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>you just have to write it up in HTML + JS, like every other app on the device. Except the browser. Mozilla could build Firefox for iOS using the technologies

>you just have to write it up in HTML + JS, like every other app on the device. Except the browser. Mozilla could build Firefox for iOS using the technologies available to other third party apps on iOS. They (rightly) don't think that is good enough because it means they can't build a browser that is competitive performance wise with the built in browser. http://news.cnet.com/8301-14013_3-57573440/mozilla-says-no-plans-to-return-to-ios/ http://news.cnet.com/8301-14013_3-57573440/mozilla-says-no-p... The sticking point for Mozilla is not being able to carry over its sophisticated rendering and javascript engines to iOS. Essentially, the organization doesn't feel like it can build the browser it wants to for Apple's platform, Sullivan told CNET.

sp332 14y ago
I'm not sure what you mean. Apple rejects apps which duplicate native functionality. It took years for Google to get their Maps and Chrome apps into the App store. And guess what Chrome is on iPhone? It's just a wrapper around the native iOS webkit engine, exactly the same as the Firefox app is a wrapper for the native gecko on FirefoxOS. Also, the reason you can't get good performance on a 3rd-party iOS browser is that Apple artificially restricts JIT to first-party apps.
callahad 14y ago
> Except the browser. Actually, Firefox on FirefoxOS is written in HTML + JS. Here's the source: https://github.com/mozilla-b2g/gaia/tree/master/apps/browser https://github.com/mozilla-b2g/gaia/tree/master/apps/browser Sure, the HTML + JS runtime on FirefoxOS is Gecko, but that's an implementation detail. The browser itself, as users will experience it, is Just Another Webapp.
- pifflesnort 14y ago
  > Sure, the HTML + JS runtime on FirefoxOS is Gecko, but that's an implementation detail. The browser itself, as users will experience it, is Just Another Webapp. Except that it's NOT, because the core of the whole thing -- HTML + JS -- is native. Apple does the same thing on iOS -- you can use UIWebView to render HTML/CSS, and to execute JS. Yet that wasn't good enough for Mozilla -- why?
  - deleted 14y ago
    [deleted]
  - sp332 14y ago
    Apple doesn't allow 3rd party apps to use their JIT, which means all the JS is slow. http://daringfireball.net/2011/03/nitro_ios_43 http://daringfireball.net/2011/03/nitro_ios_43 And they're not allowed to make certain calls into the OS to make a fast native JIT, even if they wanted to make their own browser from scratch. So due to artificial policy decisions, it's doomed to be slow.
    - pifflesnort 14y ago
      > And they're not allowed to make certain calls into the OS to make a fast native JIT, even if they wanted to make their own browser from scratch. So due to artificial policy decisions, it's doomed to be slow Yeah, and Firefox doesn't allow native code execution at all either, so, also slow. Mozilla doesn't have the moral high-ground here, in that they're also creating two tiers of developer: Mozilla, and everyone else.
      - deleted 14y ago
        [deleted]
      - sp332 14y ago
        At least if Chrome made a version like they did with iOS (just a wrapper around the native web engine) it would have a JIT. That would be an improvement over the iOS version.
        pifflesnort 14y ago
        That's pretty much splitting hairs. Let's say Google wants to push forward dart, NaCL, or something Mozilla has never thought of, or would never agree with. Now what?
        sp332 14y ago
MatthewPhillips 14y ago
> Mozilla could build Firefox for iOS using the technologies available to other third party apps on iOS. That's not true, Mozilla could build Firefox for iOS the way they want to, they just can't release it on the App Store. It's an imposed limitation, not a technical one. As others have said, if you can compile WebKit with Emscripten you can build a WebKit-based browser for Firefox OS that gets 2x performance vs. native.

sp332 14y ago

I'm not sure what you mean. Apple rejects apps which duplicate native functionality. It took years for Google to get their Maps and Chrome apps into the App store. And guess what Chrome is on iPhone? It's just a wrapper around the native iOS webkit engine, exactly the same as the Firefox app is a wrapper for the native gecko on FirefoxOS. Also, the reason you can't get good performance on a 3rd-party iOS browser is that Apple artificially restricts JIT to first-party apps.

callahad 14y ago

> Except the browser. Actually, Firefox on FirefoxOS is written in HTML + JS. Here's the source: https://github.com/mozilla-b2g/gaia/tree/master/apps/browser https://github.com/mozilla-b2g/gaia/tree/master/apps/browser Sure, the HTML + JS runtime on FirefoxOS is Gecko, but that's an implementation detail. The browser itself, as users will experience it, is Just Another Webapp.

pifflesnort 14y ago
> Sure, the HTML + JS runtime on FirefoxOS is Gecko, but that's an implementation detail. The browser itself, as users will experience it, is Just Another Webapp. Except that it's NOT, because the core of the whole thing -- HTML + JS -- is native. Apple does the same thing on iOS -- you can use UIWebView to render HTML/CSS, and to execute JS. Yet that wasn't good enough for Mozilla -- why?
- deleted 14y ago
  [deleted]
- sp332 14y ago
  Apple doesn't allow 3rd party apps to use their JIT, which means all the JS is slow. http://daringfireball.net/2011/03/nitro_ios_43 http://daringfireball.net/2011/03/nitro_ios_43 And they're not allowed to make certain calls into the OS to make a fast native JIT, even if they wanted to make their own browser from scratch. So due to artificial policy decisions, it's doomed to be slow.
  - pifflesnort 14y ago
    > And they're not allowed to make certain calls into the OS to make a fast native JIT, even if they wanted to make their own browser from scratch. So due to artificial policy decisions, it's doomed to be slow Yeah, and Firefox doesn't allow native code execution at all either, so, also slow. Mozilla doesn't have the moral high-ground here, in that they're also creating two tiers of developer: Mozilla, and everyone else.
    - deleted 14y ago
      [deleted]
    - sp332 14y ago
      At least if Chrome made a version like they did with iOS (just a wrapper around the native web engine) it would have a JIT. That would be an improvement over the iOS version.
      - pifflesnort 14y ago
        That's pretty much splitting hairs. Let's say Google wants to push forward dart, NaCL, or something Mozilla has never thought of, or would never agree with. Now what?
        sp332 14y ago

MatthewPhillips 14y ago

> Mozilla could build Firefox for iOS using the technologies available to other third party apps on iOS. That's not true, Mozilla could build Firefox for iOS the way they want to, they just can't release it on the App Store. It's an imposed limitation, not a technical one. As others have said, if you can compile WebKit with Emscripten you can build a WebKit-based browser for Firefox OS that gets 2x performance vs. native.