7 ms·

Am I the only one genuinely afraid of clicking any of cables with keyword SECRET ?

rrrhys 14y ago
No.
derrida 14y ago
It's public domain now, but if you don't trust the law to let you read and write freely, use Tor https://www.torproject.org/ https://www.torproject.org/
- mpyne 14y ago
  Do you mean public domain as in "unclassified", or public domain as in "publically accessible"? Because those are far different.
  - acebarry 14y ago
    Usually when the United States federal government releases anything it defaults into the public domain.
    - ewbuoi 14y ago
      Was this released through official channels or leaked? I'm assuming it makes a difference, but I wouldn't know...
      - justincormack 14y ago
        "The collection published today has not been leaked. Assange said WikiLeaks had been working for the past year to analyse and assess a vast amount of data held at the U.S. national archives before releasing it in a searchable form." http://leaksource.wordpress.com/2013/04/08/wikileaks-plusd-public-library-of-us-diplomacy-the-kissinger-cables/ http://leaksource.wordpress.com/2013/04/08/wikileaks-plusd-p... So it is legal
        sigzero 14y ago
        Legal in what sense? Wikileaks cannot de-classify materials regardless of how much they "analyze and assess" it.
        mpyne 14y ago
        If the materials were properly declassified and held for public browsing by the NARA then what Wikileaks is doing is fine. It would be the same as Google wrapping a much nicer search interface across an old dataset. If the materials were still classified-but-leaked then I won't go near it until it is declassified. But I can't tell from this side of the window what's going on.
    - olefoo 14y ago
      The wikileaks cables exist in grey zone; it's they were never released by the US Government, but they are public. Generally speaking if you are not and do not plan on being an employee with a mandated security clearance, you have nothing to worry about. If however, you do have or want to acquire clearance you should not look at Wikileaks since you will be violating the terms under which clearance is granted. Also, elements of the intelligence community have made statements that suggest that applicants to some government positions could be refused if they tweet or say anything about Wikileaks. [1] 1. http://dailycaller.com/2010/12/09/schools-warn-students-not-to-look-at-wikileaks-if-they-want-a-government-job/ http://dailycaller.com/2010/12/09/schools-warn-students-not-...
sthatipamala 14y ago
I have the same problem with these "cybercrime" laws. With most other laws, I can rely on intuition to guide my judgment ("if I hit this guy, I'll probably get in trouble"). But I have no way of knowing what kind of data is illegal to access, have in my possession, or release to the public.
jasonkolb 14y ago
You need to check out the Tails project (https://tails.boum.org/ https://tails.boum.org/) which is a version of Debian I believe tailored to be completely anonymous. The browser uses TOR by default, I don't even know if you can disable it. Lots of other goodies too, including making browser fingerprints pretty meaningless. Also, I know it's technically kind of bad form but if one wanted to run Tails easily you can use VirtualBox (https://www.virtualbox.org/ https://www.virtualbox.org/) to easily fire up a throwaway instance of Tails quickly and easily.
- ewbuoi 14y ago
  When I tried Tails it had the noScript plugin disabled by default (actually in blacklist mode, I think, which allows javascript on 99% of websites). Even the plugin itself warns users not to leave it disabled. I wouldn't trust something with that big of a security hole. If anonymity was so important that I couldn't trust my own machine, I wouldn't trust a linux distro made for anonymity either.
  - drivebyacct2 14y ago
    Probably because Javascript has no magical ability to leak your identity, especially inside of Tails.
rdtsc 14y ago
If you have a clearance you should absolutely not be clicking on it (if you are also paranoid and don't want to possibly fail your polygraph test -- "have you accessed or downloaded classified documents on your personal computer...?" er...oops). Otherwise if you don't hold a clearance, I don't think they can do anything to you (however, I am not a lawyer so don't take this as a legal advice etc etc...)
- oelmekki 14y ago
  Do we have any story of people being harassed for simply reading leaked documents (genuine question) ? I remember reading people with clearance were not allowed to access wikileaks, but I can remember any follow up "X got fired|trialed because accessing wikileaks". Not that I think it can't happen if we didn't know about it, of course.
- iand 14y ago
  Makes sense. If you have contractually agreed to preserve state secrets then just avoid this stuff.
  - olifante 14y ago
    Welcome to the future of intelligence agencies. Their employees are legally required to know less than the general public.
- singular 14y ago
  Actually don't worry too much about the polygraph, it's complete pseudoscience. http://rationalwiki.org/wiki/Polygraph http://rationalwiki.org/wiki/Polygraph
  - tikwidd 14y ago
    and yet, still used
    - Udo 14y ago
      They're using the idea of the polygraph, the actual measurements could mean anything. It's the "conversation" during and after the test that counts. Of course it's also a great medium to screw someone over, but that's a whole other thing.
xradionut 14y ago
Due to past obligations and future opportunities, I can't/won't touch any of these documents directly.
- count 14y ago
  ITT: Folks with clearances on HN outing themselves....;)
mtgx 14y ago
Are you self-censoring yourself? As far as I know once secret stuff is leaked into the public, it becomes public domain.
- jacquesm 14y ago
  > As far as I know http://www.aclu.org/blog/national-security-free-speech/government-wins-right-pretend-cables-released-wikileaks-are-still http://www.aclu.org/blog/national-security-free-speech/gover... And if you're working for the US government then you had better play along or you might end up causing your career harm. Common sense is at odds with the law here (and in many other places as well), so 'what you know' and what some judge will decide may very well be in contradiction with each other.

No.

It's public domain now, but if you don't trust the law to let you read and write freely, use Tor https://www.torproject.org/ https://www.torproject.org/

mpyne 14y ago
Do you mean public domain as in "unclassified", or public domain as in "publically accessible"? Because those are far different.
- acebarry 14y ago
  Usually when the United States federal government releases anything it defaults into the public domain.
  - ewbuoi 14y ago
    Was this released through official channels or leaked? I'm assuming it makes a difference, but I wouldn't know...
    - justincormack 14y ago
      "The collection published today has not been leaked. Assange said WikiLeaks had been working for the past year to analyse and assess a vast amount of data held at the U.S. national archives before releasing it in a searchable form." http://leaksource.wordpress.com/2013/04/08/wikileaks-plusd-public-library-of-us-diplomacy-the-kissinger-cables/ http://leaksource.wordpress.com/2013/04/08/wikileaks-plusd-p... So it is legal
      - sigzero 14y ago
        Legal in what sense? Wikileaks cannot de-classify materials regardless of how much they "analyze and assess" it.
        mpyne 14y ago
        If the materials were properly declassified and held for public browsing by the NARA then what Wikileaks is doing is fine. It would be the same as Google wrapping a much nicer search interface across an old dataset. If the materials were still classified-but-leaked then I won't go near it until it is declassified. But I can't tell from this side of the window what's going on.
  - olefoo 14y ago
    The wikileaks cables exist in grey zone; it's they were never released by the US Government, but they are public. Generally speaking if you are not and do not plan on being an employee with a mandated security clearance, you have nothing to worry about. If however, you do have or want to acquire clearance you should not look at Wikileaks since you will be violating the terms under which clearance is granted. Also, elements of the intelligence community have made statements that suggest that applicants to some government positions could be refused if they tweet or say anything about Wikileaks. [1] 1. http://dailycaller.com/2010/12/09/schools-warn-students-not-to-look-at-wikileaks-if-they-want-a-government-job/ http://dailycaller.com/2010/12/09/schools-warn-students-not-...

sthatipamala 14y ago

I have the same problem with these "cybercrime" laws. With most other laws, I can rely on intuition to guide my judgment ("if I hit this guy, I'll probably get in trouble"). But I have no way of knowing what kind of data is illegal to access, have in my possession, or release to the public.

jasonkolb 14y ago

You need to check out the Tails project (https://tails.boum.org/ https://tails.boum.org/) which is a version of Debian I believe tailored to be completely anonymous. The browser uses TOR by default, I don't even know if you can disable it. Lots of other goodies too, including making browser fingerprints pretty meaningless. Also, I know it's technically kind of bad form but if one wanted to run Tails easily you can use VirtualBox (https://www.virtualbox.org/ https://www.virtualbox.org/) to easily fire up a throwaway instance of Tails quickly and easily.

ewbuoi 14y ago
When I tried Tails it had the noScript plugin disabled by default (actually in blacklist mode, I think, which allows javascript on 99% of websites). Even the plugin itself warns users not to leave it disabled. I wouldn't trust something with that big of a security hole. If anonymity was so important that I couldn't trust my own machine, I wouldn't trust a linux distro made for anonymity either.
- drivebyacct2 14y ago
  Probably because Javascript has no magical ability to leak your identity, especially inside of Tails.

rdtsc 14y ago

If you have a clearance you should absolutely not be clicking on it (if you are also paranoid and don't want to possibly fail your polygraph test -- "have you accessed or downloaded classified documents on your personal computer...?" er...oops). Otherwise if you don't hold a clearance, I don't think they can do anything to you (however, I am not a lawyer so don't take this as a legal advice etc etc...)

oelmekki 14y ago
Do we have any story of people being harassed for simply reading leaked documents (genuine question) ? I remember reading people with clearance were not allowed to access wikileaks, but I can remember any follow up "X got fired|trialed because accessing wikileaks". Not that I think it can't happen if we didn't know about it, of course.
iand 14y ago
Makes sense. If you have contractually agreed to preserve state secrets then just avoid this stuff.
- olifante 14y ago
  Welcome to the future of intelligence agencies. Their employees are legally required to know less than the general public.
singular 14y ago
Actually don't worry too much about the polygraph, it's complete pseudoscience. http://rationalwiki.org/wiki/Polygraph http://rationalwiki.org/wiki/Polygraph
- tikwidd 14y ago
  and yet, still used
  - Udo 14y ago
    They're using the idea of the polygraph, the actual measurements could mean anything. It's the "conversation" during and after the test that counts. Of course it's also a great medium to screw someone over, but that's a whole other thing.

xradionut 14y ago

Due to past obligations and future opportunities, I can't/won't touch any of these documents directly.

count 14y ago
ITT: Folks with clearances on HN outing themselves....;)

mtgx 14y ago

Are you self-censoring yourself? As far as I know once secret stuff is leaked into the public, it becomes public domain.

jacquesm 14y ago
> As far as I know http://www.aclu.org/blog/national-security-free-speech/government-wins-right-pretend-cables-released-wikileaks-are-still http://www.aclu.org/blog/national-security-free-speech/gover... And if you're working for the US government then you had better play along or you might end up causing your career harm. Common sense is at odds with the law here (and in many other places as well), so 'what you know' and what some judge will decide may very well be in contradiction with each other.