4 ms·

Who pays for your food?

by cscurmudgeon 14y ago

PavlovsCat 14y ago
The sun.
- cscurmudgeon 14y ago
  Ah. I did not know I was talking to a plant. My bad.
  - PavlovsCat 14y ago
    Whatever I could mention, you could ask "where does that have it from", and the buck stops with the sun. Which is a finite mass of energy burning away, with no sane person dreaming to claim it as their own. The rest is what we do with that. But you're right to bring up plants, I guess we also need minerals, energy isn't everything. But still, I owe no man. I simply don't buy into it, I just accept it for the time being that most everybody else does, and that some get all stabby when you suggest enacting what is actually fact, namely we don't own shit but our time and work.
    - cscurmudgeon 14y ago
      No the buck stops with the fundamental laws of physics. What you are suggesting will quickly devolve into barbarism. E.g., if I build a house, don't I at least have the right to sleep peacefully in it with my family? Suppose I start with raw materials Y, and transform that into X. Are you saying that everyone else has the same rights to X as I have? Then, in that case you don't even own your body. Watch out for my horde of pillagers and looters! :) "I owe no man." Similarly, no other man owes you anything!
      - PavlovsCat 14y ago
        What you are suggesting will quickly devolve into barbarism. Contrary to what? You really think a bunch of people owning most of the land makes us more civilized? That this is not barbarism? HEH. Oh, and I also mentioned people owning their time and work, so maybe I should have added "dignity" to that and it would have nipped your strawman right in the bud. I just thought it obvious that I am suggesting something less selfish, not more selfish. I suggest shared ownership of shared resources, born out of taking selfish human delusions less seriously. I suggest a bigger focus on stewardship and less delusions of ownership. But you have a point; this suggestion is not intended for barbarians who think leashes make people better or viable in the first place, just because it's true for them. I simply have no plan for those yet, sorry.
        cscurmudgeon 14y ago
        Contrary to what? You really think a bunch of people owning most of the land makes us more civilized? That this is not barbarism? HEH. Are you comparing pillagers with land owners? Sigh and I also mentioned people owning their time and work Tell me what kind of work you can produce without using any natural resources? I suggest shared ownership of shared resources, born out of taking selfish human delusions less seriously. I suggest a bigger focus on stewardship and less delusions of ownership. This is nothing but a subtle leash.

Who pays for your food?

PavlovsCat 14y ago

The sun.

cscurmudgeon 14y ago
Ah. I did not know I was talking to a plant. My bad.
- PavlovsCat 14y ago
  Whatever I could mention, you could ask "where does that have it from", and the buck stops with the sun. Which is a finite mass of energy burning away, with no sane person dreaming to claim it as their own. The rest is what we do with that. But you're right to bring up plants, I guess we also need minerals, energy isn't everything. But still, I owe no man. I simply don't buy into it, I just accept it for the time being that most everybody else does, and that some get all stabby when you suggest enacting what is actually fact, namely we don't own shit but our time and work.
  - cscurmudgeon 14y ago
    No the buck stops with the fundamental laws of physics. What you are suggesting will quickly devolve into barbarism. E.g., if I build a house, don't I at least have the right to sleep peacefully in it with my family? Suppose I start with raw materials Y, and transform that into X. Are you saying that everyone else has the same rights to X as I have? Then, in that case you don't even own your body. Watch out for my horde of pillagers and looters! :) "I owe no man." Similarly, no other man owes you anything!
    - PavlovsCat 14y ago
      What you are suggesting will quickly devolve into barbarism. Contrary to what? You really think a bunch of people owning most of the land makes us more civilized? That this is not barbarism? HEH. Oh, and I also mentioned people owning their time and work, so maybe I should have added "dignity" to that and it would have nipped your strawman right in the bud. I just thought it obvious that I am suggesting something less selfish, not more selfish. I suggest shared ownership of shared resources, born out of taking selfish human delusions less seriously. I suggest a bigger focus on stewardship and less delusions of ownership. But you have a point; this suggestion is not intended for barbarians who think leashes make people better or viable in the first place, just because it's true for them. I simply have no plan for those yet, sorry.
      - cscurmudgeon 14y ago
        Contrary to what? You really think a bunch of people owning most of the land makes us more civilized? That this is not barbarism? HEH. Are you comparing pillagers with land owners? Sigh and I also mentioned people owning their time and work Tell me what kind of work you can produce without using any natural resources? I suggest shared ownership of shared resources, born out of taking selfish human delusions less seriously. I suggest a bigger focus on stewardship and less delusions of ownership. This is nothing but a subtle leash.