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I'm caught in an interesting trap where a third of my friends are set to become doctors, a third investment bankers/consultants, and another third will be going

I'm caught in an interesting trap where a third of my friends are set to become doctors, a third investment bankers/consultants, and another third will be going into tech. I'm also in Canada. When our medical school friends explain their debt, my IB friends get really excited and start cursing them for their luck. Here, apparently, in addition to student loans that don't accrue interest until 6 months after graduation, all medical students are apparently eligible for a $250,000 line of credit at PRIME. Yes, you heard me--PRIME. At this point, my tech friends start to ask why anyone would take debt. Here in Canada, an emergency doctor would make about $250,000/year in Ontario for working what works out (in shifts) to be about 25 hours per week, after he has finished his residency. Assuming this is a similar situation in the states, I don't see why this is so outrageous at all. Oh, and Doctor shortage? Really? It's medical schools that cap entrants, not the price. Take a look at all the qualified students who are rejected each year. I know a bunch.

rayiner 13y ago
In the states, federal graduate student loans are 8%.
- ryanhuff 13y ago
  Are you sure? When I did my MBA a few years ago, student loans were about 6.5%, and I thought I heard that rates were lower today.
  - rayiner 13y ago
    There are Stafford loans at 6.5% but they only go up to like $20k/year. GradPLUS covers the bulk of the cost and is at 7.9%.
eterpstra 13y ago
The reason medical schools cap the number of entrants is the same reason they raise tuition exponentially - it's expensive to run a medical school. It has nothing to do with the number of applicants. Also, 25 hours per week? My wife is a physician. Nobody at her hospital works less than 60. Most work 80 or more. Surgeons are close to 100. For many full time primary care physicians, it works out to about $10 / hour when first starting out.
- nmcfarl 13y ago
  But that $10/hr is gone once you are out of residency. And particularly for the Surgeons - who are still working 100 hours - the real money starts. Med Schools is a fine financial decision at this point in history. Lots of debt - but lots of jobs, with good pay as well.
ruswick 13y ago
I may have to reexamine my chosen career path, and my nationality. :p In all honesty, this seems almost too good to be true, especially given the state of healthcare in America. At 25 hours per week, it would take three Canadian doctors to perform the labor done by a single American doctor at a significant markup. (At least right out of a residency. I am not entirely aware of salaries, but I've heard on multiple occasions that a new doctor will make between $100k-$150k.) I'm curious as to why Canadian hospitals choose to emplace such short shifts, and why there is such a massive price disparity between nations of similar prosperity and social norms.
arn 13y ago
> Here in Canada, an emergency doctor would make about $250,000/year in Ontario for working what works out (in shifts) to be about 25 hours per week, after he has finished his residency. Ya, not even sure if this is true in Canada, but it's not true in the U.S. That would be 2 days a week of typical ER shift work here (12 hour shifts). Schedules vary, but that's a very light schedule.
nilkn 13y ago
I'm pretty sure your 25 hour quote is definitely wrong and that the true number for many surgeons is higher by a factor of around four. That said, it's true that doctors in specialties outside of family practice make an absolutely staggering amount of money, far more than anyone can hope to make in technology outside of an executive career path.

rayiner 13y ago

In the states, federal graduate student loans are 8%.

ryanhuff 13y ago
Are you sure? When I did my MBA a few years ago, student loans were about 6.5%, and I thought I heard that rates were lower today.
- rayiner 13y ago
  There are Stafford loans at 6.5% but they only go up to like $20k/year. GradPLUS covers the bulk of the cost and is at 7.9%.

eterpstra 13y ago

The reason medical schools cap the number of entrants is the same reason they raise tuition exponentially - it's expensive to run a medical school. It has nothing to do with the number of applicants. Also, 25 hours per week? My wife is a physician. Nobody at her hospital works less than 60. Most work 80 or more. Surgeons are close to 100. For many full time primary care physicians, it works out to about $10 / hour when first starting out.

nmcfarl 13y ago
But that $10/hr is gone once you are out of residency. And particularly for the Surgeons - who are still working 100 hours - the real money starts. Med Schools is a fine financial decision at this point in history. Lots of debt - but lots of jobs, with good pay as well.

ruswick 13y ago

I may have to reexamine my chosen career path, and my nationality. :p In all honesty, this seems almost too good to be true, especially given the state of healthcare in America. At 25 hours per week, it would take three Canadian doctors to perform the labor done by a single American doctor at a significant markup. (At least right out of a residency. I am not entirely aware of salaries, but I've heard on multiple occasions that a new doctor will make between $100k-$150k.) I'm curious as to why Canadian hospitals choose to emplace such short shifts, and why there is such a massive price disparity between nations of similar prosperity and social norms.

arn 13y ago

> Here in Canada, an emergency doctor would make about $250,000/year in Ontario for working what works out (in shifts) to be about 25 hours per week, after he has finished his residency. Ya, not even sure if this is true in Canada, but it's not true in the U.S. That would be 2 days a week of typical ER shift work here (12 hour shifts). Schedules vary, but that's a very light schedule.

nilkn 13y ago

I'm pretty sure your 25 hour quote is definitely wrong and that the true number for many surgeons is higher by a factor of around four. That said, it's true that doctors in specialties outside of family practice make an absolutely staggering amount of money, far more than anyone can hope to make in technology outside of an executive career path.