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Yes. Rubygems is the project that was run as amateur hour, not Debian. EDIT: And before anyone mentions it: http://marc.info/?l=openssl-dev&m=114652287210110&

by alrs 14y ago

Yes. Rubygems is the project that was run as amateur hour, not Debian. EDIT: And before anyone mentions it: http://marc.info/?l=openssl-dev&m=114652287210110&w=2 http://marc.info/?l=openssl-dev&m=114652287210110&w=...

sciurus 14y ago
I'm not sure it's worth stirring this up again, the different viewpoints are already clearly discussed at https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=2059964 https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=2059964, and the Debian Ruby maintainers have made several policy changes since then.
ivix 14y ago
After trying to install a rails app on Ubuntu , frankly the entirety of ruby and its notion of how a mature language should be packaged is pure amateur hour. Rvm is a mess, the various versions are a mess. For example v1.9.3 appears to be considered the same as 1.9.1, and random bugs appear when moving between versions. WTF?
- kawsper 14y ago
  I don't understand your issues with Ruby on Ubuntu, setting it up with RBenv is fairly simple, you can see my build script here: https://gist.github.com/kaspergrubbe/5383877 https://gist.github.com/kaspergrubbe/5383877 About 1.9.3 and 1.9.1 are you sure that it isn't about this issue described here: http://stackoverflow.com/questions/8564210/why-are-we-installing-ruby-1-9-2-1-9-3-gems-into-a-1-9-1-folder http://stackoverflow.com/questions/8564210/why-are-we-instal... ?
  - alrs 14y ago
    You never use tools like rbenv or rvm on production servers. They exist so that mac devs can be running the same versions of ruby found in the Linux distros.
    - andyl 14y ago
      Well, I use Debian for development and production, and I would never use Debian ruby packages on production. With the Debian packages, you have no idea what version you're getting. And then gem installs can only be done by the root user, not the deploy user. What a mess. Godspeed Leader Nussbaum! I hope that your first action is to find a replacement for whoever was responsible for the debian-ruby disaster.
      - _delirium 14y ago
        I haven't used Ruby much, but the Debian approach works well for me in Perl. I like that instead of pulling random packages off CPAN with no testing, I can depend on a Debian package of a Perl module, which is integration-tested with the rest of the distribution and release-managed, especially in terms of which other packages and versions it works with.
        kawsper 14y ago
        How do you ensure which versions of the packages that you receive? It is nice to rely on system-packages, but if you depend on certain versions of certain packages you might see problems with that approach.
        ars 14y ago
        If you depend on certain versions of a package you have bigger problems.
        kawsper 14y ago
        Yeah, legacy systems, you are fortunate if you don't have to deal with these.
        deleted 14y ago
        [deleted]
      - alrs 14y ago
- clark-kent 14y ago
  I'm not sure why most tutorials suggests installing RVM. You don't need rvm unless you are a running multiple rubies. You can install v1.9.3 from apt-get install ruby1.9.3. And a production server shouldn't run RVM. RVM just adds unnecessary complexity.

by alrs 14y ago

sciurus 14y ago

I'm not sure it's worth stirring this up again, the different viewpoints are already clearly discussed at https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=2059964 https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=2059964, and the Debian Ruby maintainers have made several policy changes since then.

ivix 14y ago

After trying to install a rails app on Ubuntu , frankly the entirety of ruby and its notion of how a mature language should be packaged is pure amateur hour. Rvm is a mess, the various versions are a mess. For example v1.9.3 appears to be considered the same as 1.9.1, and random bugs appear when moving between versions. WTF?

kawsper 14y ago
I don't understand your issues with Ruby on Ubuntu, setting it up with RBenv is fairly simple, you can see my build script here: https://gist.github.com/kaspergrubbe/5383877 https://gist.github.com/kaspergrubbe/5383877 About 1.9.3 and 1.9.1 are you sure that it isn't about this issue described here: http://stackoverflow.com/questions/8564210/why-are-we-installing-ruby-1-9-2-1-9-3-gems-into-a-1-9-1-folder http://stackoverflow.com/questions/8564210/why-are-we-instal... ?
- alrs 14y ago
  You never use tools like rbenv or rvm on production servers. They exist so that mac devs can be running the same versions of ruby found in the Linux distros.
  - andyl 14y ago
    Well, I use Debian for development and production, and I would never use Debian ruby packages on production. With the Debian packages, you have no idea what version you're getting. And then gem installs can only be done by the root user, not the deploy user. What a mess. Godspeed Leader Nussbaum! I hope that your first action is to find a replacement for whoever was responsible for the debian-ruby disaster.
    - _delirium 14y ago
      I haven't used Ruby much, but the Debian approach works well for me in Perl. I like that instead of pulling random packages off CPAN with no testing, I can depend on a Debian package of a Perl module, which is integration-tested with the rest of the distribution and release-managed, especially in terms of which other packages and versions it works with.
      - kawsper 14y ago
        How do you ensure which versions of the packages that you receive? It is nice to rely on system-packages, but if you depend on certain versions of certain packages you might see problems with that approach.
        ars 14y ago
        If you depend on certain versions of a package you have bigger problems.
        kawsper 14y ago
        Yeah, legacy systems, you are fortunate if you don't have to deal with these.
        deleted 14y ago
        [deleted]
    - alrs 14y ago
clark-kent 14y ago
I'm not sure why most tutorials suggests installing RVM. You don't need rvm unless you are a running multiple rubies. You can install v1.9.3 from apt-get install ruby1.9.3. And a production server shouldn't run RVM. RVM just adds unnecessary complexity.