4 ms·

Is it optional to show who you tip? I'm curious about who's contributions they're thanking. I'm guessing the people who've written the FOSS heroku runs on, but

by richo 14y ago

Is it optional to show who you tip? I'm curious about who's contributions they're thanking. I'm guessing the people who've written the FOSS heroku runs on, but very curious.

whit537 14y ago
Nope. It was a very early design decision that gifts on Gittip are anonymous in the particulars. The idea was to remove the "why did you unfriend me?" awkwardness that only gets compounded if money is involved. We want gifts on Gittip to be no-strings-attached for both sides. With companies coming on board, we may have to rethink this a bit. Fortunately there are some features in the pipeline that I think will address this. If you want to dive in: https://github.com/gittip/www.gittip.com/issues/449 https://github.com/gittip/www.gittip.com/issues/449
- richo 14y ago
  Cheers. It's a totally reasonable decision, and I agree with it generally- except in cases like this. I'll have a look through this issue and articulate my stance if it's not already represented.
  - whit537 14y ago
    That ticket is a really deep rabbit hole. :) The tl;dr is that we're adding a level of indirection: 1. There will be URLs like https://www.gittip.com/for/rails/ https://www.gittip.com/for/rails/ 2. The Internet will decide how gifts to "rails" should be allocated. 3. Companies like Heroku can pour money in the top and it will pachinko out per the Internet's allocation. The goals are: - To create a system that adds value for both companies and communities. - To maintain Gittip's core principles of transparency, openness, and freedom ("no strings attached"). - To keep fraud, volatility, and lobbying to a minimum. I'm excited to see whether we can pull it off. :)
    - pc86 14y ago
      That sounds pretty cool. I'd be worried about there getting to be a decent amount of money on the line (I could see thousands each week for something like Rails or Python long term) and people trying to game the allocation to get an extra few percentage points of the increasingly large pie.
      - whit537 14y ago
        Yup. That's going to be the biggest challenge. Wanna help solve it? :) https://github.com/gittip/www.gittip.com/issues/449 https://github.com/gittip/www.gittip.com/issues/449
        pc86 14y ago
        Nice :) What is Gittip written in (I'm at work and can't do a ton of research into it)? I've been looking for something F/OSS I can help out with.
        whit537 14y ago
        Python (Aspen). See also: http://whit537.org/2013/03/why-aspen.html http://whit537.org/2013/03/why-aspen.html http://www.reddit.com/r/Python/comments/1b3t09/why_gittip_use_aspen_instead_of_djangorails/ http://www.reddit.com/r/Python/comments/1b3t09/why_gittip_us...
  - forsaken 14y ago
    Why do you assume Heroku wants you to know who they're tipping? Or that it's a positive thing for us to know? Perhaps they are just trying to help the community and don't need credit for it, other than the indication that they are giving.
    - kaoD 14y ago
      > other than the indication that they are giving. Which is the definition for "credit" :P
- mmahemoff 14y ago
  It might be cool to provide some anonymised trend indications, ie people in this industry are tipping these kinds of projects. I realise the volume is probably too small now to make any reports truly anonymous, but would be fascinating to see in the future.
  - whit537 14y ago
    Yeah, not enough volume yet, but we're tracking data over time so we're set up for these kinds of things in the future.
- kenko 14y ago
  "With companies coming on board, we may have to rethink this a bit. " Why?
  - whit537 14y ago
    Well, mostly I want to take this opportunity to double-check our assumptions. Does this threaten the autonomy of the communities and individuals that Heroku is giving to? This doesn't give Heroku some undue influence, does it? Does this create a fairness problem or a secrecy problem? On the other side of the coin, I want to provide value to Heroku so they and others like them are incentivized to give further. See further comments below.
    - whit537 14y ago
      Here's what's bugging me about this: potential conflicts of interest. Kenneth Reitz is almost certainly behind this (he's the "Python Overlord" at Heroku, as well as the author of the Requests HTTP library for Python). Kenneth is a friend of mine from before I launched Gittip. I'll be hosting him in a couple weeks when he comes to Pittsburgh to speak at our local Python user group. Kenneth has been a big supporter of Gittip and has in fact been one of the top receivers since Gittip launched. I (openly) accepted a $300 hosting voucher for Gittip from Kenneth during Waza earlier this year. Interestingly, though, I had no advance notice that they were going to do this. I've been planting the seed of this idea with Kenneth and his colleagues, and I'm excited and grateful to Kenneth and to Heroku that they've decided to follow through. It's obviously a huge validation of Gittip to have Heroku step forward like this. However, I learned about this when I loaded the Gittip homepage last night and saw Heroku listed under "New Participants" and clicked through and saw how much they were giving. My reaction on Twitter was genuine: https://twitter.com/whit537/status/322523168659095554 https://twitter.com/whit537/status/322523168659095554 All that said, let's pause for a moment to feel a slight feeling of paranoia here at the outset of what I hope will be an explosion of corporate patronage of open source through Gittip and consequent progress in open source. Let's make sure we do this right. - Does this create any conflicts of interest? - What if Heroku were giving to kennethreitz or other Heroku employees? They're not (I checked under the hood), but what if?

by richo 14y ago

Is it optional to show who you tip? I'm curious about who's contributions they're thanking. I'm guessing the people who've written the FOSS heroku runs on, but very curious.

whit537 14y ago

Nope. It was a very early design decision that gifts on Gittip are anonymous in the particulars. The idea was to remove the "why did you unfriend me?" awkwardness that only gets compounded if money is involved. We want gifts on Gittip to be no-strings-attached for both sides. With companies coming on board, we may have to rethink this a bit. Fortunately there are some features in the pipeline that I think will address this. If you want to dive in: https://github.com/gittip/www.gittip.com/issues/449 https://github.com/gittip/www.gittip.com/issues/449

richo 14y ago
Cheers. It's a totally reasonable decision, and I agree with it generally- except in cases like this. I'll have a look through this issue and articulate my stance if it's not already represented.
- whit537 14y ago
  That ticket is a really deep rabbit hole. :) The tl;dr is that we're adding a level of indirection: 1. There will be URLs like https://www.gittip.com/for/rails/ https://www.gittip.com/for/rails/ 2. The Internet will decide how gifts to "rails" should be allocated. 3. Companies like Heroku can pour money in the top and it will pachinko out per the Internet's allocation. The goals are: - To create a system that adds value for both companies and communities. - To maintain Gittip's core principles of transparency, openness, and freedom ("no strings attached"). - To keep fraud, volatility, and lobbying to a minimum. I'm excited to see whether we can pull it off. :)
  - pc86 14y ago
    That sounds pretty cool. I'd be worried about there getting to be a decent amount of money on the line (I could see thousands each week for something like Rails or Python long term) and people trying to game the allocation to get an extra few percentage points of the increasingly large pie.
    - whit537 14y ago
      Yup. That's going to be the biggest challenge. Wanna help solve it? :) https://github.com/gittip/www.gittip.com/issues/449 https://github.com/gittip/www.gittip.com/issues/449
      - pc86 14y ago
        Nice :) What is Gittip written in (I'm at work and can't do a ton of research into it)? I've been looking for something F/OSS I can help out with.
        whit537 14y ago
        Python (Aspen). See also: http://whit537.org/2013/03/why-aspen.html http://whit537.org/2013/03/why-aspen.html http://www.reddit.com/r/Python/comments/1b3t09/why_gittip_use_aspen_instead_of_djangorails/ http://www.reddit.com/r/Python/comments/1b3t09/why_gittip_us...
- forsaken 14y ago
  Why do you assume Heroku wants you to know who they're tipping? Or that it's a positive thing for us to know? Perhaps they are just trying to help the community and don't need credit for it, other than the indication that they are giving.
  - kaoD 14y ago
    > other than the indication that they are giving. Which is the definition for "credit" :P
mmahemoff 14y ago
It might be cool to provide some anonymised trend indications, ie people in this industry are tipping these kinds of projects. I realise the volume is probably too small now to make any reports truly anonymous, but would be fascinating to see in the future.
- whit537 14y ago
  Yeah, not enough volume yet, but we're tracking data over time so we're set up for these kinds of things in the future.
kenko 14y ago
"With companies coming on board, we may have to rethink this a bit. " Why?
- whit537 14y ago
  Well, mostly I want to take this opportunity to double-check our assumptions. Does this threaten the autonomy of the communities and individuals that Heroku is giving to? This doesn't give Heroku some undue influence, does it? Does this create a fairness problem or a secrecy problem? On the other side of the coin, I want to provide value to Heroku so they and others like them are incentivized to give further. See further comments below.
  - whit537 14y ago
    Here's what's bugging me about this: potential conflicts of interest. Kenneth Reitz is almost certainly behind this (he's the "Python Overlord" at Heroku, as well as the author of the Requests HTTP library for Python). Kenneth is a friend of mine from before I launched Gittip. I'll be hosting him in a couple weeks when he comes to Pittsburgh to speak at our local Python user group. Kenneth has been a big supporter of Gittip and has in fact been one of the top receivers since Gittip launched. I (openly) accepted a $300 hosting voucher for Gittip from Kenneth during Waza earlier this year. Interestingly, though, I had no advance notice that they were going to do this. I've been planting the seed of this idea with Kenneth and his colleagues, and I'm excited and grateful to Kenneth and to Heroku that they've decided to follow through. It's obviously a huge validation of Gittip to have Heroku step forward like this. However, I learned about this when I loaded the Gittip homepage last night and saw Heroku listed under "New Participants" and clicked through and saw how much they were giving. My reaction on Twitter was genuine: https://twitter.com/whit537/status/322523168659095554 https://twitter.com/whit537/status/322523168659095554 All that said, let's pause for a moment to feel a slight feeling of paranoia here at the outset of what I hope will be an explosion of corporate patronage of open source through Gittip and consequent progress in open source. Let's make sure we do this right. - Does this create any conflicts of interest? - What if Heroku were giving to kennethreitz or other Heroku employees? They're not (I checked under the hood), but what if?