4 ms·
Perhaps the better approach to solving this problem is to stop repeating it on tech blogs, and start moving to publishing and discussing it in HR blogs and simi
by bobwaycott 14y ago
Perhaps the better approach to solving this problem is to stop repeating it on tech blogs, and start moving to publishing and discussing it in HR blogs and similarly appropriate, targeted mediums. As stated elsewhere[1], this is undoubtedly the existing mentality of the audience to whom this article is written. Those who actually need this advice are the existing and future HR managers and departments who are in charge of hiring.
I spent some time about a year-and-a-half ago building up and managing a small internal development department at a mid-size corporation. I was involved in finding talent to fill development roles in the company twice. The first time, I sat in on an existing search and interviews for a role in a different department. The process could not have been more broken--the position had been open for roughly one year, and the interviews yielded no hirable candidate (as judged by the individuals making the hiring decision). The second time, I led a search for positions freshly opened for my department. The process could not have been more smooth--three strong candidates were hired within three weeks. The only significant difference between the two hiring pushes was the approach--the first was focused entirely on a candidate who had n years of experience on platform X; the second focused on candidates who showed the greatest talent and aptitude in previous professional and personal projects, and gave the greatest indications they were a great fit for the personality of the team.
After we completed our hirings, the VP of HR pulled me aside to mention she'd never seen anyone conduct interviews like we did (she sat in on a couple after hearing about how we'd done the first candidate interview), and was impressed by the way the candidates responded in the interviews. She could "feel" which candidates were going to be hired, even though she had no knowledge of software development. We discussed the differing approaches between hiring for talent and hiring for n years of X experience. She intuitively understood the difference, but had not ever seen it in practice as intentionally as we pulled off.
Programmers understand this. Small businesses who are predominantly programmer-driven or -dependent understand this, too. Even big businesses who are primarily technology-focused show signs of getting this as well (a recent round of interviewing with an Oracle company surprised me with how much they were focused on the right things).
The proverbial dragon to slay here is the HR departments, managers, students, and training programs lacking this advice as fundamental practice. Perhaps we need to see more process-oriented and manager-level technologists joining up with HR professionals to advance the point. Maybe HR departments and educational efforts could start creating Developer Advocates to assist in crafting better approaches and more finely tailored practices to support development/engineering talent. These might be the vanguard of producing better job descriptions and interview processes to hire talent that is more competent, productive, dependable, and retainable.
The most important lesson I learned when I worked with a formal HR department to hire new people is that they care. They really do. They don't want to hire terrible candidates who are going to be miserable, hate their jobs, and drag down a team. They want to empower people to improve professionally while taking care of a company's needs. We need to start working with and spreading this advice among the HR professionals who will increase their value to both companies and personnel by including it in their standard procedures.
[1]: https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=5441337 https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=5441337
[edit: forgot link & punctuation error]
- Ovid 14y ago> Perhaps the better approach to solving this problem is to stop repeating it on tech blogs, and start moving to publishing and discussing it in HR blogs and similarly appropriate, targeted mediums. I'm a computer programmer, but I also do recruiting for a company in Amsterdam and their approach is most definitely "talent". A typical question is "given two arrays, find all the elements in one array that are also in the second array". Most people come up with the standard O(n*m) "two loops" solution the first time (for x in first, for y in second, if x == y ...). The company might let that slide as interview nervousness and ask if there's a way they can do it faster. They completely understand if your programming background is different and asking "trivia" questions about a given language or requiring you to check some tech boxes is silly. You just have to be competent. Sadly, most programmers aren't competent. If they tell me they're comfortable with OO programming, I'll ask them to define OO programming for me and then I squirm as I listen to them. But then gems show up and I have a lively conversation with someone who really knows their stuff and we offer them a relocation package to Amsterdam. Helping people live their dreams like that is really awesome, but I couldn't do it if I was forced to demand that programmers check off boxes on a form. (Relevant side note: I've routinely worked for companies for which a knowledge of UML was "required". I've never used this in my professional life)
- mailshanx 14y agoJust saw the blog you write, and i must say: it is incredibly awesome indeed! I believe that travel expands one's mind greatly, and it would be a shame to not travel while you can. I'm wrapping up my thesis here in Singapore now, and i'll buzz you when i'm done: it would be an awesome experience to interview with shops that emphasize on core CS concepts rather than some arbitrary piece of tech:)
- Ovid 14y agoGlad you like it! I've lived in five countries so far and were it not for a two-year-old daughter, I'd keep country-hopping (though my wife and I have considered moving to Malta).
- pekk 14y ago