5 ms·

Heh, the part where they factor in the time you save on pumping gas is really pushing the envelope a little on "savings."

MRSallee 14y ago
Especially considering the time it takes to charge the car. If you can do all charging while you're sleeping, then no biggie, but if you have to charge in the middle of your business trip to Los Angeles you can +$200 to your monthly tab, by Tesla's logic.
- droithomme 14y ago
  Good point - the time stuck waiting for the car to charge the car if driving normally is not accounted for yet is far more than 1 hr a month if one is driving the 15,000 miles a year which they assume in the same alleged savings scenario.
dalke 14y ago
I agree. They should also have factored in the time it takes to plug/unplug the charger over the month.
ultimoo 14y ago
True. It also doesn't factor in the fact that one may have the drive to work only for a certain number of hours per day. Let's say this number is 8 hours. One will work for 8 hours no matter what. Just because you saved 15 minutes, doesn't mean you will work extra for those 15 minutes. I am sure there is a name for this kind of a fallacy in this purportedly logical argument.
- smallegan 14y ago
  While I agree that you are right and most people work a set numbers of hours I find that it is always important to have a value associated with your time and when you set out to do something just take a second and think about the opportunity cost of said activity.
hyperbovine 14y ago
Fifteen minutes a week equals an hour a month, which probably has an opportunity cost of ~$100 for the average potential Model S owner. That's 20% of what your monthly payment under this new financing, which is not trivial.
- twoodfin 14y ago
  Who takes 15 minutes to fill their car?
  - pc86 14y ago
    It's assuming you make a separate trip to fuel your car (it mentions time to drive to the station, fill and return home). It's an idiotic assumption. Changing it to five minutes (or less if you just top your car off at 1/2 or 3/4 tank) is much more realistic.
    - hyperbovine 14y ago
      I use that number advisedly. In LA (TSLAs biggest market, really) it really is more like 15 minutes. And think carefully before you employ the word "idiotic"--it does not reflect well upon you.
      - twoodfin 14y ago
        How does that work? Google Maps suggests that LA has a gas station at least every other block, which jibes with my memory of the place. Are the lines really 10 minutes long?
droithomme 14y ago
It also assumes you will drive 15,000 miles a year, then in a separate area notes you pay a 25 cent a mile penalty for all miles driven over 36k before trade in at 3 years or beyond. It also assumes that gas costs $5 a gallon in the same area that electricity costs 11 cents a kWh. Which city is this again?
- kbrosnan 14y ago
  Fairly close to Palo Alto, CA. According to a sample bill the rate was around 12c [1]. Premium gas is currently $4.25-$4.50 it has been higher in the past. [1] http://www.cityofpaloalto.org/civicax/filebank/documents/30586 http://www.cityofpaloalto.org/civicax/filebank/documents/305... [warning pdf]
  - droithomme 14y ago
    http://www.sanjosegasprices.com/Palo_Alto/index.aspx http://www.sanjosegasprices.com/Palo_Alto/index.aspx Arco, 699 San Antonio Rd & Middlefield Rd, $3.93 as of 15 minutes ago. http://www.cityofpaloalto.org/civicax/filebank/documents/8089 http://www.cityofpaloalto.org/civicax/filebank/documents/808... 9, 13 or 17 cents a kWh for residential, depending on usage tier. Or if you want green energy in Palo Alto it's 11, 15 and 19 cents a kwH. http://www.cityofpaloalto.org/civicax/filebank/documents/8090 http://www.cityofpaloalto.org/civicax/filebank/documents/809... If it's a business meter, such as one would have at a refueling station, or recharging at work or at the store, it's 15 cents a kwH for green energy: http://www.cityofpaloalto.org/civicax/filebank/documents/8099 http://www.cityofpaloalto.org/civicax/filebank/documents/809... And 14 cents for non-green: http://www.cityofpaloalto.org/civicax/filebank/documents/8098 http://www.cityofpaloalto.org/civicax/filebank/documents/809...
- dwild 14y ago
  Here in Quebec the gas cost about 1.35$/L (which is about 5.10$/gallon) and the electricity cost 5.41 cents/kWh (for the first 30 kWh and then it's 7.78 cents). However I think the EV Incentive is only 8000$.

MRSallee 14y ago

Especially considering the time it takes to charge the car. If you can do all charging while you're sleeping, then no biggie, but if you have to charge in the middle of your business trip to Los Angeles you can +$200 to your monthly tab, by Tesla's logic.

droithomme 14y ago
Good point - the time stuck waiting for the car to charge the car if driving normally is not accounted for yet is far more than 1 hr a month if one is driving the 15,000 miles a year which they assume in the same alleged savings scenario.

dalke 14y ago

I agree. They should also have factored in the time it takes to plug/unplug the charger over the month.

ultimoo 14y ago

True. It also doesn't factor in the fact that one may have the drive to work only for a certain number of hours per day. Let's say this number is 8 hours. One will work for 8 hours no matter what. Just because you saved 15 minutes, doesn't mean you will work extra for those 15 minutes. I am sure there is a name for this kind of a fallacy in this purportedly logical argument.

smallegan 14y ago
While I agree that you are right and most people work a set numbers of hours I find that it is always important to have a value associated with your time and when you set out to do something just take a second and think about the opportunity cost of said activity.

hyperbovine 14y ago

Fifteen minutes a week equals an hour a month, which probably has an opportunity cost of ~$100 for the average potential Model S owner. That's 20% of what your monthly payment under this new financing, which is not trivial.

twoodfin 14y ago
Who takes 15 minutes to fill their car?
- pc86 14y ago
  It's assuming you make a separate trip to fuel your car (it mentions time to drive to the station, fill and return home). It's an idiotic assumption. Changing it to five minutes (or less if you just top your car off at 1/2 or 3/4 tank) is much more realistic.
  - hyperbovine 14y ago
    I use that number advisedly. In LA (TSLAs biggest market, really) it really is more like 15 minutes. And think carefully before you employ the word "idiotic"--it does not reflect well upon you.
    - twoodfin 14y ago
      How does that work? Google Maps suggests that LA has a gas station at least every other block, which jibes with my memory of the place. Are the lines really 10 minutes long?

droithomme 14y ago

It also assumes you will drive 15,000 miles a year, then in a separate area notes you pay a 25 cent a mile penalty for all miles driven over 36k before trade in at 3 years or beyond. It also assumes that gas costs $5 a gallon in the same area that electricity costs 11 cents a kWh. Which city is this again?

kbrosnan 14y ago
Fairly close to Palo Alto, CA. According to a sample bill the rate was around 12c [1]. Premium gas is currently $4.25-$4.50 it has been higher in the past. [1] http://www.cityofpaloalto.org/civicax/filebank/documents/30586 http://www.cityofpaloalto.org/civicax/filebank/documents/305... [warning pdf]
- droithomme 14y ago
  http://www.sanjosegasprices.com/Palo_Alto/index.aspx http://www.sanjosegasprices.com/Palo_Alto/index.aspx Arco, 699 San Antonio Rd & Middlefield Rd, $3.93 as of 15 minutes ago. http://www.cityofpaloalto.org/civicax/filebank/documents/8089 http://www.cityofpaloalto.org/civicax/filebank/documents/808... 9, 13 or 17 cents a kWh for residential, depending on usage tier. Or if you want green energy in Palo Alto it's 11, 15 and 19 cents a kwH. http://www.cityofpaloalto.org/civicax/filebank/documents/8090 http://www.cityofpaloalto.org/civicax/filebank/documents/809... If it's a business meter, such as one would have at a refueling station, or recharging at work or at the store, it's 15 cents a kwH for green energy: http://www.cityofpaloalto.org/civicax/filebank/documents/8099 http://www.cityofpaloalto.org/civicax/filebank/documents/809... And 14 cents for non-green: http://www.cityofpaloalto.org/civicax/filebank/documents/8098 http://www.cityofpaloalto.org/civicax/filebank/documents/809...
dwild 14y ago
Here in Quebec the gas cost about 1.35$/L (which is about 5.10$/gallon) and the electricity cost 5.41 cents/kWh (for the first 30 kWh and then it's 7.78 cents). However I think the EV Incentive is only 8000$.