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"Sure he's a tyrant, but he's our tyrant" This is exactly why I look forward to the rise of cryptocurrencies; protection from people like you.

Nursie 14y ago
democracy != tyranny in my book. Sorry. It's far from perfect, but it's better than any other system I can think of and it's sure as hell better than a libertarian free-for-all which (IMHO) would devolve into feudalism and indentured servitude in no time. Difference of opinion again you see. --edit-- and I hope you enjoy your crypto-currencies. I also like them, I love crypto and am often amazed at what can be done with it. I just don't think that some of the features of BTC (particularly the fixed supply) are as awesome as some others seem to, nor do I find it important for currency to be free of central control, because I consider it a social utility rather than an absolute possession.
- etherael 14y ago
  Tyranny vs democracy wasn't my point, my point was that instead of accepting the negatives in the system, you rationalise them away by saying it's okay when it's your team behaving this way. History has a way of making this habit look foolish in the long run. If crypto currencies prevail, we will see if your fears or my hopes end up justified. I am just happy it's finally possible.
  - Nursie 14y ago
    Again, I don't think these characteristics you list are unquestionably present or that they are unquestionably absolute negatives. From my perspective you use emotionally loaded language to try and paint a picture that fits in with your worldview. It's not 'my team vs your team'. It's that I genuinely don't see cooperative government or managed currencies as evil (quite the opposite), and you do.
    - BrokenPipe 14y ago
      I don't this his language was emotional at all. I don't want my money to be spent in certain ways. I like voluntarism and of course I would try to improve the situation around my area instead of financing war, prisons and luxury for the corrupted. Things are not going ok.
      - Nursie 14y ago
        violent, parasitic, corrupt, extortionate, coercion, organised crime ring... these aren't emotionally loaded terms to you? Again, different people have different attitudes. I'm not saying his (or your) view of the world is invalid. I'm saying that acting like it is the only possible rational or objective view on the world, and using heavily loaded words and a lot of absolute pronouncements, is a shortcoming I've seen in many internet libertarians. --edit-- along with an assumption that anyone disagreeing with them just doesn't understand the arguments (I do), or is being wilfully ignorant (I'm not)
        etherael 14y ago
        You keep pretending that those words don't actually apply, even though when I nailed you down on the definitions, you acknowledged it, you just said it was OK because the behaviour is acceptable when it's your team that's doing it. If that excuse works for you, that's fine, but it doesn't negate the fact that the labels still accurately apply, you've just tried to justify them.
        Nursie 14y ago
        Oh for god's sake. No I didn't. Read the thread back. I do not agree that tax and extortion are equivalent, neither do I agree that government is by nature parasitic, nor that its aims are necessarily expansionist. These are emotionally coloured labels and presume that your worldview is absolutely correct. I do agree (and said as much) that we delegate the use of violence to our representatives, but I'd quite like to know how libertarians would enforce property rights without violence, and why that's just AOK but not allowed for any other right we grant ourselves. This is where you're just as guilty of allowing 'your team' to get away with something. --edit-- anyway, I'm done here, I'm pretty sure we've demonstrated that you're intolerant of other worldviews
- nazgulnarsil 14y ago
  >democracy != tyranny Depends on how popular your opinion is.

Nursie 14y ago

democracy != tyranny in my book. Sorry. It's far from perfect, but it's better than any other system I can think of and it's sure as hell better than a libertarian free-for-all which (IMHO) would devolve into feudalism and indentured servitude in no time. Difference of opinion again you see. --edit-- and I hope you enjoy your crypto-currencies. I also like them, I love crypto and am often amazed at what can be done with it. I just don't think that some of the features of BTC (particularly the fixed supply) are as awesome as some others seem to, nor do I find it important for currency to be free of central control, because I consider it a social utility rather than an absolute possession.

etherael 14y ago
Tyranny vs democracy wasn't my point, my point was that instead of accepting the negatives in the system, you rationalise them away by saying it's okay when it's your team behaving this way. History has a way of making this habit look foolish in the long run. If crypto currencies prevail, we will see if your fears or my hopes end up justified. I am just happy it's finally possible.
- Nursie 14y ago
  Again, I don't think these characteristics you list are unquestionably present or that they are unquestionably absolute negatives. From my perspective you use emotionally loaded language to try and paint a picture that fits in with your worldview. It's not 'my team vs your team'. It's that I genuinely don't see cooperative government or managed currencies as evil (quite the opposite), and you do.
  - BrokenPipe 14y ago
    I don't this his language was emotional at all. I don't want my money to be spent in certain ways. I like voluntarism and of course I would try to improve the situation around my area instead of financing war, prisons and luxury for the corrupted. Things are not going ok.
    - Nursie 14y ago
      violent, parasitic, corrupt, extortionate, coercion, organised crime ring... these aren't emotionally loaded terms to you? Again, different people have different attitudes. I'm not saying his (or your) view of the world is invalid. I'm saying that acting like it is the only possible rational or objective view on the world, and using heavily loaded words and a lot of absolute pronouncements, is a shortcoming I've seen in many internet libertarians. --edit-- along with an assumption that anyone disagreeing with them just doesn't understand the arguments (I do), or is being wilfully ignorant (I'm not)
      - etherael 14y ago
        You keep pretending that those words don't actually apply, even though when I nailed you down on the definitions, you acknowledged it, you just said it was OK because the behaviour is acceptable when it's your team that's doing it. If that excuse works for you, that's fine, but it doesn't negate the fact that the labels still accurately apply, you've just tried to justify them.
        Nursie 14y ago
        Oh for god's sake. No I didn't. Read the thread back. I do not agree that tax and extortion are equivalent, neither do I agree that government is by nature parasitic, nor that its aims are necessarily expansionist. These are emotionally coloured labels and presume that your worldview is absolutely correct. I do agree (and said as much) that we delegate the use of violence to our representatives, but I'd quite like to know how libertarians would enforce property rights without violence, and why that's just AOK but not allowed for any other right we grant ourselves. This is where you're just as guilty of allowing 'your team' to get away with something. --edit-- anyway, I'm done here, I'm pretty sure we've demonstrated that you're intolerant of other worldviews
nazgulnarsil 14y ago
>democracy != tyranny Depends on how popular your opinion is.