5 ms·

In a few hours, I'm going to a client's site to downgrade his newly purchased notebook to Windows 7. He's an average user, director of a small nonprofit who use

In a few hours, I'm going to a client's site to downgrade his newly purchased notebook to Windows 7. He's an average user, director of a small nonprofit who uses his computer mainly for email, Web browsing, and word processing. He used Windows 8 for a week and this is what he wrote : I need your assistance. I did go ahead an buy a new laptop. I like the machine but am suffering on account of Windows 8! Still, he'll still show up as Windows 8 in the market share statistics.

Mahn 14y ago
I always imagine this as the average case for everyone buying a new laptop now. I don't know, I really don't want to hate, but I have yet to hear of someone happy with W8 as their main OS.
- Avalaxy 14y ago
  I am _very_ happy with Windows 8 on my tablet (Surface). Does that count? On my PC it's ok... I uninstalled all metro-apps and installed normal software instead. I just see the start screen as a new kind of start menu. To me it looks just like Windows 7 because I don't spend any time in the new UI environment.
  - jagermo 14y ago
    same here. I like Win 8 on my main System (Desktop, dual Monitor, no touch), especially the new Features in the file manager, the taskmanager and the fast boot. I took me around 10 minutes to optimize the modern ui menu - i now use it as a full screen start menu, I don't use any apps at all.
- rm445 14y ago
  I think the hubbub will die down. It takes about ten minutes to make a Windows 8 machine usable - putting the things you want on the start screen and setting the program defaults so nothing runs with the slow pastel apps. Sure, doing so is rejecting many of the new 'features' of the OS. But once set up it is no less usable than Windows 7.
- artimaeis 14y ago
  I've been using Windows 8 as my primary OS since the new year. It was actually a no-brainer for me; I find more functionality with it overall. It's strange to most that I admit this, but I really like the Start screen! It gives me a way to have the visual organization I appreciate while I can keep the desktop itself relatively clean for a workflow environment. On top of all that it's blazing fast and has a ton of features that are great for power-users. So, yeah, I beam happiness with my Windows 8 so you now know of at least one dedicated fan!
- dagw 14y ago
  I'm super happy with windows 8 and miss it when I'm at work using windows 7. It's much better than windows 7 in almost every way. Of course as power user I was willing to actually do some reading, and learn about it and tweak it to my liking. I can imagine someone like my mother, coming directly from XP and perhaps not that interested in learning a new OS would react differently.
- ladzoppelin 14y ago
  I love Windows 8 because of the regular desktop improvements and speed of the system. If you don't want to use metro you do not have to even deal with it at all. The people complaining probably don't notice how much better it is because of a video card issue, some oem "crapware" or some other hardware issue. Hyper-V client, installing to usb, the hardware acceleration improvements, low memory use, lighter install size, file history, security enhancements and overall snappiness make me not want to go back to 7.
- freehunter 14y ago
  Having to use Windows 7 at work is getting to be more and more painful to me the more I use Windows 8 at home. There are many improvements that Windows 8 brings, but all anyone talks about is the incredibly minor point of the start screen, which you're hardly forced to use. I forget it's even there. The only times I'm forced back to Windows 7 is when I'm doing hardware hacking (many custom drivers don't exist for Windows 8, and installing unsigned drivers is a pain) or in the case where a certain older game won't run in Windows 8. 99.9% of my computing time at home is spent in Windows 8 desktop mode, the other 1% split between Metro and my Windows 7 desktop. The problem is there's a very vocal minority of unfortunately influential people who rail against the start screen and convince others that it's a bigger problem than it really is.
- tomku 14y ago
  Many of us are hesitant to join in discussions like this, because the narrative is dominated by people who have clearly either never used Win8 or had decided that they would hate it based on ideological grounds (ZOMG MS TURNING MAH PC INTO A TABLET) before they ever tried it. On other forums, even suggesting that you like Win8 is a sure-fire way to get accused of being an "M$ shill". Anyways, I like it, so I'll try to explain why. First off, most of my interaction with it is identical to Windows 7. I live in my desktop, just like always. All of my most frequently-used apps are pinned to my taskbar, just like always. The window borders and decorations look a bit different, but the reaction to them is so completely over-the-top that it's hard to believe. The rumors that it's a little snappier than Win7 seem to be true, at least on my machines. Yes, all the built-in apps have ribbon toolbars. No, this really isn't some kind of existential threat to your ability to use your computer. I hated the shit out of ribbons when they were introduced in Office. They work really well in Explorer, though. I'm not really sure how to describe it, but they manage to keep common actions more accessible than the old menu/toolbar combination did. There are also some small things that I really appreciate, like having a toggle for hidden items on the View ribbon and having both Command Prompt Here and Powershell Here accessible easily via menu and shortcut. Next, the dreaded Start screen, target of much derision and hatred. My experience with Start menus over the years was that they turned into garbage dumps. Multiple columns of crap in a hierarchical menu where most of the entries were completely useless. MS introduced pinning in XP, and "type to search" in Vista (I think?) to solve that. If you use those, Win8's Start screen is a huge upgrade. If you prefer to hunt through your menus to find apps, you'll be disappointed. I personally don't miss the start menu at all - I have programs pinned on the start screen, sorted left to right by how often I think I'll need them. I can run anything else by typing a few letters of its name, and I honestly don't end up doing that very often. Metro apps are a mixed bag in terms of usefulness. Part of that is that I have a tablet for the kinds of things that Metro apps are good at, and part is that they just aren't there yet in terms of polish. There are several that I really do like, though. The Netflix app, for some reason, works MUCH better on my laptop than the website. Games are generally a good experience as well - I've played a shameful amount of Jetpack Joyride. The stock Calendar app isn't bad, and it syncs with Google Calendar and pops up notifications for that, which is really cool. I use the stock News, Sports and Weather apps occasionally as well. Metro as a whole needs some more work, but I think it'll get it over the next few years. Lastly, I'd like to mention that Win8 is probably the most keyboard-friendly OS I've used. My most frequently-used PC is a laptop, and I've always been a heavy keyboard shortcut user to avoid having to use the touchpad. There's keyboard shortcuts for almost everything in Win8. That includes things like managing/resizing Metro apps, moving around the UI on the Start screen, activating buttons on ribbons. If you press Alt in Explorer, the ribbon lights up with hotkeys. They've also added the somewhat famous Win-X shortcut, which pops up a menu with direct access to a lot of tweaking/admin tools. I miss it whenever I'm on an XP/Vista/7 box. In short, the people who say that it's "unusable" or "crippled" are full of shit. It's a solid evolutionary step up from Win7, with a bunch of superficial changes that are being blown way out of proportion.
jtreminio 14y ago
Just install Start8 [1] on his machine and he'll enjoy all the benefits Win8 brings without the downside of having to bother with Metro apps. [1]: http://www.stardock.com/products/start8/ http://www.stardock.com/products/start8/
pmarsh 14y ago
Instead of going through the trouble of downgrading his machine take 30 minutes to walk through his problems and educate the poor guy.
scholia 14y ago
No, he won't "still show up as Windows 8 in the market share statistics". Or at least, not these statistics. Netmarketshare numbers are based on website traffic, and imperfectly reflect sales and the actual installed base. Still, you should get your client to read this page, and watch the YouTube video: http://www.hanselman.com/blog/Windows8ProductivityWhoMovedMyCheeseOhThereItIs.aspx http://www.hanselman.com/blog/Windows8ProductivityWhoMovedMy...

Mahn 14y ago

I always imagine this as the average case for everyone buying a new laptop now. I don't know, I really don't want to hate, but I have yet to hear of someone happy with W8 as their main OS.

Avalaxy 14y ago
I am _very_ happy with Windows 8 on my tablet (Surface). Does that count? On my PC it's ok... I uninstalled all metro-apps and installed normal software instead. I just see the start screen as a new kind of start menu. To me it looks just like Windows 7 because I don't spend any time in the new UI environment.
- jagermo 14y ago
  same here. I like Win 8 on my main System (Desktop, dual Monitor, no touch), especially the new Features in the file manager, the taskmanager and the fast boot. I took me around 10 minutes to optimize the modern ui menu - i now use it as a full screen start menu, I don't use any apps at all.
rm445 14y ago
I think the hubbub will die down. It takes about ten minutes to make a Windows 8 machine usable - putting the things you want on the start screen and setting the program defaults so nothing runs with the slow pastel apps. Sure, doing so is rejecting many of the new 'features' of the OS. But once set up it is no less usable than Windows 7.
artimaeis 14y ago
I've been using Windows 8 as my primary OS since the new year. It was actually a no-brainer for me; I find more functionality with it overall. It's strange to most that I admit this, but I really like the Start screen! It gives me a way to have the visual organization I appreciate while I can keep the desktop itself relatively clean for a workflow environment. On top of all that it's blazing fast and has a ton of features that are great for power-users. So, yeah, I beam happiness with my Windows 8 so you now know of at least one dedicated fan!
dagw 14y ago
I'm super happy with windows 8 and miss it when I'm at work using windows 7. It's much better than windows 7 in almost every way. Of course as power user I was willing to actually do some reading, and learn about it and tweak it to my liking. I can imagine someone like my mother, coming directly from XP and perhaps not that interested in learning a new OS would react differently.
ladzoppelin 14y ago
I love Windows 8 because of the regular desktop improvements and speed of the system. If you don't want to use metro you do not have to even deal with it at all. The people complaining probably don't notice how much better it is because of a video card issue, some oem "crapware" or some other hardware issue. Hyper-V client, installing to usb, the hardware acceleration improvements, low memory use, lighter install size, file history, security enhancements and overall snappiness make me not want to go back to 7.
freehunter 14y ago
Having to use Windows 7 at work is getting to be more and more painful to me the more I use Windows 8 at home. There are many improvements that Windows 8 brings, but all anyone talks about is the incredibly minor point of the start screen, which you're hardly forced to use. I forget it's even there. The only times I'm forced back to Windows 7 is when I'm doing hardware hacking (many custom drivers don't exist for Windows 8, and installing unsigned drivers is a pain) or in the case where a certain older game won't run in Windows 8. 99.9% of my computing time at home is spent in Windows 8 desktop mode, the other 1% split between Metro and my Windows 7 desktop. The problem is there's a very vocal minority of unfortunately influential people who rail against the start screen and convince others that it's a bigger problem than it really is.
tomku 14y ago
Many of us are hesitant to join in discussions like this, because the narrative is dominated by people who have clearly either never used Win8 or had decided that they would hate it based on ideological grounds (ZOMG MS TURNING MAH PC INTO A TABLET) before they ever tried it. On other forums, even suggesting that you like Win8 is a sure-fire way to get accused of being an "M$ shill". Anyways, I like it, so I'll try to explain why. First off, most of my interaction with it is identical to Windows 7. I live in my desktop, just like always. All of my most frequently-used apps are pinned to my taskbar, just like always. The window borders and decorations look a bit different, but the reaction to them is so completely over-the-top that it's hard to believe. The rumors that it's a little snappier than Win7 seem to be true, at least on my machines. Yes, all the built-in apps have ribbon toolbars. No, this really isn't some kind of existential threat to your ability to use your computer. I hated the shit out of ribbons when they were introduced in Office. They work really well in Explorer, though. I'm not really sure how to describe it, but they manage to keep common actions more accessible than the old menu/toolbar combination did. There are also some small things that I really appreciate, like having a toggle for hidden items on the View ribbon and having both Command Prompt Here and Powershell Here accessible easily via menu and shortcut. Next, the dreaded Start screen, target of much derision and hatred. My experience with Start menus over the years was that they turned into garbage dumps. Multiple columns of crap in a hierarchical menu where most of the entries were completely useless. MS introduced pinning in XP, and "type to search" in Vista (I think?) to solve that. If you use those, Win8's Start screen is a huge upgrade. If you prefer to hunt through your menus to find apps, you'll be disappointed. I personally don't miss the start menu at all - I have programs pinned on the start screen, sorted left to right by how often I think I'll need them. I can run anything else by typing a few letters of its name, and I honestly don't end up doing that very often. Metro apps are a mixed bag in terms of usefulness. Part of that is that I have a tablet for the kinds of things that Metro apps are good at, and part is that they just aren't there yet in terms of polish. There are several that I really do like, though. The Netflix app, for some reason, works MUCH better on my laptop than the website. Games are generally a good experience as well - I've played a shameful amount of Jetpack Joyride. The stock Calendar app isn't bad, and it syncs with Google Calendar and pops up notifications for that, which is really cool. I use the stock News, Sports and Weather apps occasionally as well. Metro as a whole needs some more work, but I think it'll get it over the next few years. Lastly, I'd like to mention that Win8 is probably the most keyboard-friendly OS I've used. My most frequently-used PC is a laptop, and I've always been a heavy keyboard shortcut user to avoid having to use the touchpad. There's keyboard shortcuts for almost everything in Win8. That includes things like managing/resizing Metro apps, moving around the UI on the Start screen, activating buttons on ribbons. If you press Alt in Explorer, the ribbon lights up with hotkeys. They've also added the somewhat famous Win-X shortcut, which pops up a menu with direct access to a lot of tweaking/admin tools. I miss it whenever I'm on an XP/Vista/7 box. In short, the people who say that it's "unusable" or "crippled" are full of shit. It's a solid evolutionary step up from Win7, with a bunch of superficial changes that are being blown way out of proportion.

jtreminio 14y ago

Just install Start8 [1] on his machine and he'll enjoy all the benefits Win8 brings without the downside of having to bother with Metro apps. [1]: http://www.stardock.com/products/start8/ http://www.stardock.com/products/start8/

pmarsh 14y ago

Instead of going through the trouble of downgrading his machine take 30 minutes to walk through his problems and educate the poor guy.

scholia 14y ago

No, he won't "still show up as Windows 8 in the market share statistics". Or at least, not these statistics. Netmarketshare numbers are based on website traffic, and imperfectly reflect sales and the actual installed base. Still, you should get your client to read this page, and watch the YouTube video: http://www.hanselman.com/blog/Windows8ProductivityWhoMovedMyCheeseOhThereItIs.aspx http://www.hanselman.com/blog/Windows8ProductivityWhoMovedMy...