4 ms·

Doesn't the American Constitution have that 'freedom of speech' amendment? I'm British, so American culture is alien to me, but I've always had the view that y

Doesn't the American Constitution have that 'freedom of speech' amendment? I'm British, so American culture is alien to me, but I've always had the view that you can say whatever you want. People have shouted how Hitler did no wrong, and people have cried how x, y and z people should be put on a plane to another country, but when someone overhears a private conversation containing technical terms (that if you're pedantic enough to take as a joke) you get persecuted; professionally shot by firing squad at dawn. This is super surreal, you'd get laughed out of the room if the same events happened in the UK (and probably most of Europe).

rmc 14y ago
US Constitutionly free speech refers to the government making laws banning things. That's not what happened here. This is super surreal, you'd get laughed out of the room if the same events happened in the UK (and probably most of Europe). Same thing can happen in Europe too. There was some ruby conference in scotland which cancelled itself for sexism reasons.
- regularfry 14y ago
  You're thinking of britruby, not scotruby.
  - deleted 14y ago
    [deleted]
jiggy2011 14y ago
Well freedom of speech legislation just guarantees that the government cannot prosecute you as a criminal for saying something. It doesn't mean that a private company cannot fire you or a conference cannot ask you to leave etc. Ironically in the UK we actually do have laws that can potentially make you a criminal because you insulted someone. http://reformsection5.org.uk/ http://reformsection5.org.uk/
- csmattryder 14y ago
  >It doesn't mean that a private company cannot fire you or a conference cannot ask you to leave etc. True, and I can respect how they were representing their company at PyCon, but it just seems silly. But what's done is done I guess, the only exit strategy for the whole event is to move on and get on with our lives. And I am well aware of our laws, the chap who was jailed for joking about a bomb plot at Robin Hood Airport, which was heavy-handed, but our archaic laws are catching up with tech eventually!
- rmc 14y ago
  Well freedom of speech legislation just guarantees that the government cannot prosecute you as a criminal for saying something. Which is funny because some US states have laws that criminize you for saying something about someone, even if it's true! http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Defamation#Criminal_defamation_3 http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Defamation#Criminal_defamation_...
- deleted 14y ago
  [deleted]
runarb 14y ago
The United States has a strong legal framework to regulate freedom of speech. But that manly regulates what is a criminal offense (something that is an offence that violates criminal law and can be punished by the state). However it do not necessarily protect anyone from sanctions from your employer. In this case it is his employer that has acted, not the state.
arethuza 14y ago
"I've always had the view that you can say whatever you want." Not a particularly sensible view given the strength of libel/slander laws in England and Wales (fortunately not quite so bad in Scotland, no idea about NI) and the pretty strong "Hate speech" laws we have throughout the UK: http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Hate_speech_laws_in_the_United_Kingdom http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Hate_speech_laws_in_the_United_... [NB I'm not 100% certain that complete freedom of speech is a great idea either]
pfortuny 14y ago
Being rude as in 'joking during a talk at a conference' and even more being rude while being paid for attending (which seems to be the case) said conference might not enter into 'freedom of speech'. I a more with the 'honorable behaviour' than with the 'sexist' argument. The fact that you can say whatever you want does not mean you can do so at any time or any place. You can enter into any (judicial) court and shout "I hate the Queen" but then you will probably be expelled from it, despite your very rightful speech.
- jiggy2011 14y ago
  I think that it might still be technically treasonous to speak ill of the Queen at all. Though obviously if that is the case it isn't actively enforced.

rmc 14y ago

US Constitutionly free speech refers to the government making laws banning things. That's not what happened here. This is super surreal, you'd get laughed out of the room if the same events happened in the UK (and probably most of Europe). Same thing can happen in Europe too. There was some ruby conference in scotland which cancelled itself for sexism reasons.

regularfry 14y ago
You're thinking of britruby, not scotruby.
- deleted 14y ago
  [deleted]

jiggy2011 14y ago

Well freedom of speech legislation just guarantees that the government cannot prosecute you as a criminal for saying something. It doesn't mean that a private company cannot fire you or a conference cannot ask you to leave etc. Ironically in the UK we actually do have laws that can potentially make you a criminal because you insulted someone. http://reformsection5.org.uk/ http://reformsection5.org.uk/

csmattryder 14y ago
>It doesn't mean that a private company cannot fire you or a conference cannot ask you to leave etc. True, and I can respect how they were representing their company at PyCon, but it just seems silly. But what's done is done I guess, the only exit strategy for the whole event is to move on and get on with our lives. And I am well aware of our laws, the chap who was jailed for joking about a bomb plot at Robin Hood Airport, which was heavy-handed, but our archaic laws are catching up with tech eventually!
rmc 14y ago
Well freedom of speech legislation just guarantees that the government cannot prosecute you as a criminal for saying something. Which is funny because some US states have laws that criminize you for saying something about someone, even if it's true! http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Defamation#Criminal_defamation_3 http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Defamation#Criminal_defamation_...
deleted 14y ago
[deleted]

runarb 14y ago

The United States has a strong legal framework to regulate freedom of speech. But that manly regulates what is a criminal offense (something that is an offence that violates criminal law and can be punished by the state). However it do not necessarily protect anyone from sanctions from your employer. In this case it is his employer that has acted, not the state.

arethuza 14y ago

"I've always had the view that you can say whatever you want." Not a particularly sensible view given the strength of libel/slander laws in England and Wales (fortunately not quite so bad in Scotland, no idea about NI) and the pretty strong "Hate speech" laws we have throughout the UK: http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Hate_speech_laws_in_the_United_Kingdom http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Hate_speech_laws_in_the_United_... [NB I'm not 100% certain that complete freedom of speech is a great idea either]

pfortuny 14y ago

Being rude as in 'joking during a talk at a conference' and even more being rude while being paid for attending (which seems to be the case) said conference might not enter into 'freedom of speech'. I a more with the 'honorable behaviour' than with the 'sexist' argument. The fact that you can say whatever you want does not mean you can do so at any time or any place. You can enter into any (judicial) court and shout "I hate the Queen" but then you will probably be expelled from it, despite your very rightful speech.

jiggy2011 14y ago
I think that it might still be technically treasonous to speak ill of the Queen at all. Though obviously if that is the case it isn't actively enforced.