with community reviews of reviews. Although it is factual mistakes happen. Example, did the buyer make good on it? Is this a pattern? If the public could vote up or down on reviews to increase or decrease the weight of the rating this would be a non issue.

DanBC 14y ago

I've just started using ebay. I look at the feedback because I realise (from years of reading Amazon reviews) that people sometimes give bad feedback for something outside the seller's control, even if the seller tried to correct the error. So this bad feedback wouldn't have bothered me. But I guess some / many people don't check the details. When you have two sellers listing the same item with similar 'buy it now' prices and packaging I guess feedback is the only other metric someone can check. Since ebay sellers cut costs and profits as far as possible having similar prices is pretty common.

shiftpgdn 14y ago
It actually expands far, far beyond that. eBay is extraordinarily merchant hostile and just a few back feedback over the course of a thousand auctions can trigger automated blocks that prevent you from listing more than a handful of auctions at a time[1]. For a major eBay seller this is basically a death sentence. Additionally your detailed seller rating or DSR determine how much of a discount you get on the extremely steep eBay feed[2]. Again for major sellers, especially people selling ultra low margin items such as phone accessories the 20% discount on ebay's final value fee will mean the difference between being able to competitively price their product and simply going out of business. [1]http://www.aspkin.com/forums/ebay-suspensions/29924-ebay-account-limited-please-help.html http://www.aspkin.com/forums/ebay-suspensions/29924-ebay-acc... [2]http://pages.ebay.com/services/buyandsell/powerseller/benefits/discounts_faq.html#4 http://pages.ebay.com/services/buyandsell/powerseller/benefi...
claudius 14y ago
> something outside the seller's control It depends. For me, the seller is fully responsible for shipping, and any added postage, while well outside the seller’s control, is attributed to the seller. I also do not want the seller to correct an error, I want the seller not to make an error. If you fail at that, I will leave bad feedback, and if it causes you to go out of business, I couldn’t care less. Do your job better next time.
- MDCore 14y ago
  > If you fail at that, I will leave bad feedback, and if it causes you to go out of business, I couldn’t care less. Do your job better next time. Wow. One small mistake and they should go out of business. Are you treated that way in your job?
  - speeder 14y ago
    How you dare forget this ; and break the build? You are fired.
    - DanBC 14y ago
      ...and in this case it's not even the seller who forgot the semi-colon. The seller asked if a semi-colon was needed and was told it wasn't, only for the build to break on compile, leaving Bob to edit the source. But the seller offered to edit the source for Bob.
  - pc86 14y ago
    Of course. If he was he'd be here on HN crying about how the evil corporation doesn't care about its employees. Pure hypocrisy.
  - mcherm 14y ago
    Accurately stating that the seller failed to cover $1.44 of postage is a VALID reason to leave bad feedback. It is not a valid reason to put someone out of business. If eBay chooses to put someone out of business over a one-line review that reveals a $1.44 oversight, then eBay is the culprit here, not the complainant. The person complaining shouldn't have to care: it's not their fault that others are overreacting.

tachion 14y ago

Perhaps there should be some weight parameter added to both positive and negative feedback, where the value of the sale is being compared to total sold goods value makes the feedback more or less relevant: if you're mostly dealing with expensive laptops, and then you've sold broken pair of cheap headphones, then it should matter less, than when you're selling cheap headphones and you've sold broken expensive laptop. This is from top of my head, but I bet there are many other ways to improve rather old, and no more ideal eBay feedback system.

ScottWhigham 14y ago

What you see as a problem, I see as a positive. This is clearly an edge case - it's not the norm by far. The norm is that sellers make darn sure that their product is "as advertised" so that they've set the expectations correctly. This results in higher feedback for the seller. Sure, you have some slime ball sellers there who say, "Give me 5 stars!" but that, again, is not the norm.

rallison 14y ago
And, in the case of this seller, it appears this was not an isolated incident. In their reply to the one star review, they state: Sorry- no idea there was postage due. This has happened alot from USPS lately. http://feedback.ebay.com/ws/eBayISAPI.dll?ViewFeedback2&userid=med_express_sales&iid=-1&de=off&items=25&which=negative&interval=180&_trkparms=negative_180 http://feedback.ebay.com/ws/eBayISAPI.dll?ViewFeedback2&...
- yebyen 14y ago
  So, where is the case against USPS? Clearly they are the ones at fault. Also not an isolated incident. Does this really happen? You take the package to the post office, they weigh the package, charge you money, give you a receipt, and then later demand money from the recipient in order to finally deliver the package?
  - Karunamon 14y ago
    Nah, the package isn't weighed twice. More likely than not the seller weighed it themselves and used a calculator (either on eBay's website or with an app like Stamps.com) to figure the amount, which was off by a bit.

jonaldomo 14y ago

I think this could be solved with community reviews of reviews. Although it is factual mistakes happen. Example, did the buyer make good on it? Is this a pattern? If the public could vote up or down on reviews to increase or decrease the weight of the rating this would be a non issue.