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What about Google shutting down the open standard for syncing contact and calendar data across platforms? I don't ask this as a form of "anti-Google sentiment,

What about Google shutting down the open standard for syncing contact and calendar data across platforms? I don't ask this as a form of "anti-Google sentiment," but as a legitimate question. The announcement that they would be phasing out ActiveSync support at the end of last year coupled with the announcement just made that they were doing the same for CalDAV/CardDav (when they announced the end of Reader) indicate they're "silo-ing" the service somewhat. Unless I've missed something, it's still not clear that iOS/iCal calendars are going to sync with Google's unless they "whitelist" Apple. It's not a "cunning plan," it's self-preservation and keeping your stuff working or at the least not being at the mercy of a commercial concern who demonstrates a willingness to break it even for paying customers.

asdfaoeu 14y ago
Just move it when/if they shutdown the service? It's not like they are going to suddenly shutdown the service or remove your ability to export contacts.
Karunamon 14y ago
>It's not a "cunning plan," it's self-preservation Fair enough, and I can see the value in keeping a local backup just for redundancy and convenience purposes (being locked out of my Google account for whatever reason would suck), but using it as your daily driver? Ehhhhhhh.... As far as shutdown fears, though? Calendar, Contacts, and Gmail are the core-est of the core products. They're tied directly into the Android ecosystem as well. Reader was more or less a niche product. Google isn't going to shut down any of the holy three applications which make up the entire backbone of their mobile OS's PIM functionality. Any such fears are completely irrational.
- spinchange 14y ago
  I didn't say anything about them shutting down the services, I said they were "silo-ing" them and clearly moving away from having them interoperate with 3rd party software. It is not at all irrational to worry for how long your enterprise users' contacts and calendars will continue to sync. They've thrown us a lifeline for the time being and even appear to be working on a fix for Outlook 2013 so it will sync (it doesn't as of right now), but the whole process of sunsetting support for ActiveSync then CalDAV completely tips their hand that they want to control who and what interoperates with it - and for how much longer it will interoperate with platforms beside their own Android core PIM suite =| the entire mobile and desktop universe. There are people paying for Google's enterprise apps offering that don't use Android. What is in question is for how long core services of those apps will work outside of a browser/Android device.
- just2n 14y ago
  I barely use Calendar or Contacts. I only use Gmail for the mail -- something everything else can do, too, and it's a far cry to call gmail something impressive. By web dev standards, it's a fairly basic application. When I got my n7, I considered Reader to be the core of the core of the core of that device. As soon as I powered it up, I was on Reader instantly reading new posts from tens of blogs I like to follow. I wasn't interested in the magazines they wanted to throw at me because immediate digital publishing has pretty much killed the magazine/newspaper industry. So for me, reading news and tech articles on my Android device WAS Reader. That's a HUGE part of why the device was purchased. Do I use it to gmail? No, maybe to read mail, but not to respond to it because typing more than a paragraph on a touch interface is maddening. Do I use it to sync contacts? No, it's not a social device for me. Do I use it to do calendary stuff? No, I do that on my phone, so syncing both of those are turned off. The device is a web browser, game console, and news consumption engine. What drove those were Chrome, the app store, and Reader. One would think those things would be held up by Google as core parts of the platform, but maybe they want to push their own news web portal and Currents. Who knows.
- sentenza 14y ago
  Are you really sure about calendar being a core product? Because the userbase size (without knowing what it actually is) probably isn't all too different from that of reader. It will probably be around forever as a part of google apps, but the free calendar for everybody might eventually face the chopping block.
  - reeses 14y ago
    As part of google apps, it's a mediocre solution. It's not good for collaborating with people outside your organization (clients, patients, whatever else ends in -ients) but it's just good enough to prevent me from going with a hosted Exchange solution or to go back to administering our own infrastructure. I suspect it's prioritized to remain at that level.
donniezazen 14y ago
Google moving away from open standards is a current popular opinion in bologsphere. Google has always made it super easy to take away your data. So, if you are not happy with a company than just don't take their services.
- spinchange 14y ago
  It's not an opinion. In the case of WebDAV, they are, in fact, moving away from open standards. It's also not about data export - it's about making commitments to businesses that pay for these services under contract and in conjunction with software that may or may not work with the apps in future.
  - mitchty 14y ago
    You mean Caldav not webdav correct?
    - spinchange 14y ago
      Correct. I meant CalDAV/CardDAV by extension.
  - donniezazen 14y ago
    You also have to realize that nothing can be committed forever. I don't really subscribe to doomsday warnings. Open Standards is an idea and not Google's corporate policy. It will prevail as long as 'the people' care for open standards.
samstave 14y ago
Calendaring is a big issue in enterprises, especially when you have Apple, Google and Microsoft devices with all separate calendar apps. Many organizations, very large ones in fact, are interested in moving away from exchange as their mail platform and going with Gmail. However, the gripe is that calendaring with Gmail is simply utterly broken. iOS devices dont get updates, creating resources is a complete joke (if anyone at google reads this; whomever designed the method for implementing resources in gmail/ical should be fired, and stripped of their ability to code ANYTHING). At the same time - companies are looking for greater integration with their calendars and resources and devices etc... What would be ideal - is a standard calendar blob which any view can access via an agreed protocol (maybe caldav is supposed to be this - but from the way resources are created/accessible/scheduled, its broken). The next layer that everyone I have been working with over the last two years is looking for is "my location as it relates to the resources I am attempting to use" Things like wayfinding, occupancy, meeting-start-based-on-presence, issue reporting etc... are just some of the features people are looking to add to the calendar systems. None of this will be possible if Google is willy-nilly changing what they do, support, implement etc.. The sad thing is that for core business services Google seems to be running away terrified - and I suspect this is due to their inability to understand customer support.

asdfaoeu 14y ago

Just move it when/if they shutdown the service? It's not like they are going to suddenly shutdown the service or remove your ability to export contacts.

Karunamon 14y ago

>It's not a "cunning plan," it's self-preservation Fair enough, and I can see the value in keeping a local backup just for redundancy and convenience purposes (being locked out of my Google account for whatever reason would suck), but using it as your daily driver? Ehhhhhhh.... As far as shutdown fears, though? Calendar, Contacts, and Gmail are the core-est of the core products. They're tied directly into the Android ecosystem as well. Reader was more or less a niche product. Google isn't going to shut down any of the holy three applications which make up the entire backbone of their mobile OS's PIM functionality. Any such fears are completely irrational.

spinchange 14y ago
I didn't say anything about them shutting down the services, I said they were "silo-ing" them and clearly moving away from having them interoperate with 3rd party software. It is not at all irrational to worry for how long your enterprise users' contacts and calendars will continue to sync. They've thrown us a lifeline for the time being and even appear to be working on a fix for Outlook 2013 so it will sync (it doesn't as of right now), but the whole process of sunsetting support for ActiveSync then CalDAV completely tips their hand that they want to control who and what interoperates with it - and for how much longer it will interoperate with platforms beside their own Android core PIM suite =| the entire mobile and desktop universe. There are people paying for Google's enterprise apps offering that don't use Android. What is in question is for how long core services of those apps will work outside of a browser/Android device.
just2n 14y ago
I barely use Calendar or Contacts. I only use Gmail for the mail -- something everything else can do, too, and it's a far cry to call gmail something impressive. By web dev standards, it's a fairly basic application. When I got my n7, I considered Reader to be the core of the core of the core of that device. As soon as I powered it up, I was on Reader instantly reading new posts from tens of blogs I like to follow. I wasn't interested in the magazines they wanted to throw at me because immediate digital publishing has pretty much killed the magazine/newspaper industry. So for me, reading news and tech articles on my Android device WAS Reader. That's a HUGE part of why the device was purchased. Do I use it to gmail? No, maybe to read mail, but not to respond to it because typing more than a paragraph on a touch interface is maddening. Do I use it to sync contacts? No, it's not a social device for me. Do I use it to do calendary stuff? No, I do that on my phone, so syncing both of those are turned off. The device is a web browser, game console, and news consumption engine. What drove those were Chrome, the app store, and Reader. One would think those things would be held up by Google as core parts of the platform, but maybe they want to push their own news web portal and Currents. Who knows.
sentenza 14y ago
Are you really sure about calendar being a core product? Because the userbase size (without knowing what it actually is) probably isn't all too different from that of reader. It will probably be around forever as a part of google apps, but the free calendar for everybody might eventually face the chopping block.
- reeses 14y ago
  As part of google apps, it's a mediocre solution. It's not good for collaborating with people outside your organization (clients, patients, whatever else ends in -ients) but it's just good enough to prevent me from going with a hosted Exchange solution or to go back to administering our own infrastructure. I suspect it's prioritized to remain at that level.

donniezazen 14y ago

Google moving away from open standards is a current popular opinion in bologsphere. Google has always made it super easy to take away your data. So, if you are not happy with a company than just don't take their services.

spinchange 14y ago
It's not an opinion. In the case of WebDAV, they are, in fact, moving away from open standards. It's also not about data export - it's about making commitments to businesses that pay for these services under contract and in conjunction with software that may or may not work with the apps in future.
- mitchty 14y ago
  You mean Caldav not webdav correct?
  - spinchange 14y ago
    Correct. I meant CalDAV/CardDAV by extension.
- donniezazen 14y ago
  You also have to realize that nothing can be committed forever. I don't really subscribe to doomsday warnings. Open Standards is an idea and not Google's corporate policy. It will prevail as long as 'the people' care for open standards.

samstave 14y ago

Calendaring is a big issue in enterprises, especially when you have Apple, Google and Microsoft devices with all separate calendar apps. Many organizations, very large ones in fact, are interested in moving away from exchange as their mail platform and going with Gmail. However, the gripe is that calendaring with Gmail is simply utterly broken. iOS devices dont get updates, creating resources is a complete joke (if anyone at google reads this; whomever designed the method for implementing resources in gmail/ical should be fired, and stripped of their ability to code ANYTHING). At the same time - companies are looking for greater integration with their calendars and resources and devices etc... What would be ideal - is a standard calendar blob which any view can access via an agreed protocol (maybe caldav is supposed to be this - but from the way resources are created/accessible/scheduled, its broken). The next layer that everyone I have been working with over the last two years is looking for is "my location as it relates to the resources I am attempting to use" Things like wayfinding, occupancy, meeting-start-based-on-presence, issue reporting etc... are just some of the features people are looking to add to the calendar systems. None of this will be possible if Google is willy-nilly changing what they do, support, implement etc.. The sad thing is that for core business services Google seems to be running away terrified - and I suspect this is due to their inability to understand customer support.