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Who took a chance on you? No one. Perfect SAT scores. Great grades. Most creative in class. Most encouraged in class. Rejected by every college but one. Afte

by edw519 14y ago

Who took a chance on you? No one. Perfect SAT scores. Great grades. Most creative in class. Most encouraged in class. Rejected by every college but one. After graduating college, rejected by every prospective employer except Denny's. Taught myself to program and gave it away until someone hired me. Ten time employee who quit every company because someone got promoted over me even though I did 3X the work. Beat the pavement but couldn't find customers until I wrote the software first, then they purchased. When friends & family saw how much money I made, they all wanted in on it until they saw the sacrifice I expected from them, then every one backed out. Rejected by Alphalab because "no one would buy" what I had already sold many times. Rejected by Ycombinator because they didn't think anyone would buy what I had already sold many times. Rejected by Incubate Miami because they wanted to see a business with a product and customers first. (Then why would I need you guys? I thought the whole point of these programs was to find otherwise unavailable opportunities by giving prospective founders a break from their other responsibilities to be able to focus on just building.) Rejected by prospective cofounders who didn't want to make the same sacrifices I have made. After being underestimated by the cool kids, teachers, girls, family members, employers, and strangers for being an ugly skinny nerd my whole life, I thought it would be different in the tech world, but it's not. It's still a beauty contest based primarily of superficial subjective perceptions. People are still often too lazy or unable to dig below the surface to find the reality. Please don't misunderstand. I'm not bitter. I'm glad... I wouldn't be half the builder I am now if someone would have given me a break along the way. So I just keep on building and loving it.

RobAley 14y ago
Have you ever stopped to consider why no one gives you a break? If so, what did you conclude? (This is a serious question, not a snipe).
- kamaal 14y ago
  Actually advertising yourself is a huge factor in things like these. Merit doesn't always count. Look at it this way, a manager is likely to promote a guy who for example... takes him out for lunch, looks after his interests at work and else where. Managers trust 'yes men'. So if you work hard but don't quite really act like their closest associates in the gang, you are done. Nerds with high self worth, who can actually be something by themselves by their work and sweat alone can't do all this. They always lose out like edw519 even if they have done 3x the work. Lose out might be the wrong word. Because though you lose out on the shorter run. On the longer run, the 'yes men' lose capability to do something on their own (Read:Retire on their middle management job). The hard working nerd, if he really sticks to his guns and doesn't give up will make it big someday.
  - blablabla123 14y ago
    To say it bluntly, on average people with high EQ are more successful than people with high IQ. (There's a whole book about it.)
    - sjs382 14y ago
      What book? (Feel free to post an affiliate link!) Also, is this book something you'd recommend to someone who's just casually interested in the subject?
      - dmiladinov 14y ago
        I believe he was referring to Daniel Goleman's Emotional Intelligence[1]. Edit: Though it's been a while since I read it last, I remember finding it very informative and insightful. I don't think you need to be a psychologist or neuroscience expert to read it and benefit. [1]: http://www.amazon.com/Emotional-Intelligence-Matter-More-Than/dp/055338371X http://www.amazon.com/Emotional-Intelligence-Matter-More-Tha...
      - blablabla123 14y ago
        dmiladinov is right with the book. I bought it half a year ago, actually I also got pointed to it via some HN post. I only read a few dozen pages at the start and in the middle yet, but it is certainly interesting I think. IIRC the reviews on Amazon are very mixed though.
  - jbooth 14y ago
    To put it a little less cynically (those who take care of their image at the office are not always 'yes men'), look at making sure that your accomplishments are recognized as part of your job. If you write a bunch of code but don't test it before shipping, it doesn't matter how hard you worked on it -- if it's got a ton of bugs, you can't really expect a pat on the back. Similarly, if you accomplish stuff for the company and nobody knows, what credit can you expect for it?
comatose_kid 14y ago
Hey edw519 If I left 10 companies because someone got promoted despite the fact that I did 3x the work, several questions would pop into my head: 1) Did the company value what I was working 3x as hard on? 2) Did the company know that I was working 3x as hard? Was I able to demonstrate a tangible result of this extra effort? 3) What could I do differently so that this doesn't happen again? What can I learn from the person who did get promoted? Why has this happened 10x? Someone else mentioned a study of EQ vs. IQ -> I agree - after a certain point, IQ isn't the determining factor, how you enhance the abilities of the team (and make other team members feel) is also very important.
- jen_h 14y ago
  It doesn't make any sense to promote someone who keeps their head down and does three times the work without squawking. As an employee moves up the chain, they spend more time in meetings/managing, less time doing, they get paid more to add less to the bottom line. Unless it becomes obvious to those above that the 3x worker will leave without some recognition/challenge, nothing happens. When they get it, the pattern I've seen is Year 1: "Okay, how many awards can we give you and keep you in your current role?" Year 2: "Ugh, okay, what raises can we give you to keep you in your current role?" Year 3: "Alright, alright; how much headcount do we now need to justify to replace you after we promote you? Three? Seriously? Holy cow, get the checkbook..." If a 3x-the-work person stews silently and just leaves in a huff without communicating what it is that they want from their chain of command, they miss on all that fun (and several rounds of salary bump).
Scriptor 14y ago
I'm also curious what "Most creative in class" means. It seems odd to say nobody ever gave you a break while simultaneously saying you were the "Most encouraged". While not exactly the same, surely people recognized his strengths then? > Rejected by every college but one. Which colleges did you apply to? Plenty of people with great grades and perfect SAT scores still end up rejected from top-tier colleges. > Taught myself to program and gave it away until someone hired me. So someone decided to hire a young person with only self-taught programming experience and (I'm assuming) no CS degree. Certainly sounds like someone gave you a break here.
- Tycho 14y ago
  Only if you ignore the "giving it away for free" part of that sentence.
- ruswick 14y ago
  I highly doubt that he had "perfect SAT scores." A 2400 with good grades is an effective guarantee at most state flagships (and most mid-range private schools for that matter.) He is either mischaracterizing his merits or didn't apply to realistic school choices.
  - nostrademons 14y ago
    Most people with perfect SAT scores don't apply to state schools. That's why a perfect SAT score is an effective guarantee at getting into one. He also did say "but one", which makes me think he got into his safety.
  - kosei 14y ago
    Most prestigious universities put a lot of weight on the essay and the interview as well. If his interactions in these two areas came off as cantankerous as he is coming off here, I'd understand letting in a guy with a 1580 over a guy with a 1600. (Based on the fact that he's had 10 jobs, I'm sure he was graded on the 1600 point scale, not out of 2400) And trust me, not every perfect SAT score is a guarantee of getting into Harvard, Princeton, Yale, MIT, Stanford, etc.
dkkkdkdk 14y ago
You remind me of me. And I am a bit bitter. Everyday I cry into to the sky and yell "fuck them, I will succeed not matter what". I will succeed no matter what, even if it kills me.
- deleted 14y ago
  [deleted]
bconway 14y ago
Ten time employee who quit every company because someone got promoted over me even though I did 3X the work. ... When friends & family saw how much money I made, they all wanted in on it until they saw the sacrifice I expected from them, then every one backed out. ... Rejected by prospective cofounders who didn't want to make the same sacrifices I have made. ... I thought it would be different in the tech world, but it's not. It's still a beauty contest based primarily of superficial subjective perceptions. People are still often too lazy or unable to dig below the surface to find the reality. ... Please don't misunderstand. I'm not bitter. ----- Have you stopped to consider why you're seeing these results? Do you feel that your perceptions are an accurate picture of the situation?

by edw519 14y ago

RobAley 14y ago

Have you ever stopped to consider why no one gives you a break? If so, what did you conclude? (This is a serious question, not a snipe).

kamaal 14y ago
Actually advertising yourself is a huge factor in things like these. Merit doesn't always count. Look at it this way, a manager is likely to promote a guy who for example... takes him out for lunch, looks after his interests at work and else where. Managers trust 'yes men'. So if you work hard but don't quite really act like their closest associates in the gang, you are done. Nerds with high self worth, who can actually be something by themselves by their work and sweat alone can't do all this. They always lose out like edw519 even if they have done 3x the work. Lose out might be the wrong word. Because though you lose out on the shorter run. On the longer run, the 'yes men' lose capability to do something on their own (Read:Retire on their middle management job). The hard working nerd, if he really sticks to his guns and doesn't give up will make it big someday.
- blablabla123 14y ago
  To say it bluntly, on average people with high EQ are more successful than people with high IQ. (There's a whole book about it.)
  - sjs382 14y ago
    What book? (Feel free to post an affiliate link!) Also, is this book something you'd recommend to someone who's just casually interested in the subject?
    - dmiladinov 14y ago
      I believe he was referring to Daniel Goleman's Emotional Intelligence[1]. Edit: Though it's been a while since I read it last, I remember finding it very informative and insightful. I don't think you need to be a psychologist or neuroscience expert to read it and benefit. [1]: http://www.amazon.com/Emotional-Intelligence-Matter-More-Than/dp/055338371X http://www.amazon.com/Emotional-Intelligence-Matter-More-Tha...
    - blablabla123 14y ago
      dmiladinov is right with the book. I bought it half a year ago, actually I also got pointed to it via some HN post. I only read a few dozen pages at the start and in the middle yet, but it is certainly interesting I think. IIRC the reviews on Amazon are very mixed though.
- jbooth 14y ago
  To put it a little less cynically (those who take care of their image at the office are not always 'yes men'), look at making sure that your accomplishments are recognized as part of your job. If you write a bunch of code but don't test it before shipping, it doesn't matter how hard you worked on it -- if it's got a ton of bugs, you can't really expect a pat on the back. Similarly, if you accomplish stuff for the company and nobody knows, what credit can you expect for it?

comatose_kid 14y ago

Hey edw519 If I left 10 companies because someone got promoted despite the fact that I did 3x the work, several questions would pop into my head: 1) Did the company value what I was working 3x as hard on? 2) Did the company know that I was working 3x as hard? Was I able to demonstrate a tangible result of this extra effort? 3) What could I do differently so that this doesn't happen again? What can I learn from the person who did get promoted? Why has this happened 10x? Someone else mentioned a study of EQ vs. IQ -> I agree - after a certain point, IQ isn't the determining factor, how you enhance the abilities of the team (and make other team members feel) is also very important.

jen_h 14y ago
It doesn't make any sense to promote someone who keeps their head down and does three times the work without squawking. As an employee moves up the chain, they spend more time in meetings/managing, less time doing, they get paid more to add less to the bottom line. Unless it becomes obvious to those above that the 3x worker will leave without some recognition/challenge, nothing happens. When they get it, the pattern I've seen is Year 1: "Okay, how many awards can we give you and keep you in your current role?" Year 2: "Ugh, okay, what raises can we give you to keep you in your current role?" Year 3: "Alright, alright; how much headcount do we now need to justify to replace you after we promote you? Three? Seriously? Holy cow, get the checkbook..." If a 3x-the-work person stews silently and just leaves in a huff without communicating what it is that they want from their chain of command, they miss on all that fun (and several rounds of salary bump).

Scriptor 14y ago

I'm also curious what "Most creative in class" means. It seems odd to say nobody ever gave you a break while simultaneously saying you were the "Most encouraged". While not exactly the same, surely people recognized his strengths then? > Rejected by every college but one. Which colleges did you apply to? Plenty of people with great grades and perfect SAT scores still end up rejected from top-tier colleges. > Taught myself to program and gave it away until someone hired me. So someone decided to hire a young person with only self-taught programming experience and (I'm assuming) no CS degree. Certainly sounds like someone gave you a break here.

Tycho 14y ago
Only if you ignore the "giving it away for free" part of that sentence.
ruswick 14y ago
I highly doubt that he had "perfect SAT scores." A 2400 with good grades is an effective guarantee at most state flagships (and most mid-range private schools for that matter.) He is either mischaracterizing his merits or didn't apply to realistic school choices.
- nostrademons 14y ago
  Most people with perfect SAT scores don't apply to state schools. That's why a perfect SAT score is an effective guarantee at getting into one. He also did say "but one", which makes me think he got into his safety.
- kosei 14y ago
  Most prestigious universities put a lot of weight on the essay and the interview as well. If his interactions in these two areas came off as cantankerous as he is coming off here, I'd understand letting in a guy with a 1580 over a guy with a 1600. (Based on the fact that he's had 10 jobs, I'm sure he was graded on the 1600 point scale, not out of 2400) And trust me, not every perfect SAT score is a guarantee of getting into Harvard, Princeton, Yale, MIT, Stanford, etc.

dkkkdkdk 14y ago

You remind me of me. And I am a bit bitter. Everyday I cry into to the sky and yell "fuck them, I will succeed not matter what". I will succeed no matter what, even if it kills me.

deleted 14y ago
[deleted]

bconway 14y ago

Ten time employee who quit every company because someone got promoted over me even though I did 3X the work. ... When friends & family saw how much money I made, they all wanted in on it until they saw the sacrifice I expected from them, then every one backed out. ... Rejected by prospective cofounders who didn't want to make the same sacrifices I have made. ... I thought it would be different in the tech world, but it's not. It's still a beauty contest based primarily of superficial subjective perceptions. People are still often too lazy or unable to dig below the surface to find the reality. ... Please don't misunderstand. I'm not bitter. ----- Have you stopped to consider why you're seeing these results? Do you feel that your perceptions are an accurate picture of the situation?