4 ms·

> What happened at PyCon has cast a spotlight on a range of deep issues and problems in the developer world. What happened at PyCon was nerds making nerd jokes

by mnicole 14y ago

> What happened at PyCon has cast a spotlight on a range of deep issues and problems in the developer world. What happened at PyCon was nerds making nerd jokes. People talk to each other at public events, even with people on stage, and the appropriate thing to do is turn around and ask them politely to keep it down. That is all there is to say on that matter. What happened because of what happened at PyCon was the result of people who have nothing better to do than form at-the-minute internet mobs of hate. While we have a lot of growing to do as a community, it continues to disappoint me that the Greater Internet Dickwad Theory as it relates to this situation keeps being strictly applied to developers who I would wager were actually a very small percentage of the actual trolls involved in harassing her. Trolls that have been actively harassing anyone they so please for years. The best thing about situations like this is that they give you a good excuse to disconnect. To go off-the-grid to try to find yourself again. I would love the opportunity to do such a thing myself and I think we all should; the internet is a quickly moving rapids and it is easy to get sucked under. And while I agree that maybe there should be a group that acts as a safe place for people to shed light on their experiences and try to figure out how to combat them, I don't think now is the time for her to try to say that she should be an "integral part" of such a group. Especially because she used what could have been a perfect opportunity for her to officially apologize to state how hard of a week it has been for her, personally, and not for the man who lost his job and the countless females for whom she claimed to be acting on behalf of.

zzzeek 14y ago
> and the appropriate thing to do is turn around and ask them politely to keep it down there's been a rebuttal to this concept in the form of the #iaskedpolitely tag on twitter. Not everyone is comfortable with direct confrontation in situations like these.
- mnicole 14y ago
  Without going to get into the specifics on how to handle situations that make you uncomfortable, there is always someone you can go to, whether it be event staff, venue staff or higher authorities if you really feel it warrants it. That said, if your anxiety prevents you from standing up for yourself in the first place, then that problem exists outside of the realm of this individual situation and perhaps it is in your best interest to figure out why that is the case and what you can do about it because this will not be the first, last or worst of what life will deal you. Living in fear is the worst way to live, something I am aware of first-hand. It should not hold you captive in your own life. I wish the best to all of those struggling and hope they can find the courage within themselves (and this is not to say there aren't some situations where you're truly better off not saying anything to the accused at all). That said, PyCon had specifically appropriated their CoC to ensure that people had avenues to communicate problems they were having. The argument was then "But I'm the victim, why should I have to get up and do something about it when I did nothing wrong?" which just kind of boggles my mind. Do you or don't you want to make the effort to report this? You will inevitably have to spend time going over it face-to-face with event staff anyway, digging into time you wanted to spend doing something else, so you might as well just get it over with. Fortunately at events, someone will probably have recorded the talk and you can just watch it later. Hopefully next year there will be a way to report via SMS, although I suspect that the ease-of-use that provides will bring about its own set of problems.
  - zzzeek 14y ago
    > Without going to get into the specifics on how to handle situations that make you uncomfortable, there is always someone you can go to, whether it be event staff, venue staff or higher authorities if you really feel it warrants it. correct, talking to event staff is absolutely what someone should do if they feel uncomfortable directly confronting someone. I just hope that people feel comfortable doing this at next years Pycon, without fear of being ostracized for "not asking directly first". I'm disturbed at the level of anger over the idea of someone not being comfortable with direct confrontation. Before you bring out the pitchforks, taking a photo and tweeting is entirely the wrong move and I am not defending that action in any way. I'm only referring to the concept that a safe conference place should be OK with people talking directly to event staff. > That said, if your anxiety prevents you from standing up for yourself in the first place, then that problem exists outside of the realm of this individual situation and perhaps it is in your best interest to figure out why that is the case and what you can do about it because this will not be the first, last or worst of what life will deal you. Living in fear is the worst way to live, something I am aware of first-hand. It should not hold you captive in your own life. I wish the best to all of those struggling and hope they can find the courage within themselves. I have a lot of background in this area as well, and while it's always great if people can learn to overcome all their issues and glide through all social situations in an impressively adept style in all cases, it's not very realistic. Everyone is only capable of being exactly where they are at in their lives, and that should not be a reason to avoid conferences. (Edit: nor is it realistic to assume that someone who is afraid to confront someone even has a problem - fear is not intrinsically a disease, it is a mechanism that very necessarily exists to protect the species from harm - it is only excessive and unfounded fear that is a pathology. Direct confrontation is absolutely not advised in many, many cases, and I'm sure you've had your own experiences where this approach goes terribly wrong.)

by mnicole 14y ago

zzzeek 14y ago

> and the appropriate thing to do is turn around and ask them politely to keep it down there's been a rebuttal to this concept in the form of the #iaskedpolitely tag on twitter. Not everyone is comfortable with direct confrontation in situations like these.

mnicole 14y ago
Without going to get into the specifics on how to handle situations that make you uncomfortable, there is always someone you can go to, whether it be event staff, venue staff or higher authorities if you really feel it warrants it. That said, if your anxiety prevents you from standing up for yourself in the first place, then that problem exists outside of the realm of this individual situation and perhaps it is in your best interest to figure out why that is the case and what you can do about it because this will not be the first, last or worst of what life will deal you. Living in fear is the worst way to live, something I am aware of first-hand. It should not hold you captive in your own life. I wish the best to all of those struggling and hope they can find the courage within themselves (and this is not to say there aren't some situations where you're truly better off not saying anything to the accused at all). That said, PyCon had specifically appropriated their CoC to ensure that people had avenues to communicate problems they were having. The argument was then "But I'm the victim, why should I have to get up and do something about it when I did nothing wrong?" which just kind of boggles my mind. Do you or don't you want to make the effort to report this? You will inevitably have to spend time going over it face-to-face with event staff anyway, digging into time you wanted to spend doing something else, so you might as well just get it over with. Fortunately at events, someone will probably have recorded the talk and you can just watch it later. Hopefully next year there will be a way to report via SMS, although I suspect that the ease-of-use that provides will bring about its own set of problems.
- zzzeek 14y ago
  > Without going to get into the specifics on how to handle situations that make you uncomfortable, there is always someone you can go to, whether it be event staff, venue staff or higher authorities if you really feel it warrants it. correct, talking to event staff is absolutely what someone should do if they feel uncomfortable directly confronting someone. I just hope that people feel comfortable doing this at next years Pycon, without fear of being ostracized for "not asking directly first". I'm disturbed at the level of anger over the idea of someone not being comfortable with direct confrontation. Before you bring out the pitchforks, taking a photo and tweeting is entirely the wrong move and I am not defending that action in any way. I'm only referring to the concept that a safe conference place should be OK with people talking directly to event staff. > That said, if your anxiety prevents you from standing up for yourself in the first place, then that problem exists outside of the realm of this individual situation and perhaps it is in your best interest to figure out why that is the case and what you can do about it because this will not be the first, last or worst of what life will deal you. Living in fear is the worst way to live, something I am aware of first-hand. It should not hold you captive in your own life. I wish the best to all of those struggling and hope they can find the courage within themselves. I have a lot of background in this area as well, and while it's always great if people can learn to overcome all their issues and glide through all social situations in an impressively adept style in all cases, it's not very realistic. Everyone is only capable of being exactly where they are at in their lives, and that should not be a reason to avoid conferences. (Edit: nor is it realistic to assume that someone who is afraid to confront someone even has a problem - fear is not intrinsically a disease, it is a mechanism that very necessarily exists to protect the species from harm - it is only excessive and unfounded fear that is a pathology. Direct confrontation is absolutely not advised in many, many cases, and I'm sure you've had your own experiences where this approach goes terribly wrong.)