3 ms·

Somehow it strikes me as odd that the executive can go around starting wars, one of the most costly (blood & gold) behaviors a gov't can engage in, and one that

by sequoia 14y ago

Somehow it strikes me as odd that the executive can go around starting wars, one of the most costly (blood & gold) behaviors a gov't can engage in, and one that explicitly requires the approval of congress, without congressional approval, but when it comes to closing a torture dungeon it's 'well gee whiz I'd love to but mean old congress won't let me. Sorry- my hands are tied!' horseshit. There's more than one way to skin a cat and with the unchecked might of the US military (which is basically what the executive commands these days with our spineless-vis-a-vis-war congress), I do not believe the president couldn't figure out a way to dissolve Gitmo if he wanted to. He doesn't want to, this torture happens because Obama wants it to happen. EDIT: I'm probably wrong here in my first paragraph ^

parfe 14y ago
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Iraq_Resolution http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Iraq_Resolution http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Authorization_for_Use_of_Military_Force_Against_Terrorists http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Authorization_for_Use_of_Milita... Fair disingenuous so say the President started wars without congressional approval.
- sequoia 14y ago
  My statement that wars were started "without congressional approval" may be wrong. That said, I still do not believe that it's outside the president's power to shut down gitmo. As many other commenters here have pointed out, he could simply order marines to free those prisoners with no charges to Cuban soil; this would cost no money at all; congress would not be able to prevent it. Could the president not do this? Furthermore, he promised to do so repeatedly during his campaign. Was the president, a constitutional scholar, merely mistaken about his powers as the executive? I apologize for muddying the waters with discussion of other presidential actions.
  - parfe 14y ago
    http://www.whitehouse.gov/the_press_office/ClosureOfGuantanamoDetentionFacilities http://www.whitehouse.gov/the_press_office/ClosureOfGuantana... Obama issued the order to close the prison his second full day in office. Congress then blocked any funds whatsoever from being used to close the prison. http://politics.nytimes.com/congress/votes/111/senate/1/196 http://politics.nytimes.com/congress/votes/111/senate/1/196 No, the president can't just release prisoners into Cuba because A) Cuba is a sovereign country and the US doesn't get to just deposit individuals there, terrorist or not. B) The president literally cannot pay for any operation, at all, to close the prison. I suggest you read up more on the issue before forming such a strong opinion.
    - sequoia 14y ago
      If this decision is so clearly and unequivocally not his to make, why did he promise to do it in the first place? Is he stupid or a liar? I don't think he's stupid.
      - parfe 14y ago
        Are you American? A majority of Presidential campaign platforms are issues which also need Congressional approval. Tax Reform, healthcare, domestic policy, spending cuts, and budgets. Obama did what he said, but congress blocked him. He's neither stupid, nor a liar for that. Any more than he would have been lying if Congress blocked healthcare reform.

by sequoia 14y ago

parfe 14y ago

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Iraq_Resolution http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Iraq_Resolution http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Authorization_for_Use_of_Military_Force_Against_Terrorists http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Authorization_for_Use_of_Milita... Fair disingenuous so say the President started wars without congressional approval.

sequoia 14y ago
My statement that wars were started "without congressional approval" may be wrong. That said, I still do not believe that it's outside the president's power to shut down gitmo. As many other commenters here have pointed out, he could simply order marines to free those prisoners with no charges to Cuban soil; this would cost no money at all; congress would not be able to prevent it. Could the president not do this? Furthermore, he promised to do so repeatedly during his campaign. Was the president, a constitutional scholar, merely mistaken about his powers as the executive? I apologize for muddying the waters with discussion of other presidential actions.
- parfe 14y ago
  http://www.whitehouse.gov/the_press_office/ClosureOfGuantanamoDetentionFacilities http://www.whitehouse.gov/the_press_office/ClosureOfGuantana... Obama issued the order to close the prison his second full day in office. Congress then blocked any funds whatsoever from being used to close the prison. http://politics.nytimes.com/congress/votes/111/senate/1/196 http://politics.nytimes.com/congress/votes/111/senate/1/196 No, the president can't just release prisoners into Cuba because A) Cuba is a sovereign country and the US doesn't get to just deposit individuals there, terrorist or not. B) The president literally cannot pay for any operation, at all, to close the prison. I suggest you read up more on the issue before forming such a strong opinion.
  - sequoia 14y ago
    If this decision is so clearly and unequivocally not his to make, why did he promise to do it in the first place? Is he stupid or a liar? I don't think he's stupid.
    - parfe 14y ago
      Are you American? A majority of Presidential campaign platforms are issues which also need Congressional approval. Tax Reform, healthcare, domestic policy, spending cuts, and budgets. Obama did what he said, but congress blocked him. He's neither stupid, nor a liar for that. Any more than he would have been lying if Congress blocked healthcare reform.