4 ms·

So, you should be able to show me dozens of tools that are the default choice within these ecosystems, that make programmers build things in this way. Can you

by WayneDB 14y ago

So, you should be able to show me dozens of tools that are the default choice within these ecosystems, that make programmers build things in this way. Can you please name some tools and tell us how they say this is the right way to do things?

splawn 14y ago
Why do JAVA, C# (and the like) IDE's have such complex feature sets? Is it not a reflection of the complexity that those ecosystems require for maintaining your code?
- WayneDB 14y ago
  Which feature set? The core of these IDEs is a debugger that is highly integrated with a text editor. Is there a problem with that? IDEs often show me the files that are in the project. Another common (core) feature is code completion. Also, integration with common source control systems. Too complex yet? You didn't mention XCode. Why not? It has all of those features. So, it must be the non-core feature of IDEs that makes one seem complex and the other not. Which features are you talking about?
  - splawn 14y ago
    I concede you make a good point. Most of the features you listed I end up using via command line rather than it being integrated directly in my editor. Maybe part of what i see as complexity is just my cheese being moved. However, and correct me if im wrong, IDE's are more popular with "powerhouse" OOP languages in general. I always thought that it was because navigating these types of projects with just a simple text editor was too cumbersome without the editor being aware of context.
raverbashing 14y ago
Really? Eclipse, Netbeans, Maven, JUnit, JLog J2SE libraries - pretty much all of them Apache libraries Hibernate J2EE libraries The list is endless Even Google App Engine manages to be way more convoluted in Java than in Python or Go, it's not even funny
- WayneDB 14y ago
  These are all defaults and you are forced to use them, right? Furthermore - does this really help the argument that "the whole ms stack sucks balls" or even "the whole java stack..."?
- sukuriant 14y ago
  I use Netbeans[1] and Eclipse all the time, and I don't write Java code like that. Then again, I write GUI's by hand in swing, so .... there is that. [1] edited from Netflix. I use Netflix all the time, too!
  - raverbashing 14y ago
    Netflix? I think you mean Netbeans maybe =) I don't write java code like that as well (and I don't use swing) but sometimes is unavoidable due to the ways the libraries are structured.

by WayneDB 14y ago

splawn 14y ago

Why do JAVA, C# (and the like) IDE's have such complex feature sets? Is it not a reflection of the complexity that those ecosystems require for maintaining your code?

WayneDB 14y ago
Which feature set? The core of these IDEs is a debugger that is highly integrated with a text editor. Is there a problem with that? IDEs often show me the files that are in the project. Another common (core) feature is code completion. Also, integration with common source control systems. Too complex yet? You didn't mention XCode. Why not? It has all of those features. So, it must be the non-core feature of IDEs that makes one seem complex and the other not. Which features are you talking about?
- splawn 14y ago
  I concede you make a good point. Most of the features you listed I end up using via command line rather than it being integrated directly in my editor. Maybe part of what i see as complexity is just my cheese being moved. However, and correct me if im wrong, IDE's are more popular with "powerhouse" OOP languages in general. I always thought that it was because navigating these types of projects with just a simple text editor was too cumbersome without the editor being aware of context.

raverbashing 14y ago

Really? Eclipse, Netbeans, Maven, JUnit, JLog J2SE libraries - pretty much all of them Apache libraries Hibernate J2EE libraries The list is endless Even Google App Engine manages to be way more convoluted in Java than in Python or Go, it's not even funny

WayneDB 14y ago
These are all defaults and you are forced to use them, right? Furthermore - does this really help the argument that "the whole ms stack sucks balls" or even "the whole java stack..."?
sukuriant 14y ago
I use Netbeans[1] and Eclipse all the time, and I don't write Java code like that. Then again, I write GUI's by hand in swing, so .... there is that. [1] edited from Netflix. I use Netflix all the time, too!
- raverbashing 14y ago
  Netflix? I think you mean Netbeans maybe =) I don't write java code like that as well (and I don't use swing) but sometimes is unavoidable due to the ways the libraries are structured.