5 ms·

Because the United States won World War II, and because it outclassed every opponent it fought after World War II. Winning has a very bad effect on innovation.

Because the United States won World War II, and because it outclassed every opponent it fought after World War II. Winning has a very bad effect on innovation. In contrast, it's when you lose that the old doctrines get discredited and innovation has a chance to take hold. Patton was essentially describing the famous German system of Auftragstaktik (mission tactics), in which junior officers are given an objective and permitted the freedom to decide how to accomplish that objective. The Prussians developed mission tactics and the modern general staff because they were so shocked by their defeat at the hands of Napoleon. It took Napoleon just three weeks to march into Berlin, winning every battle along the way. Three weeks? Frederick the Great had held out for five years! Clearly, something was very wrong with the Prussian army -- so they figured it out and fixed it. In the late twentieth century, the Israelis have been the foremost practitioners of German-style mission tactics. And it's because they faced the same situation than the Germans faced, but worse -- surrounded by enemies, and outnumbered. They cannot win on numerical superiority, so they must win on the superiority of their military leadership.

eru 14y ago
> Clearly, something was very wrong with the Prussian army -- so they figured it out and fixed it. For more than a century the secret weapon of the Prussian (and then German) military was the General Staff. Whereas other powers started planning once war was declared, the Germans had plans for _everything_ in their drawers: Want to attack Austria tomorrow? Just tell me whether we can assume France and Russia are neutral or not, and the time of the year you want the campaign, and I tell you which drawer to get the plans from. The birth of the modern university system happened around the same time after Prussia's defeat at Napoleon's hands.
- derleth 14y ago
  > the Germans had plans for _everything_ in their drawers We (the US) learned to do the same thing, even to the extreme of War Plan Red, the plan to fight the UK and its colonies, beginning 1927 and updated through 1939. It broke down into sub-plans, one for the UK itself and one for each major colony, including War Plan Crimson, the plan to invade Canada. Did we imagine we'd have to actually fight the Brits? No, not really; we were just being prepared. http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/War_Plan_Red http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/War_Plan_Red
EliRivers 14y ago
"it outclassed every opponent it fought after World War II." Do you include the North Vietnamese Army in that?
- walshemj 14y ago
  Yes - the only time that the NVA and VC tried to take on the US in a straight up fight (Tet) they lost. they won the PR battle though.
  - EliRivers 14y ago
    You must have a different definition of "outclassed" to me. If you define it as "if we all stand up in a line and shoot at each other in some kind of suicidal "straight up fight", who does better?", then yes, I can see why you'd say that. I would say that the NVA categorically outclassed their opponents. On paper, they had all the disadvantages. Outgunned, outnumbered, less well-equipped (well, during the early days of the M16 rifle they were far better equipped since the the NVA had rifles that actually worked - just how "classy" is an army that gives its infantry rifles that don't work and then wastes time denying the problem?), the list goes on and on. "they won the PR battle though." And indeed, the actual battle to occupy the south.
    - walshemj 14y ago
      After the US pulled out though
      - EliRivers 14y ago
        There are two ways to win a war. Kill everyone on the other side, or make them want to stop enough to do what you want. The NVA wanted the US to leave, and to occupy the south. They got what they wanted. Of course after the US pulled out; that was what the NVA wanted. They certainly didn't look outclassed as they rolled into Saigon and took over.
    - walshemj 14y ago

eru 14y ago

> Clearly, something was very wrong with the Prussian army -- so they figured it out and fixed it. For more than a century the secret weapon of the Prussian (and then German) military was the General Staff. Whereas other powers started planning once war was declared, the Germans had plans for _everything_ in their drawers: Want to attack Austria tomorrow? Just tell me whether we can assume France and Russia are neutral or not, and the time of the year you want the campaign, and I tell you which drawer to get the plans from. The birth of the modern university system happened around the same time after Prussia's defeat at Napoleon's hands.

derleth 14y ago
> the Germans had plans for _everything_ in their drawers We (the US) learned to do the same thing, even to the extreme of War Plan Red, the plan to fight the UK and its colonies, beginning 1927 and updated through 1939. It broke down into sub-plans, one for the UK itself and one for each major colony, including War Plan Crimson, the plan to invade Canada. Did we imagine we'd have to actually fight the Brits? No, not really; we were just being prepared. http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/War_Plan_Red http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/War_Plan_Red

EliRivers 14y ago

"it outclassed every opponent it fought after World War II." Do you include the North Vietnamese Army in that?

walshemj 14y ago
Yes - the only time that the NVA and VC tried to take on the US in a straight up fight (Tet) they lost. they won the PR battle though.
- EliRivers 14y ago
  You must have a different definition of "outclassed" to me. If you define it as "if we all stand up in a line and shoot at each other in some kind of suicidal "straight up fight", who does better?", then yes, I can see why you'd say that. I would say that the NVA categorically outclassed their opponents. On paper, they had all the disadvantages. Outgunned, outnumbered, less well-equipped (well, during the early days of the M16 rifle they were far better equipped since the the NVA had rifles that actually worked - just how "classy" is an army that gives its infantry rifles that don't work and then wastes time denying the problem?), the list goes on and on. "they won the PR battle though." And indeed, the actual battle to occupy the south.
  - walshemj 14y ago
    After the US pulled out though
    - EliRivers 14y ago
      There are two ways to win a war. Kill everyone on the other side, or make them want to stop enough to do what you want. The NVA wanted the US to leave, and to occupy the south. They got what they wanted. Of course after the US pulled out; that was what the NVA wanted. They certainly didn't look outclassed as they rolled into Saigon and took over.
  - walshemj 14y ago