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That's being a little disingenuous. From the article, the expected costs of private schools was ~ $278K, but still $207K for public schools. I accrued nearly $

by mbreese 14y ago

That's being a little disingenuous. From the article, the expected costs of private schools was ~ $278K, but still $207K for public schools. I accrued nearly $40K from one year of medical school before I switched to a straight PhD (I was in an MD/PhD program that didn't cover tuition). And that was over 10 years ago. Oh, and I was at Indiana University, a public school (and the only MD school in the state). My wife, however, did finish her MD (and PhD). She decided to go into a specialty, partially because the salary for general practice physicians (she's a pediatrician) is just too low. So, yes, medical school costs - public and private - are ridiculously high. Because of this, the number of doctors is just going to decrease. The only ones who are left will be a) those who can afford it, b) those who really want to be doctors - costs be damned. And all of them are going to be overworked. Now, couple that to the fact that GP's don't get paid very much in comparison to specialists, and you have a worse problem. Summary: the article is right - it doesn't pay to be a doctor. (Then again, I'm an academic, so I still made a bad choice!)

swampthing 14y ago
It's an interesting question - is this in fact a good thing, because we are left with only those who really want to be doctors regardless of how much money they make (and some people from really rich families)? Medicine seems like a field where you wouldn't want people that are motivated by money.
- nmcfarl 14y ago
  The problem is that large scale debt makes you interested in money AFTER you get the degree. While getting it, the debts on hold, and there is no pressure. If you want a class of Doctors that don't care about money, have them accumulate moderate debt, and get a nice but not extravagant income. But Huge debt with a just large enough income to pay it off, just makes people who otherwise wouldn't care about cash, start caring about cash. (This is exacerbated by the fact that many Doc's go straight through and have never had a job until Residency, where they have to pay off the debt - but are not (yet) making enough money to do so. That'll focus your mind on money fast.)
- rayiner 14y ago
  That's predicated on the false premise that being motivated by money is in any way correlated (positively or negatively) with the qualities we want in doctors. Lots (most?) brilliant people are motivated by money.
  - swampthing 14y ago
    Brilliance isn't the only thing I'd look for in a doctor... most of the time, you have a very common issue and don't need brilliance. Having several family members who are doctors, I would say the most important thing to me would be compassion.
davidf18 14y ago
The median public med school of $207K might be including out of state residents. For in New York State: Public SUNY Downstate tuition: $30K x 4 = $120K Dorm room $5500/yr Other living expenses $12K per year Total $188K http://sls.downstate.edu/financial_aid/costs/CollegeofMedicine.html http://sls.downstate.edu/financial_aid/costs/CollegeofMedici... SUNY Undergrad (in-state) About $22K x 4 = $88K http://sls.downstate.edu/financial_aid/costs/CollegeofMedicine.html http://sls.downstate.edu/financial_aid/costs/CollegeofMedici... Total (without any financial aid) $188K (medical) + 88K (undergrad) = $276K This is approximately the same cost as a private undergraduate education including on-campus living expenses (about $250K). Example: Columbia College at Columbia University is approx $62K per year + travel or $248K total + travel. http://www.college.columbia.edu/bulletin/feesandexpenses.php http://www.college.columbia.edu/bulletin/feesandexpenses.php Instead of attending pricey private undergrad and then medical school attend public undergrad and public medical school for about the same price. There should be a study of median debt for those who attend both in-state public undergrad and public medical school vs. those who did not make that choice.
- jamiejtaylor 14y ago
  (Your SUNY undergrad link is the same as your medical school link.) The tuition indicated for Columbia is the maximum one could pay, which is significantly decreased by financial aid depending on need -- presumably much more so than at SUNY. Columbia's financial aid includes no loans and the average aid award is about $40k (of those with need, so presumably about $20k over all students). In addition to Columbia being considered a much better school than SUNY, for many students it may actually be cheaper to go to Columbia ... if they can get in.

by mbreese 14y ago

swampthing 14y ago

It's an interesting question - is this in fact a good thing, because we are left with only those who really want to be doctors regardless of how much money they make (and some people from really rich families)? Medicine seems like a field where you wouldn't want people that are motivated by money.

nmcfarl 14y ago
The problem is that large scale debt makes you interested in money AFTER you get the degree. While getting it, the debts on hold, and there is no pressure. If you want a class of Doctors that don't care about money, have them accumulate moderate debt, and get a nice but not extravagant income. But Huge debt with a just large enough income to pay it off, just makes people who otherwise wouldn't care about cash, start caring about cash. (This is exacerbated by the fact that many Doc's go straight through and have never had a job until Residency, where they have to pay off the debt - but are not (yet) making enough money to do so. That'll focus your mind on money fast.)
rayiner 14y ago
That's predicated on the false premise that being motivated by money is in any way correlated (positively or negatively) with the qualities we want in doctors. Lots (most?) brilliant people are motivated by money.
- swampthing 14y ago
  Brilliance isn't the only thing I'd look for in a doctor... most of the time, you have a very common issue and don't need brilliance. Having several family members who are doctors, I would say the most important thing to me would be compassion.

davidf18 14y ago

The median public med school of $207K might be including out of state residents. For in New York State: Public SUNY Downstate tuition: $30K x 4 = $120K Dorm room $5500/yr Other living expenses $12K per year Total $188K http://sls.downstate.edu/financial_aid/costs/CollegeofMedicine.html http://sls.downstate.edu/financial_aid/costs/CollegeofMedici... SUNY Undergrad (in-state) About $22K x 4 = $88K http://sls.downstate.edu/financial_aid/costs/CollegeofMedicine.html http://sls.downstate.edu/financial_aid/costs/CollegeofMedici... Total (without any financial aid) $188K (medical) + 88K (undergrad) = $276K This is approximately the same cost as a private undergraduate education including on-campus living expenses (about $250K). Example: Columbia College at Columbia University is approx $62K per year + travel or $248K total + travel. http://www.college.columbia.edu/bulletin/feesandexpenses.php http://www.college.columbia.edu/bulletin/feesandexpenses.php Instead of attending pricey private undergrad and then medical school attend public undergrad and public medical school for about the same price. There should be a study of median debt for those who attend both in-state public undergrad and public medical school vs. those who did not make that choice.

jamiejtaylor 14y ago
(Your SUNY undergrad link is the same as your medical school link.) The tuition indicated for Columbia is the maximum one could pay, which is significantly decreased by financial aid depending on need -- presumably much more so than at SUNY. Columbia's financial aid includes no loans and the average aid award is about $40k (of those with need, so presumably about $20k over all students). In addition to Columbia being considered a much better school than SUNY, for many students it may actually be cheaper to go to Columbia ... if they can get in.