5 ms·

I agree that our K-12 sucks, but why is our university system considered good? For instance, Berkeley, Stanford, MIT/FSF, Carnegie-Mellon, UIUC, etc, have made

I agree that our K-12 sucks, but why is our university system considered good? For instance, Berkeley, Stanford, MIT/FSF, Carnegie-Mellon, UIUC, etc, have made valuable contributions to Computer Science (this is becoming less true as commercial and open-source have overtaken academia in many respects). Is it possible that our K-12 system is broken is the reason that our kids are capable of pursuing their own interests instead of the rigor of rote learning? As a kid, I remember the easiness of school homework allowed me to spend many afternoons in IRC and learning programming on my own. E.g, with too much free time on your hands, are you capable of thinking different instead of answering challenging homework? Not defending our K-12, just wondering how bringing in a Confucian system like Asia and Europe would affect the outside-the-box thinking.

clicks 14y ago
Only responding to a small part of your argument: For every univ. that is good, there is a Univ. of Phoenix. But, for every univ. that is good you also have Bronx High school of NY... which produced 8 Nobel prize laureates, you have Stuyvesant, which produced 5 Nobel prize laureates. America is much a place of extremes -- you'll often find the best and worst from nearly every category.
- jballanc 14y ago
  This is practically the only description of America that you need, and it's only become more apparent to me now that I've left. America is obsessed with extremes. You could add health care to schools as an example. America is the last place in the world I'd want to be if I broke my arm (especially if I happened to be uninsured at the time), but probably the first place I'd go if I was diagnosed with some obscure cancer.
  - drstewart 14y ago
    Spoken like someone who hasn't had to receive health care in Africa. Or maybe you have. Can you tell me why you'd rate your experience in rural Angola as so good that you'd rather go there to treat a broken arm than Johns Hopkins?
    - octagonal 14y ago
      He probably meant "I'd rather be in any other developed nation than the US"
Dewie 14y ago
> I agree that our K-12 sucks, but why is our university system considered good? For instance, Berkeley, Stanford, MIT/FSF, Carnegie-Mellon, UIUC, etc, have made valuable contributions to Computer Science (this is becoming less true as commercial and open-source have overtaken academia in many respects). The US has some world-class universities, but that doesn't necessarily mean that the tertiary education system is great overall: for that I guess you would have to average all the universities. > Is it possible that our K-12 system is broken is the reason that our kids are capable of pursuing their own interests instead of the rigor of rote learning? As a kid, I remember the easiness of school homework allowed me to spend many afternoons in IRC and learning programming on my own. E.g, with too much free time on your hands, are you capable of thinking different instead of answering challenging homework? Not defending our K-12, just wondering how bringing in a Confucian system like Asia and Europe would affect the outside-the-box thinking. I can appreciate the possibility of having less time to do rote memorization busywork could actually be a boon, but... to something like the idea of K-12 being bad, and spin into something that actually makes people better off as a whole nation... that sounds like rationalization on a whole new level. I guess anything to keep the America uber alles idea alive.

clicks 14y ago

Only responding to a small part of your argument: For every univ. that is good, there is a Univ. of Phoenix. But, for every univ. that is good you also have Bronx High school of NY... which produced 8 Nobel prize laureates, you have Stuyvesant, which produced 5 Nobel prize laureates. America is much a place of extremes -- you'll often find the best and worst from nearly every category.

jballanc 14y ago
This is practically the only description of America that you need, and it's only become more apparent to me now that I've left. America is obsessed with extremes. You could add health care to schools as an example. America is the last place in the world I'd want to be if I broke my arm (especially if I happened to be uninsured at the time), but probably the first place I'd go if I was diagnosed with some obscure cancer.
- drstewart 14y ago
  Spoken like someone who hasn't had to receive health care in Africa. Or maybe you have. Can you tell me why you'd rate your experience in rural Angola as so good that you'd rather go there to treat a broken arm than Johns Hopkins?
  - octagonal 14y ago
    He probably meant "I'd rather be in any other developed nation than the US"

Dewie 14y ago

> I agree that our K-12 sucks, but why is our university system considered good? For instance, Berkeley, Stanford, MIT/FSF, Carnegie-Mellon, UIUC, etc, have made valuable contributions to Computer Science (this is becoming less true as commercial and open-source have overtaken academia in many respects). The US has some world-class universities, but that doesn't necessarily mean that the tertiary education system is great overall: for that I guess you would have to average all the universities. > Is it possible that our K-12 system is broken is the reason that our kids are capable of pursuing their own interests instead of the rigor of rote learning? As a kid, I remember the easiness of school homework allowed me to spend many afternoons in IRC and learning programming on my own. E.g, with too much free time on your hands, are you capable of thinking different instead of answering challenging homework? Not defending our K-12, just wondering how bringing in a Confucian system like Asia and Europe would affect the outside-the-box thinking. I can appreciate the possibility of having less time to do rote memorization busywork could actually be a boon, but... to something like the idea of K-12 being bad, and spin into something that actually makes people better off as a whole nation... that sounds like rationalization on a whole new level. I guess anything to keep the America uber alles idea alive.