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It would be an ad hominem if I were in an argument with Dave and instead of listening to his points attacked him personally. In this case I'm talking about need

by brm 14y ago

It would be an ad hominem if I were in an argument with Dave and instead of listening to his points attacked him personally. In this case I'm talking about needing to see the forest for the trees. I'll gladly judge him on his acts a person in the position of being a gatekeeper to a world people build lives hopes and dreams on. You don't have to be a dick to be a good investor and advisor.

ghayes 14y ago
My concern is that you're calling someone a "dick" on a public forum. I believe that's unfounded and unnecessary. Dave is actually a very nice and caring person when you meet and talk to him, his public persona be as it may.
- brm 14y ago
  And we shouldn't discuss him based on his self-established public persona in a public forum? I worry that we're building a culture of internet builders that excuse boorish behavior because someone has a platform or something we need access to. I may be wrong to call him a dick in general but his reaction in this case can certainly be called 'dickish'.
- cmbaus 14y ago
  The same sort of behavior from Linus has been bothering me as well. Linus may hold the keys to something many people want access to, but that doesn't justify his recent behavior. When you are in a position of authority, you should hold yourself to a higher standard. When 500 Startups didn't have the influence it does now, Dave McClure's schtick may have made sense as a marketing ploy. But the days of needing over the top rhetoric to get attention are over. Compare Dave McClure with Jack Dorsey. Who would rather work with and who sets a better example for the technology industry to follow?
  - derefr 14y ago
    I disagree with you, but I also disagree with those who would disagree with you. To put it shortly--I think Linus has every right to be an asshole to people who want to contribute to "his" project. And I think we have every right to be mad at him for it. And I think he has every right to tell us to piss off for being mad at him for it. And I think we have every right to be mad at him for that. Isn't free society wonderful? :)
    - cmbaus 14y ago
      Linus has a right to act however he wants. That doesn't make it right, and frankly it doesn't give me a higher opinion of him. We've seen thread after thread in the past couple weeks about the "locker room" mentality of the industry, but from my seat it seems like a lot of people are condoning it.
      - derefr 14y ago
        I don't know anything about "the industry", since I go out of my way to avoid working in "the industry"--but I want "going to work" to be another way to say "going to go goof off with my friends in a way that makes us money somehow." And I like it when my friends act like assholes; it's amusing, because I know them well enough to know it's not really all that serious. That might not work very well when your coworkers aren't your friends--but really, that's the problem with that, not anything to do with objectively objectionable behavior.
  - lotsofcows 14y ago
    "When you are in a position of authority, you should hold yourself to a higher standard." Why? Says who? As soon as people make it to a certain level, they should change? What level? If they're no longer who they were, what do you expect them to achieve in the future? There are 7 billion people on the planet, the vast majority of them do not share your values.

by brm 14y ago

ghayes 14y ago

My concern is that you're calling someone a "dick" on a public forum. I believe that's unfounded and unnecessary. Dave is actually a very nice and caring person when you meet and talk to him, his public persona be as it may.

brm 14y ago
And we shouldn't discuss him based on his self-established public persona in a public forum? I worry that we're building a culture of internet builders that excuse boorish behavior because someone has a platform or something we need access to. I may be wrong to call him a dick in general but his reaction in this case can certainly be called 'dickish'.
cmbaus 14y ago
The same sort of behavior from Linus has been bothering me as well. Linus may hold the keys to something many people want access to, but that doesn't justify his recent behavior. When you are in a position of authority, you should hold yourself to a higher standard. When 500 Startups didn't have the influence it does now, Dave McClure's schtick may have made sense as a marketing ploy. But the days of needing over the top rhetoric to get attention are over. Compare Dave McClure with Jack Dorsey. Who would rather work with and who sets a better example for the technology industry to follow?
- derefr 14y ago
  I disagree with you, but I also disagree with those who would disagree with you. To put it shortly--I think Linus has every right to be an asshole to people who want to contribute to "his" project. And I think we have every right to be mad at him for it. And I think he has every right to tell us to piss off for being mad at him for it. And I think we have every right to be mad at him for that. Isn't free society wonderful? :)
  - cmbaus 14y ago
    Linus has a right to act however he wants. That doesn't make it right, and frankly it doesn't give me a higher opinion of him. We've seen thread after thread in the past couple weeks about the "locker room" mentality of the industry, but from my seat it seems like a lot of people are condoning it.
    - derefr 14y ago
      I don't know anything about "the industry", since I go out of my way to avoid working in "the industry"--but I want "going to work" to be another way to say "going to go goof off with my friends in a way that makes us money somehow." And I like it when my friends act like assholes; it's amusing, because I know them well enough to know it's not really all that serious. That might not work very well when your coworkers aren't your friends--but really, that's the problem with that, not anything to do with objectively objectionable behavior.
- lotsofcows 14y ago
  "When you are in a position of authority, you should hold yourself to a higher standard." Why? Says who? As soon as people make it to a certain level, they should change? What level? If they're no longer who they were, what do you expect them to achieve in the future? There are 7 billion people on the planet, the vast majority of them do not share your values.