4 ms·

Agreed, but he's based in the UK, so the 'we own all your IP' thing doesn't apply here. On company time yes, in your own time I believe not. Your own time would

by analog 14y ago

Agreed, but he's based in the UK, so the 'we own all your IP' thing doesn't apply here. On company time yes, in your own time I believe not. Your own time would not be "in the course of his or her employment." http://www.ipo.gov.uk/types/copy/c-ownership/c-employer.htm http://www.ipo.gov.uk/types/copy/c-ownership/c-employer.htm

arethuza 14y ago
I've seen employment contracts in the UK that try the "own time" thing - these are probably not enforceable, but you probably wouldn't want to go through the process of putting that to the test.
- analog 14y ago
  Yup, you'd want to strike out any clauses like that before you signed any employment contract that had them in.
  - Swinx43 14y ago
    Definitely worth doing that as it is actually a lot more common in the UK for these clauses to be part of any developer's contract than what people realize. Believe me I had to learn it the hard way.
- Silhouette 14y ago
  It is widespread practice in the UK for "a certain type of organisation" to include a blanket IP clause in their standard employment contracts. I don't know of any robust legal argument that such a clause should not be enforceable (which isn't to say that none exists, but I've been involved in some fairly heavy negotiations on this score in the past and no lawyer on either side has ever questioned that aspect to my knowledge). If you choose to work for that type of organisation, it is therefore similarly widespread practice for anyone who's any good to demand that the clause be replaced with something more equitable, probably using magic words like "in the course of your employment" or something similar. I don't know what default rules apply under all possible circumstances in the absence of any explicit agreement, but if you work in an IP-related field and don't have an explicit agreement about IP rights in your contract, you're crazy. :-)
  - arethuza 14y ago
    "a certain type of organisation" I'd love to know what you mean by that! :-)
    - Silhouette 14y ago
      What I actually meant was the kind of company, usually large, often foreign-owned, where HR is run by droids who think creative people are interchangeable commodities whose souls should rightfully belong to the company 24/7 in return for paying their salary. If they're smart enough to let the managers who need to get real work done override the paranoia of the corporate legal and HR departments, they can still hire good people by allowing flexibility in the contract when these over-reaching terms are almost inevitably challenged. Some places just won't deviate from their standard contract and if you want a job with them then you just have to suck it up. Strangely, I don't know many good creative people who work for those places.

by analog 14y ago

arethuza 14y ago

I've seen employment contracts in the UK that try the "own time" thing - these are probably not enforceable, but you probably wouldn't want to go through the process of putting that to the test.

analog 14y ago
Yup, you'd want to strike out any clauses like that before you signed any employment contract that had them in.
- Swinx43 14y ago
  Definitely worth doing that as it is actually a lot more common in the UK for these clauses to be part of any developer's contract than what people realize. Believe me I had to learn it the hard way.
Silhouette 14y ago
It is widespread practice in the UK for "a certain type of organisation" to include a blanket IP clause in their standard employment contracts. I don't know of any robust legal argument that such a clause should not be enforceable (which isn't to say that none exists, but I've been involved in some fairly heavy negotiations on this score in the past and no lawyer on either side has ever questioned that aspect to my knowledge). If you choose to work for that type of organisation, it is therefore similarly widespread practice for anyone who's any good to demand that the clause be replaced with something more equitable, probably using magic words like "in the course of your employment" or something similar. I don't know what default rules apply under all possible circumstances in the absence of any explicit agreement, but if you work in an IP-related field and don't have an explicit agreement about IP rights in your contract, you're crazy. :-)
- arethuza 14y ago
  "a certain type of organisation" I'd love to know what you mean by that! :-)
  - Silhouette 14y ago
    What I actually meant was the kind of company, usually large, often foreign-owned, where HR is run by droids who think creative people are interchangeable commodities whose souls should rightfully belong to the company 24/7 in return for paying their salary. If they're smart enough to let the managers who need to get real work done override the paranoia of the corporate legal and HR departments, they can still hire good people by allowing flexibility in the contract when these over-reaching terms are almost inevitably challenged. Some places just won't deviate from their standard contract and if you want a job with them then you just have to suck it up. Strangely, I don't know many good creative people who work for those places.