6 ms·

Perhaps I'm strange. I always seem to be going the opposite way to everyone else. I've fallen in love with Windows again. It just works. Power management rocks

by meaty 14y ago

Perhaps I'm strange. I always seem to be going the opposite way to everyone else. I've fallen in love with Windows again. It just works. Power management rocks, battery life is good (8 hours on my 2007 Lenovo T61!), the hardware is damn cheap, the licenses cost me virtually nothing, literally everything I plug into it works, the tooling is pretty damn good, utils I wrote for Windows NT4 literally 14 years ago still just work flawlessly. My Linux machine is just a VirtualBox VM. Yesterday I bought my second Windows Phone (Lumia 820). This also just works. Email is the same everywhere, all the apps just works, plays any mp3 without complaining (my sodding iPhone never did!), Nokia Drive just works, maps actually work (again something my iPhone shot down), talks to exchange without problems, is exactly the same as my old Windows Phone 7.8 device (no who moved my cheese), opens all my documents nicely, reads any pdf fine. Seriously, it's just all boringly functional and uneventful these days. Bear in mind I am coming from a background on hardcore UNIX machines (big Solaris, HP-UX machines), through FreeBSD to Linux to OS-X. The worst pain I had was with Solaris (on Tadpole SPARCbook) and just about everything Apple, particularly their unreliable hardware (4 Macs returned for repair!), app compatibility problems, piss poor battery life on iPhone 3/4, shit crock of a POSIX environment and shoddy attempt at online services.

xradionut 14y ago
"(no who moved my cheese)" Try migrating from Windows 7 to Windows 8. Whole wheels of cheese are moved around and the flavor has changed... :)
- meaty 14y ago
  Yes I know. I've tried Windows 8 and I don't like it, but thanks to the culture of support and choice, I'm not all that bothered as Windows 7 is good and supported for another 7 years (until 2020). Something (Windows Blue?) may come along and change things by then. I'll deal with it when I get there. I'm on a 2007 built Lenovo T61 which I can actually see lasting until 2020 as well the way it's going.
- neogodless 14y ago
  I keep hearing that. Fortunately I haven't experienced it. When I used Windows 7 and wanted to open a program, I tapped "Windows" and started typing the app name. That still works in 8. My only complaint is a "go back" problem, where opening something like a media file from the desktop opens a Metro/Modern app, and closing the app takes you to the Start Screen rather than back to your desktop. Otherwise, I spend my time on the dual screen desktop mode, using my programs, just like I did in 7. Only now with improved dual monitor support.
kstrauser 14y ago
> Yesterday I bought my second Windows Phone (Lumia 820). This also just works. I call shenanigans. > Email is the same everywhere, ...as with all mobile OSes. > all the apps just works, In contrast with iOS? I'm not buying it. "Apps just work" is Apple's selling point for their iDevices and that reputation wasn't just bought by their marketing department. > plays any mp3 without complaining (my sodding iPhone never did!), Pix or it didn't happen. What MP3s was your iPhone - with it's iPod internals - unable to play? > Nokia Drive just works, iCloud, Dropbox, and SkyDrive are available on iOS. Nokia Drive is better than all of those? > maps actually work (again something my iPhone shot down), iOS has Apple and Google native maps apps. What specifically is better about Windows maps than either of those? > talks to exchange without problems, ...just like iOS, which licenses ActiveSync from Microsoft. > is exactly the same as my old Windows Phone 7.8 device (no who moved my cheese), Can't argue that. > opens all my documents nicely, reads any pdf fine. ...just like iOS. I'll be honest: I'm having a hard time buying most of those examples as they run contrary to my own (and anecdotally, most others') experiences.
- meaty 14y ago
  No - email on iOS is a piece of shit. It regularly drops connections to exchange, mail bombs people when sending a message and IMAP is unreliable as hell as well. Not only that, it starts to lag unbearably after a few days (up to iOS 6). I send and receive a LOT of email - it just can't handle it well. Yes in contrast of iOS. That reputation is bullshit. Regular crashes of Mail, Safari as in multiple times daily. I've had the device freeze at least 2-3 times a week as well. In the year I've been using Windows Phone, IE mobile has crashed twice and the device hasn't failed once (Lumia 710). Won't play mp3s - this is rife. The ID3 parser on iOS devices is a piece of shit: http://www.google.com/#q=iphone+wont+play+mp3s http://www.google.com/#q=iphone+wont+play+mp3s This has been known for literally YEARS and plagues all apple devices from iPod, to touch to iPhone to Mac. Nokia Drive - do you even know what this is? It's not a Skydrive/DropBox clone. It's a fully blown 100% FREE offline turn by turn satellite navigation and mapping platform akin to your average satnav. It's pretty amazing and is a deal breaker for iOS: http://vr-zone.com/articles/nokia-lumia-smartphones-get-maps-and-drive-updates/15305.html http://vr-zone.com/articles/nokia-lumia-smartphones-get-maps... Regarding Apple and Google native maps, see above again. iOS's ActiveSync is a piece of shit. It doesn't work properly, duplicates my emails, mailbombs people etc. Now whoever's fault this is I don't know (it may be Microsoft?) but I'm not concerned about this - it just doesn't work properly.
kwanbis 14y ago
8 hours from a a T61? Never got that much time with one, not even the first days.
revscat 14y ago
> I've fallen in love with Windows again. It just works. You and I have had vastly different experiences. I have spent the morning trying to get Rails installed on a Win7 box. This has required numerous painful hoops to jump through, and I am actually not even finished. I finally got 1.9.3 installed, but am hung on some OpenSSL requirement. It has been a massive, huge waste of my day. The default command shell sucks rocks, so I'm using (or attempting to use) cygwin, specifically zsh. I have no access to tmux, and while screen works it is not my preferred multiplexer. Even under zsh, though, the typical Ruby commands (ruby/irb/gem/etc.) have to be run with their .bat equivalents, which is a needless pain. The latest issue is with something related to OpenSSL, and I'm still digging through that one. These are all issues that have been specific to Windows. I ran this exact same code with zero problems on my home OS X box not 4 hours ago. git pull/bundle/rails server, good to go. On Windows this has taken the better part of a day to get going. You sound like an astroturfer, honestly. "I'm honest, I use other systems. It's just that they all are just awful compared to Windows. Here are generic reasons why, with few specifics." > shit crock of a POSIX environment What does this even mean? OS X is POSIX certified. Windows is not. Are you saying POSIX is crap, or that OS X's implementation of it is? Either way I would challenge you to back up that statement up. OS X is the best Unix I have personally had experience using.
- blibble 14y ago
  believe it or not Windows has actually had a POSIX subsystem since the NT days, and MS still provide it for Windows 8. I'm not sure what POSIX certified means, but Windows is UNIX in the same way Mac OS X is...
  - radio4fan 14y ago
    Wikipedia has this (and more) to say on POSIX: Not to be confused with Unix, Unix-like, or Linux. POSIX (pron.: /ˈpɒzɪks/ poz-iks), an acronym for "Portable Operating System Interface", is a family of standards specified by the IEEE for maintaining compatibility between operating systems... http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Posix http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Posix The old MS POSIX subsystem was replaced by the amusingly named SFU (Services for UNIX). Then that got replaced by the bought-in Interix. Mac OS X is UNIX because it's certified under the Single UNIX Specification: http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Single_UNIX_Specification http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Single_UNIX_Specification Windows is not in any way UNIX. There aren't even any certified Linux distros (AFAIK). Mac OS X is UNIX.
calinet6 14y ago
"it's just all boringly functional and uneventful these days." As it should be—they've had time to work on the issues and should be competitive by now. OSX, meanwhile, is still Unix under the hood. I'm frankly stunned that someone coming from a straight FreeBSD background wouldn't value that highly. But your experiences with hardware, while I'm sure legitimate, do not mirror my own. I've owned two MacBook Pros (starting with the first Unibody model) for the last 6 years and both have been rock solid daily drivers, and "functional and uneventful," but also very nice to use—not really boring. To each their own, is the moral of all these stories. If Windows is gaining stability and OSX continues to be high quality, it just gives everyone more options and lowers the barrier-to-entry of computing. Twenty years ago you had to invest in your desktop and build it yourself, and laptops were rare. Ten years ago only nerds knew how to maintain Windows. Now you carry an always-connected computer in your pocket and a 4.9 pound supercomputer on your back. No part of this is bad.
- meaty 14y ago
  As it should be—they've had time to work on the issues and should be competitive by now. Yes this is it. But I wasn't getting that with OSX. In '06, it was pretty good compared to say Windows XP but since '08 it's been declining rapidly into whack-a-mole problems. OSX is a bastardised version of UNIX under the hood which is "even worse than HP-UX when you haven't paid for the compilers" to deal with I found. Getting a reliable toolchain up that worked properly was a PITA.
  - cgh 14y ago
    You click a button marked "Install" in XCode and it installs the tools into /usr/bin. That sure is tough. OS X userland is pretty stock BSD. It may be unfamiliar if you are used to Linux.
    - eropple 14y ago
      Putting the GNU tools on is pretty easy with Homebrew or MacPorts, though. Getting those is first thing I do when I set up a new Mac: grab Xcode, install the command line tools, get Homebrew, brew install coreutils, findutils, and gnu-sed.
monochromatic 14y ago
I recently switched back from Mac to Windows. I was using Windows 7 on my work computer, and I found myself being more productive and enjoying it more than my home Mac. Windows 7 really is quite good, and I don't much care for the directions Mac OS X is heading.

by meaty 14y ago

xradionut 14y ago

"(no who moved my cheese)" Try migrating from Windows 7 to Windows 8. Whole wheels of cheese are moved around and the flavor has changed... :)

meaty 14y ago
Yes I know. I've tried Windows 8 and I don't like it, but thanks to the culture of support and choice, I'm not all that bothered as Windows 7 is good and supported for another 7 years (until 2020). Something (Windows Blue?) may come along and change things by then. I'll deal with it when I get there. I'm on a 2007 built Lenovo T61 which I can actually see lasting until 2020 as well the way it's going.
neogodless 14y ago
I keep hearing that. Fortunately I haven't experienced it. When I used Windows 7 and wanted to open a program, I tapped "Windows" and started typing the app name. That still works in 8. My only complaint is a "go back" problem, where opening something like a media file from the desktop opens a Metro/Modern app, and closing the app takes you to the Start Screen rather than back to your desktop. Otherwise, I spend my time on the dual screen desktop mode, using my programs, just like I did in 7. Only now with improved dual monitor support.

kstrauser 14y ago

> Yesterday I bought my second Windows Phone (Lumia 820). This also just works. I call shenanigans. > Email is the same everywhere, ...as with all mobile OSes. > all the apps just works, In contrast with iOS? I'm not buying it. "Apps just work" is Apple's selling point for their iDevices and that reputation wasn't just bought by their marketing department. > plays any mp3 without complaining (my sodding iPhone never did!), Pix or it didn't happen. What MP3s was your iPhone - with it's iPod internals - unable to play? > Nokia Drive just works, iCloud, Dropbox, and SkyDrive are available on iOS. Nokia Drive is better than all of those? > maps actually work (again something my iPhone shot down), iOS has Apple and Google native maps apps. What specifically is better about Windows maps than either of those? > talks to exchange without problems, ...just like iOS, which licenses ActiveSync from Microsoft. > is exactly the same as my old Windows Phone 7.8 device (no who moved my cheese), Can't argue that. > opens all my documents nicely, reads any pdf fine. ...just like iOS. I'll be honest: I'm having a hard time buying most of those examples as they run contrary to my own (and anecdotally, most others') experiences.

meaty 14y ago
No - email on iOS is a piece of shit. It regularly drops connections to exchange, mail bombs people when sending a message and IMAP is unreliable as hell as well. Not only that, it starts to lag unbearably after a few days (up to iOS 6). I send and receive a LOT of email - it just can't handle it well. Yes in contrast of iOS. That reputation is bullshit. Regular crashes of Mail, Safari as in multiple times daily. I've had the device freeze at least 2-3 times a week as well. In the year I've been using Windows Phone, IE mobile has crashed twice and the device hasn't failed once (Lumia 710). Won't play mp3s - this is rife. The ID3 parser on iOS devices is a piece of shit: http://www.google.com/#q=iphone+wont+play+mp3s http://www.google.com/#q=iphone+wont+play+mp3s This has been known for literally YEARS and plagues all apple devices from iPod, to touch to iPhone to Mac. Nokia Drive - do you even know what this is? It's not a Skydrive/DropBox clone. It's a fully blown 100% FREE offline turn by turn satellite navigation and mapping platform akin to your average satnav. It's pretty amazing and is a deal breaker for iOS: http://vr-zone.com/articles/nokia-lumia-smartphones-get-maps-and-drive-updates/15305.html http://vr-zone.com/articles/nokia-lumia-smartphones-get-maps... Regarding Apple and Google native maps, see above again. iOS's ActiveSync is a piece of shit. It doesn't work properly, duplicates my emails, mailbombs people etc. Now whoever's fault this is I don't know (it may be Microsoft?) but I'm not concerned about this - it just doesn't work properly.

kwanbis 14y ago

8 hours from a a T61? Never got that much time with one, not even the first days.

revscat 14y ago

> I've fallen in love with Windows again. It just works. You and I have had vastly different experiences. I have spent the morning trying to get Rails installed on a Win7 box. This has required numerous painful hoops to jump through, and I am actually not even finished. I finally got 1.9.3 installed, but am hung on some OpenSSL requirement. It has been a massive, huge waste of my day. The default command shell sucks rocks, so I'm using (or attempting to use) cygwin, specifically zsh. I have no access to tmux, and while screen works it is not my preferred multiplexer. Even under zsh, though, the typical Ruby commands (ruby/irb/gem/etc.) have to be run with their .bat equivalents, which is a needless pain. The latest issue is with something related to OpenSSL, and I'm still digging through that one. These are all issues that have been specific to Windows. I ran this exact same code with zero problems on my home OS X box not 4 hours ago. git pull/bundle/rails server, good to go. On Windows this has taken the better part of a day to get going. You sound like an astroturfer, honestly. "I'm honest, I use other systems. It's just that they all are just awful compared to Windows. Here are generic reasons why, with few specifics." > shit crock of a POSIX environment What does this even mean? OS X is POSIX certified. Windows is not. Are you saying POSIX is crap, or that OS X's implementation of it is? Either way I would challenge you to back up that statement up. OS X is the best Unix I have personally had experience using.

blibble 14y ago
believe it or not Windows has actually had a POSIX subsystem since the NT days, and MS still provide it for Windows 8. I'm not sure what POSIX certified means, but Windows is UNIX in the same way Mac OS X is...
- radio4fan 14y ago
  Wikipedia has this (and more) to say on POSIX: Not to be confused with Unix, Unix-like, or Linux. POSIX (pron.: /ˈpɒzɪks/ poz-iks), an acronym for "Portable Operating System Interface", is a family of standards specified by the IEEE for maintaining compatibility between operating systems... http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Posix http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Posix The old MS POSIX subsystem was replaced by the amusingly named SFU (Services for UNIX). Then that got replaced by the bought-in Interix. Mac OS X is UNIX because it's certified under the Single UNIX Specification: http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Single_UNIX_Specification http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Single_UNIX_Specification Windows is not in any way UNIX. There aren't even any certified Linux distros (AFAIK). Mac OS X is UNIX.

calinet6 14y ago

"it's just all boringly functional and uneventful these days." As it should be—they've had time to work on the issues and should be competitive by now. OSX, meanwhile, is still Unix under the hood. I'm frankly stunned that someone coming from a straight FreeBSD background wouldn't value that highly. But your experiences with hardware, while I'm sure legitimate, do not mirror my own. I've owned two MacBook Pros (starting with the first Unibody model) for the last 6 years and both have been rock solid daily drivers, and "functional and uneventful," but also very nice to use—not really boring. To each their own, is the moral of all these stories. If Windows is gaining stability and OSX continues to be high quality, it just gives everyone more options and lowers the barrier-to-entry of computing. Twenty years ago you had to invest in your desktop and build it yourself, and laptops were rare. Ten years ago only nerds knew how to maintain Windows. Now you carry an always-connected computer in your pocket and a 4.9 pound supercomputer on your back. No part of this is bad.

meaty 14y ago
As it should be—they've had time to work on the issues and should be competitive by now. Yes this is it. But I wasn't getting that with OSX. In '06, it was pretty good compared to say Windows XP but since '08 it's been declining rapidly into whack-a-mole problems. OSX is a bastardised version of UNIX under the hood which is "even worse than HP-UX when you haven't paid for the compilers" to deal with I found. Getting a reliable toolchain up that worked properly was a PITA.
- cgh 14y ago
  You click a button marked "Install" in XCode and it installs the tools into /usr/bin. That sure is tough. OS X userland is pretty stock BSD. It may be unfamiliar if you are used to Linux.
  - eropple 14y ago
    Putting the GNU tools on is pretty easy with Homebrew or MacPorts, though. Getting those is first thing I do when I set up a new Mac: grab Xcode, install the command line tools, get Homebrew, brew install coreutils, findutils, and gnu-sed.

monochromatic 14y ago

I recently switched back from Mac to Windows. I was using Windows 7 on my work computer, and I found myself being more productive and enjoying it more than my home Mac. Windows 7 really is quite good, and I don't much care for the directions Mac OS X is heading.