2 ms·

just trying to illustrate my impression through an example :) obviously I realize that in a country of millions you will have plenty jaywalkers, so rebuttals li

by dlitwak 14y ago

just trying to illustrate my impression through an example :) obviously I realize that in a country of millions you will have plenty jaywalkers, so rebuttals like "I jaywalk and I'm German" are kind of missing the point . . .

TillE 14y ago
Your mistake was choosing Berlin rather than any other part of Germany. I've lived here (Kreuzberg) for four years, and as far as I'm concerned all the stories about Germans yelling at you for jaywalking are pure urban legend. I see people doing it constantly, and no one gives a fuck. Not as much as in New York, but it's hardly some profound cultural divide.
buster 14y ago
Missing the point is that you try to think of an explanation but missing most obvious reasons (like preventing kids to run in front of cars). Beginning the sentence with "The Germans" when you have only been in one city feels kind of offensive to me. Especially since you draw conclusions very quick out of no real substance, imo.
- dlitwak 14y ago
  I spent three weeks there, it wasn't an exhaustive study on the psyche of the German people I'll give you that. But it was drawn on substance, I had numerous meetings with berlin tech people, and just thought the jaywalking observation seemed in line from the impressions I got from those meetings. But there are differences in culture, so I guess if referring to the "Germans" as a whole offends you there is nothing I can do.
  - buster 14y ago
    I much rather think that the observation "germans don't jaywalk" did fit into your pre-existing prejudices about germans, because obviously all germans are tidy, always on time, accurate, law-abiding and what not ;) Three weeks looking around and always telling yourself "HA, anotherone NOT jaywalking!" is hardly substance.
  - mxfh 14y ago
    It's not exactly hard science to generalize from a three week visit to a part of the City of Berlin, which is the most heterogeneous place it's gets when it comes to trying to define The Germans, yet i think your observation seems to be quite in line with mine, assuming you traveled from and to the trade fair (ICC) and the usual start-up neighborhoods. It definitely makes a difference where in Berlin you stay. Jaywalking is highly localized and time depended. (The hilarious construction site crossing at Unter den Linden, which many are forced to walk for the lack of an operating U-Bahn is not the norm.) The red light phases here are actually manageable to wait through, no comparison to feeling the you-shouldn't-even-think-about-walking-here attitude pedestrian traffic regulation radiates in most of the US. The real equivalent to jaywalking is crossing the red lights by bike, if you opt to going by foot you're not in a hurry in the first place. And yes there are quite a lot of bikers out there, even in the current perpetual winter. That said Hamburg's comparably long pedestrian red-light phases seem to be way more nerve-wracking to the average Berlin trained pedestrian than I ever imagined.

by dlitwak 14y ago

TillE 14y ago

Your mistake was choosing Berlin rather than any other part of Germany. I've lived here (Kreuzberg) for four years, and as far as I'm concerned all the stories about Germans yelling at you for jaywalking are pure urban legend. I see people doing it constantly, and no one gives a fuck. Not as much as in New York, but it's hardly some profound cultural divide.

buster 14y ago

Missing the point is that you try to think of an explanation but missing most obvious reasons (like preventing kids to run in front of cars). Beginning the sentence with "The Germans" when you have only been in one city feels kind of offensive to me. Especially since you draw conclusions very quick out of no real substance, imo.

dlitwak 14y ago
I spent three weeks there, it wasn't an exhaustive study on the psyche of the German people I'll give you that. But it was drawn on substance, I had numerous meetings with berlin tech people, and just thought the jaywalking observation seemed in line from the impressions I got from those meetings. But there are differences in culture, so I guess if referring to the "Germans" as a whole offends you there is nothing I can do.
- buster 14y ago
  I much rather think that the observation "germans don't jaywalk" did fit into your pre-existing prejudices about germans, because obviously all germans are tidy, always on time, accurate, law-abiding and what not ;) Three weeks looking around and always telling yourself "HA, anotherone NOT jaywalking!" is hardly substance.
- mxfh 14y ago
  It's not exactly hard science to generalize from a three week visit to a part of the City of Berlin, which is the most heterogeneous place it's gets when it comes to trying to define The Germans, yet i think your observation seems to be quite in line with mine, assuming you traveled from and to the trade fair (ICC) and the usual start-up neighborhoods. It definitely makes a difference where in Berlin you stay. Jaywalking is highly localized and time depended. (The hilarious construction site crossing at Unter den Linden, which many are forced to walk for the lack of an operating U-Bahn is not the norm.) The red light phases here are actually manageable to wait through, no comparison to feeling the you-shouldn't-even-think-about-walking-here attitude pedestrian traffic regulation radiates in most of the US. The real equivalent to jaywalking is crossing the red lights by bike, if you opt to going by foot you're not in a hurry in the first place. And yes there are quite a lot of bikers out there, even in the current perpetual winter. That said Hamburg's comparably long pedestrian red-light phases seem to be way more nerve-wracking to the average Berlin trained pedestrian than I ever imagined.