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Just so I'm clear, where is the list of which ToS and EULAs are OK to break and which ones aren't? AppGratis seems to have gotten boned for violating one, yet y

by mdmarra 14y ago

Just so I'm clear, where is the list of which ToS and EULAs are OK to break and which ones aren't? AppGratis seems to have gotten boned for violating one, yet you're advocating people break another in the same thread? Sure, the odds of Apple coming after you are low. But that doesn't mean that it's any less of a violation of the license agreement that you agree to when installing the software. AppGratis also thought they were in the clear with their ToS issue.

CamperBob2 14y ago
Here are the ones that it's not OK to break: http://www.law.cornell.edu/uscode/text http://www.law.cornell.edu/uscode/text Here are the ones that it is OK to break: (Most of the rest)
w1ntermute 14y ago
Isn't it obvious? It's OK to violate the EULA if there's no chance of them catching you, and if other people haven't been caught before. No end user has ever been caught or sued by Apple for running OS X in a VM, because that's not easily detectable and Apple doesn't care about it. But stories of App Store EULA violation nightmares are a dime a dozen. TL;DR use your common sense
mikeash 14y ago
EULAs are crap, as they attempt to tell me what I'm allowed to do with an entity that I own. Once the transaction is complete, we're done, and the creator doesn't get to control what I do, beyond the restrictions laid out in copyright law. If I violate a EULA, the creator has no recourse but to sue, and they'll be suing me for taking legal actions with my own property. A ToS, on the other hand, lays out terms for the ongoing use of a service. If I violate the ToS, the service provider is within their rights to decline to provide me service. They're within their rights to do that anyway for nearly any reason they feel like, because this is an ongoing relationship and I don't have them enslaved. Beyond that, they could also sue, at which point things get a bit murky. There's nothing wrong with breaking a EULA, and their legal enforceability is worrying. There's also nothing wrong with a service provider terminating service when a user breaks a ToS, which is what happened here. There's no inconsistency.
- zevyoura 14y ago
  > There's nothing wrong with breaking a EULA, and their legal enforceability is worrying. Luckily they're not legally enforceable (at least in the U.S.) under many circumstances, though you may not want to take it to court since you could get unlucky: http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/End-user_license_agreement#Enforceability_of_EULAs_in_the_United_States http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/End-user_license_agreement#Enfo...

by mdmarra 14y ago

CamperBob2 14y ago

Here are the ones that it's not OK to break: http://www.law.cornell.edu/uscode/text http://www.law.cornell.edu/uscode/text Here are the ones that it is OK to break: (Most of the rest)

w1ntermute 14y ago

Isn't it obvious? It's OK to violate the EULA if there's no chance of them catching you, and if other people haven't been caught before. No end user has ever been caught or sued by Apple for running OS X in a VM, because that's not easily detectable and Apple doesn't care about it. But stories of App Store EULA violation nightmares are a dime a dozen. TL;DR use your common sense

mikeash 14y ago

EULAs are crap, as they attempt to tell me what I'm allowed to do with an entity that I own. Once the transaction is complete, we're done, and the creator doesn't get to control what I do, beyond the restrictions laid out in copyright law. If I violate a EULA, the creator has no recourse but to sue, and they'll be suing me for taking legal actions with my own property. A ToS, on the other hand, lays out terms for the ongoing use of a service. If I violate the ToS, the service provider is within their rights to decline to provide me service. They're within their rights to do that anyway for nearly any reason they feel like, because this is an ongoing relationship and I don't have them enslaved. Beyond that, they could also sue, at which point things get a bit murky. There's nothing wrong with breaking a EULA, and their legal enforceability is worrying. There's also nothing wrong with a service provider terminating service when a user breaks a ToS, which is what happened here. There's no inconsistency.

zevyoura 14y ago
> There's nothing wrong with breaking a EULA, and their legal enforceability is worrying. Luckily they're not legally enforceable (at least in the U.S.) under many circumstances, though you may not want to take it to court since you could get unlucky: http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/End-user_license_agreement#Enforceability_of_EULAs_in_the_United_States http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/End-user_license_agreement#Enfo...