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I think the point you keep missing here is that all education is indoctrination. Even teaching kids to think rationally is indoctrination in the rational metho

by jibiki 18y ago

I think the point you keep missing here is that all education is indoctrination. Even teaching kids to think rationally is indoctrination in the rational method. It's fine to say, "I think we should indoctrinate kids only in rationality," but most people will disagree with you. There is a sort of truce in our society: people don't hate each other for holding different viewpoints (as long as those viewpoints are societally acceptable, which varies from place to place.) Part of this truce is that people are allowed to shape the beliefs of their own children. You can't say "we should never indoctrinate kids." That would be the same as saying "we should never educate kids." You can say "we should only tell kids the truth," but then, whose truth do we tell? The problem is not so simple. It's dishonest to say "no indoctrination" when what you mean is "indoctrination should be more along my lines."

briansmith 18y ago
It is not true that "all education is indoctrination." If I teach you how to make a fire then have I somehow coerced you into a fire-based belief system? If I teach you how to add two numbers then have I introduced you to the religion of numbers? No, I've just given you some facts. If I teach you a process by which you can educate yourself then have I somehow brainwashed you? I don't see how. It is hard to keep indoctrination seperate from education. But, it isn't impossible.
- jibiki 18y ago
  You're right, and I'm wrong, of course. The problem is that it's hard to know who gets to decide what a fact is. There are many people for whom creationism is a fact. Is it okay for them to teach it to their children? If not, why is it okay for you to teach your children about evolution? The fact that evolution is correct is sort of immaterial. There is no knowledge in the absence of cognition. For something to be known, it must be known by someone. We know that evolution is correct, but the creationist "knows" that creationism is correct.

by jibiki 18y ago

briansmith 18y ago

It is not true that "all education is indoctrination." If I teach you how to make a fire then have I somehow coerced you into a fire-based belief system? If I teach you how to add two numbers then have I introduced you to the religion of numbers? No, I've just given you some facts. If I teach you a process by which you can educate yourself then have I somehow brainwashed you? I don't see how. It is hard to keep indoctrination seperate from education. But, it isn't impossible.

jibiki 18y ago
You're right, and I'm wrong, of course. The problem is that it's hard to know who gets to decide what a fact is. There are many people for whom creationism is a fact. Is it okay for them to teach it to their children? If not, why is it okay for you to teach your children about evolution? The fact that evolution is correct is sort of immaterial. There is no knowledge in the absence of cognition. For something to be known, it must be known by someone. We know that evolution is correct, but the creationist "knows" that creationism is correct.