7 ms·

Ask PG: Did the "apply to YC without an idea" experiment work?

• bubba99999 14y ago
  No
• niggler 14y ago
  "Application deadline: March 29" Today's the last day to apply. How did no one notice or think about asking this earlier?
  • 27182818284 14y ago
    People have, it was discussed a tiny bit in a thread before when the app for this round opened.
  • jcr 14y ago
    I read the application for this round when it was announced, and the "no idea" option had been removed. EDIT: took me a while to find it but: https://news.ycombinator.com/apply-noidea https://news.ycombinator.com/apply-noidea > Sorry, we're no longer considering applications for winter 2013. > Check back later to apply for summer. The S13 application date closes today, so either the above needed editing, or the "no idea" option really was removed.
• gkoberger 14y ago
  Here's some previous times this has come up: https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=4512022 https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=4512022 (answer from pg) https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=5262796 https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=5262796
  • shardling 14y ago
    His answer was "It's still too early to tell". It might be reasonable to ask again 200 days later.
    • dgallagher 14y ago
      Also, there may be a need for a large sample size before patterns can be recognized.
  • deleted 14y ago
    [deleted]
• polshaw 14y ago
  It seems to me there would be no benefit to them in allowing it. If you want to get into YC and are smart, determined and all the other qualities they want-- you will come up with something. It may not be right, but PG et al can still decide they want the applicant without liking the idea. Like problem solving in job interviews, doing the exercise tells you a lot more than just if the applicant can get the right answer or not. It can demonstrate your effort, creativity, intelligence, even if it has flaws.
  • djyaz1200 14y ago
    amen
  • btipling 14y ago
    It helps to know something about the business in which you are starting your startup.
• OnyeaboAduba 14y ago
  I'm a sole founder with a non techincal background who is currently outsourcing the development of my site .I applied for the summer batch what do you guys think my chances are ???
  • tomasien 14y ago
    Bad, but mostly because it's incredibly hard to get in regardless of whether you have a stellar application or not.
  • tempestn 14y ago
    But also, I find it pretty hard to imagine building a successful technical startup in this manner. Not saying there's no value to non-technical founders, but alone? How do you evaluate the quality of the outsourced work?
    • famousactress 14y ago
      How do you evaluate the quality of the outsourced work? I find that silly. I'm not a chef but I can taste food. Increasingly I have the tendency to believe that all this technical/non-technical is a really unfortunate simplification. I think especially when it comes to a startup tackling really big problems whether you've programmed before might be a rounding error in the equation toward succeeding.
      • mion 14y ago
        I'm not a chef but I can taste food. That's an unfortunate simplification. Without a technical background, you wouldn't know how long it takes to make a basic CRUD app. "3 weeks? Ok I guess. Oh, 3 months actually? Ok I guess." And what about performance, scalability, costs, etc? You'd have no clue.
        • tempestn 14y ago
          Yes, this is what I was thinking. Obviously you don't have to know everything, but having at least a basic background seems valuable. Even knowing how to code I find it's hard enough to find good developers, especially freelance. Also, and perhaps most importantly, when I find a minor bug in my app, I can fix it myself and push an update immediately. If I relied on freelance developers, well, crap, it's Good Friday. So very least I'm waiting a few days. And then maybe my developer isn't available to drop everything and work on my project on Monday (or Tuesday)... One of the primary advantages of startups is their ability to react and adapt quickly; running a technical startup alone, without a technical background, appears to give up some of that advantage.
• sherm8n 14y ago
  If you really want to apply without an idea just do it. No one is forcing you to fill out every single field of the application. Don't fall victim to being constrained by the limits of the system!
• reeenobo 14y ago
  since pg hasn't replied, my guess is it didn't work.
• pg 14y ago
  To be honest, I wasn't sure whether or not the noidea application was live. I had to go look at the source. So it looks like we de facto killed it by never enabling it for s13. Frankly it's not a big deal either way. We only accepted one noidea application last cycle, and IIRC there were only about 50 applications.
  • dmix 14y ago
    Those low numbers would be expected, not having an idea would certainly be an exception or a minority among entrepreneurs (the type of people who constantly can't fall asleep because of some new crazy idea eatting away at them). But it was certainly an interesting experiment to see if there are people who accept that they have the skillset to build a company but not have the idea part figured out. Although requiring them to come up with an idea could be a good ability test, even if it isn't what they end up building. Because a large number of companies end up doing something different that turns out to be successful. ala "getting to plan b" (or the abused "pivoting") http://www.amazon.com/Getting-Plan-Breaking-Through-Business/dp/1422126692/ http://www.amazon.com/Getting-Plan-Breaking-Through-Business...
  • aaronbrethorst 14y ago
    Who was it?
    • recuter 14y ago
      No idea.
  • robryan 14y ago
    How many companies applied with an idea then said they are not particularly attached to it? I would assume for most people they would rather do that than come off as they have no ideas at all.
  • neurotech1 14y ago
    Considering that YC startups sometimes pivot after getting accepted, wouldn't being able to come up with at least one good idea be a requirement for getting accepted.
• BSousa 14y ago
  While not related to the original question, how does YC work for non US residents and Visa related issues? Does it accept/sponsor a few outside the US startups? IS it interested in doing so?
  • rdl 14y ago
    YC has plenty of non-US residents. Visa situations get resolved on a case by case basis, but there are general guidelines. Essentially visa problems cease to be a showstopper once you have money.
• goronbjorn 14y ago
  Voicegem was one of the no idea companies in the first YC class it was offered. They've already joined Palantir, it seems: http://www.voicegem.com http://www.voicegem.com
• argumentum 14y ago
  Being one of the no idea / barely an idea teams in s12, one of the teams that acrimoniously blew apart and probably one of the teams that led to the changes that YC made for w13, I am glad that "no idea" is no longer an option. I still view YC's willingness to experiment in an extremely positive light. It's why YC is the innovator, and everyone else (500, techstars etc) are just imitators. That being said, I think "no idea" was a bad idea, for YC as investors and advisors, for the following reasons: 1. It created teams that had not actually worked together for a significant length of time on an idea that all founders believed in. In other words, "teams" which were not actually "teams", but rather a set of individuals with strong credentials. 2. Some of the most important psychological benefits of going through YC, particularly the artificial pressure of Demo Day, have a paradoxical effect on "no idea" teams. The experience of watching good startups grow literally before your eyes at weekly dinners is inspiring, but not particularly conducive to coming up with your own idea. For me at least, it created an almost existential angst. 3. Without an idea, a shared revolutionary vision of the future, there is nothing binding a team together. Each time an idea "failed" there was an intense feeling of loss and personal failure, particularly (as mentioned above) when you see the "idea" teams progressing week on week. That emotional baggage can rip apart formerly great friends .. it did in our case. Given that, s12 was not a disaster. For one, many s12 teams are doing brilliantly, and I wouldn't be surprised if there are more than a few black swans amongst my batchmates. But more importantly, it wasn't a failure in the same sense that Edison's first 9,999 light bulbs (that didn't work) were not failures. For me personally, "no idea" was a great idea, as I learned more from my YC experience than can be quantified. While I'd never take funding again without an idea (or a working product or service) as it causes unnecessary and often contradictory pressure, my understanding of how to succeed in startups is orders of magnitude greater than it would have been without YC, and for that I will be eternally grateful.
  • mkeblx 14y ago
    This kind of hits the nail on the head. An idea is in many ways the context by which you judge a startup team in terms of a core commitment to a common goal, as shown by working on it together for a period of time (more than a week, etc.). It defines what 'team' means. Without that, what do you have? Credentials. Of course by disaster I meant just relative to other classes, with a much higher amount of team splits/zombies in such a short period, which seemed predictable. Most startups don't work out, that's expected, but the stage was weighed for things not to work out in re: the startup itself and the friendships involved. Who knows, perhaps you and your friends, with a shared, good idea would have done great in w13, having the right context to build upon where you were at. I know of other teams who were extremely frustrated that something they've dreamed about, Demo Day, turn into something to dread and the quite painfully choosing to give up on the whole endeavor whatever the high personal costs (not necessarily wrongly). One of the best things about pg's essay was the core message to entrepreneurs that a good startup idea requires not a pressure cooker atmosphere to come up with an 'idea' but the natural space in which you notice a problem that can be solved. It's the starting point, not something that can be tacked on later like the noidea concept would suggest.
• jamesmcbennett 14y ago
  I have always worked on the principle that entrepreneurs have 1000 ideas, choosing which idea to work on is the challenge. I presume YC attracts a certain target audience of generally 'people who build things.' . Wonder did YC without an idea change the target audience?
  • argumentum 14y ago
    No, everyone "without an idea" had plenty of ideas, just hadn't yet settled on one.