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Poor people don’t have clutter because they’re too dumb to see the virtue of living simply; they have it to reduce risk. Thats about the best way of putting it

Poor people don’t have clutter because they’re too dumb to see the virtue of living simply; they have it to reduce risk. Thats about the best way of putting it I've come across. It can be perceived risk as well. One thing I noticed when clearing out my depression-era grandparents house is that they basically saved everything they had a hard time getting at any point. My grandfather had a garage full of glass jars because there was a time in his life when he literally could not afford/find a simple glass jar when he needed one. The more I think about that, the more it freaks me out. I have a hard disk full of MP3 files...

comrade_ogilvy 14y ago
The article makes a reasonable point, that hoarding can be motivated by rational frugality. I think it is a little unfair in its criticism of the original article, whose target audience is really people with many options (i.e. they have money). I would say I have personally seen people who have an irrational tendency to hoard as a means to reduce risk. I have a neighbor with a house packed to the gills with accumulations over the decades. If she would clear it out, she could be renting a room for $800-$1000 a month. She could really use the money, too. Instead, she is being held hostage by ~$2000 of junk in disorganized piles, that would take 50 weekends of yard sales to make a dent.
icefox 14y ago
The entire premise of this blog entry is: "Go out on the street and look, and I bet you’ll see that the richer people are carrying less." Well some guys did that very thing and published is in a book http://www.amazon.com/Millionaire-Next-Door-Thomas-Stanley/dp/0671015206/wwwicefoxnet-20 http://www.amazon.com/Millionaire-Next-Door-Thomas-Stanley/d... where they found that to be not true at all. Millionaire's don't buy the shiny new toy when the one from three years ago. Rather then wasting a grand on a new macbook air they would spend $30 for a new battery. They buy used cars too.
- deleted 14y ago
  [deleted]
- baddox 14y ago
  That has very little to do with how much stuff they carry.
- beachstartup 14y ago
  the millionaires "next door" that i know do both. suburban california families worth a couple million bucks or more (white and asian tech and biotech industry families), i have seen: * buy shiny new luxury cars... but drive them for a very long time. they also buy used cars because they have lots of cars (3-4+ per household) * buy brand new apple products constantly... but also use 10 year old PCs and other old tech * eat out and buy overpriced organic groceries whole foods ... but also buy bulk stuff at the not-rich-people supermarket because they cook too * go on expensive vacations.... every 3 years this stuff is not black and white, and it's really ridiculous to hear stuff like "millionaires don't buy the shiny new toy" .. yes they do.
  - acchow 14y ago
    I know a guy who's family net worth is $2+ billion. When he goes to the movies, he brings pre-popped popcorn in ziploc bags and shares with his friends.
    - lifeisstillgood 14y ago
      Some might say that's the way to keep your money, when you have 2bn. Others might say that's the way to keep friends, when you have 2bn.
      - zobzu 14y ago
        or just whatever the guy feels like doing, in fact
    - beachstartup 14y ago
      yeah? if he's like most rich kids i've known he probably does it because it's more fun to flout the rules at the theater than to buy their popcorn. NO OUTSIDE FOOD OR DRINK. lots of rich kids i knew in college dealt drugs. think about that one for a minute. same exact (rule-flouting) behavior as poor folk - but is it because they were poor? or frugal? was it because they didn't want to spend their own money on their own drugs, or because they enjoyed flouting the rules to get free weed/coke/x/whatever?
acchow 14y ago
> Poor people don’t have clutter because they’re too dumb to see the virtue of living simply; they have it to reduce risk. I wish English had better grammatical structure. I had to re-parse that sentence 5 times. > Poor people have clutter not because they're too dumb to see the virtue of living simply; they have it to reduce risk. FTFY. EDIT: I parsed it wrong. Fixed.
- untothebreach 14y ago
  Thank you, I had the same issue
  - ARobotics 14y ago
    Actually, the above rephrasing is wrong and completely changes the meaning. The original author wasn't saying poor people have less clutter he was saying they have more, but for a reason. Maybe this wording is clearer: The reason poor people have clutter isn't because they're too dumb to see the virtue of living simply, they have it to reduce risk.
- frooxie 14y ago
  > Poor people have less clutter What? This is about poor people having MORE clutter, not less.
- nwatson 14y ago
  I think he's actually saying: "Poor people actually do indeed have a lot of clutter. Not because they don't see how they could live simply and how that would improve their outlook -- but because they have to have the clutter (the junk they've accumulated) because they might need that junk in the future, and the risk of throwing anything away is too great."
- habitue 14y ago
  This is a textbook example of a garden path sentence: http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Garden_path_sentence http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Garden_path_sentence. Another example is "The horse raced past the barn fell"
- 14y ago

comrade_ogilvy 14y ago

The article makes a reasonable point, that hoarding can be motivated by rational frugality. I think it is a little unfair in its criticism of the original article, whose target audience is really people with many options (i.e. they have money). I would say I have personally seen people who have an irrational tendency to hoard as a means to reduce risk. I have a neighbor with a house packed to the gills with accumulations over the decades. If she would clear it out, she could be renting a room for $800-$1000 a month. She could really use the money, too. Instead, she is being held hostage by ~$2000 of junk in disorganized piles, that would take 50 weekends of yard sales to make a dent.

icefox 14y ago

The entire premise of this blog entry is: "Go out on the street and look, and I bet you’ll see that the richer people are carrying less." Well some guys did that very thing and published is in a book http://www.amazon.com/Millionaire-Next-Door-Thomas-Stanley/dp/0671015206/wwwicefoxnet-20 http://www.amazon.com/Millionaire-Next-Door-Thomas-Stanley/d... where they found that to be not true at all. Millionaire's don't buy the shiny new toy when the one from three years ago. Rather then wasting a grand on a new macbook air they would spend $30 for a new battery. They buy used cars too.

deleted 14y ago
[deleted]
baddox 14y ago
That has very little to do with how much stuff they carry.
beachstartup 14y ago
the millionaires "next door" that i know do both. suburban california families worth a couple million bucks or more (white and asian tech and biotech industry families), i have seen: * buy shiny new luxury cars... but drive them for a very long time. they also buy used cars because they have lots of cars (3-4+ per household) * buy brand new apple products constantly... but also use 10 year old PCs and other old tech * eat out and buy overpriced organic groceries whole foods ... but also buy bulk stuff at the not-rich-people supermarket because they cook too * go on expensive vacations.... every 3 years this stuff is not black and white, and it's really ridiculous to hear stuff like "millionaires don't buy the shiny new toy" .. yes they do.
- acchow 14y ago
  I know a guy who's family net worth is $2+ billion. When he goes to the movies, he brings pre-popped popcorn in ziploc bags and shares with his friends.
  - lifeisstillgood 14y ago
    Some might say that's the way to keep your money, when you have 2bn. Others might say that's the way to keep friends, when you have 2bn.
    - zobzu 14y ago
      or just whatever the guy feels like doing, in fact
  - beachstartup 14y ago
    yeah? if he's like most rich kids i've known he probably does it because it's more fun to flout the rules at the theater than to buy their popcorn. NO OUTSIDE FOOD OR DRINK. lots of rich kids i knew in college dealt drugs. think about that one for a minute. same exact (rule-flouting) behavior as poor folk - but is it because they were poor? or frugal? was it because they didn't want to spend their own money on their own drugs, or because they enjoyed flouting the rules to get free weed/coke/x/whatever?

acchow 14y ago

> Poor people don’t have clutter because they’re too dumb to see the virtue of living simply; they have it to reduce risk. I wish English had better grammatical structure. I had to re-parse that sentence 5 times. > Poor people have clutter not because they're too dumb to see the virtue of living simply; they have it to reduce risk. FTFY. EDIT: I parsed it wrong. Fixed.

untothebreach 14y ago
Thank you, I had the same issue
- ARobotics 14y ago
  Actually, the above rephrasing is wrong and completely changes the meaning. The original author wasn't saying poor people have less clutter he was saying they have more, but for a reason. Maybe this wording is clearer: The reason poor people have clutter isn't because they're too dumb to see the virtue of living simply, they have it to reduce risk.
frooxie 14y ago
> Poor people have less clutter What? This is about poor people having MORE clutter, not less.
nwatson 14y ago
I think he's actually saying: "Poor people actually do indeed have a lot of clutter. Not because they don't see how they could live simply and how that would improve their outlook -- but because they have to have the clutter (the junk they've accumulated) because they might need that junk in the future, and the risk of throwing anything away is too great."
habitue 14y ago
This is a textbook example of a garden path sentence: http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Garden_path_sentence http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Garden_path_sentence. Another example is "The horse raced past the barn fell"
14y ago