14 ms·

Hey guys, petition starter here. Just wanted to thank anyone who signed for their support. I just got off the phone with the White House and they're really enth

by sinak 14y ago

Hey guys, petition starter here. Just wanted to thank anyone who signed for their support. I just got off the phone with the White House and they're really enthusiastic about getting this fixed. We also discussed fixing Section 1201 of the DMCA permanently, and they've agreed to continue the conversation on that. When I originally posted this to HN at http://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=5112020 http://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=5112020 there were a lot of very skeptical responses to the effect of "petitions don't have any effect". The optimist in me is glad they were wrong. The White House seem to be genuinely committed to helping push through a piece of legislation to fix this. If there's something about government that bugs you, it's worth trying to do something about it. Also, we're launching a campaign to ask Congress to change Section 1201 of the DMCA, with backing from the EFF, Reddit and others. Sign up at http://fixthedmca.org http://fixthedmca.org - should be launching the site tomorrow.

sneak 14y ago
I hate to break it to you, but their response was effectively: "we agree with you but we respect the process that brought us to this fucked-up state and look forward to continuing to work with congress". Petitions don't have any effect other than getting a response that's designed to get you to stop complaining from a false sense of achievement. In that sense, they work perfectly.
- niggler 14y ago
  If they (the White House) can point to the guilty parties here (congressmen, senators, lobby groups) or even point to relevant bills or decisions, it will help us in terms of knowing which politicians we should not vote for. Remember: vote with your wallet/ballot. Outrage works when it is concentrated and directed at the right people.
  - sneak 14y ago
    I did vote with my wallet: I voted for a different government, by taking my productive energies and contributions to the GDP to another nation, because it's clear to anyone paying attention that the triad of the two parties and the media have reached some sort of perverse Nash Equilibrium in the US. Resultantly, nothing that you put on a ballot is going to reverse the direction at this point. There's only voting with your tax dollars.
  - Zak 14y ago
    I'm pretty sure who voted for the DMCA and/or specific anticircumvention provisions is a matter of public record. We don't need any help from the president to identify those legislators and vote for their opponents.
- phreeza 14y ago
  Sad but true. Is the White House, ie the executive, the right entity to petition in this matter, which seems to be legislative? In Germany we have a mechanism to bring stuff in front of [a committee of] our parliament, is there anything like that in the US?
  - mpyne 14y ago
    As far as I know the only way to do so is by lobbying one of your Congressional representatives (or one of the Congression representatives on the subcommittee in question to introduce the question for you).
- Cushman 14y ago
  If he just got off the phone with the White House, I'd imagine he has a pretty good idea of what their response was. Your cynicism is a big part of the reason it's so hard to change things around here.
  - sneak 14y ago
    No it's not. I emigrated from the US after it became clear they weren't going to reinstate the rule of law. Your military-industrial complex is the reason that it's so hard to change things around... there. This is why you have bullshit laws like the DMCA in the first place.
    - jvrossb 14y ago
      Where did you emigrate to?
      - ynniv 14y ago
        Neukölln, Berlin, Germany [https://twitter.com/sneakatdatavibe https://twitter.com/sneakatdatavibe]
        antimatter 14y ago
        I'd be interested in reading about your experience doing this. I've been considering leaving the US as well lately.
        cgio 14y ago
        I hope you do not get too dizzy by the swings on the cradle of democracy and peace that you moved to. How would someone compare democracy in the States with that in Germany is beyond me. People tend to forget very easily.
        socialist_coder 14y ago
        Same here. Berlin is absolutely awesome. My wife and I came back to the US this winter to visit with family so they could meet our new baby. The longer I'm back in the US though, the more I miss Berlin. If anyone is in the video game industry and wants to try and move to Berlin, this is a pretty good company who is hiring right now: http://www.yager.de/career/ http://www.yager.de/career/ The way I immigrated was by having a baby with a German. That allowed me to get a work permit / permanent resident status without any hassle at all.
- jbooth 14y ago
  Well, if you're looking to feel superior to the rubes, a little tried-and-tested "they're all the same" cynicism will really do it for you. Petitions raise visibility and they require organization to get the signatures. Organizing to get the signatures once means you build the mailing lists etc to organize for other things later. I mean, when they instituted this petition thing in 2009 do you think they were really thinking "We need some kind of 1984 mind control device here after that presidential campaign"? As far as the actual content -- read the word 'respect' in the diplomatic context there and it's pretty clear that they'd love to get rid of this, but don't have the legal authority to just up and do it.
- brown9-2 14y ago
  What outcome would you have been happier with? The executive branch cannot pass legislation.
  - iy56 14y ago
    Refuse to enforce this clause of the DMCA and pardon anyone imprisoned because of it.
    - dyno12345 14y ago
      Has this actually been enforced against anyone so far?
      - AnthonyMouse 14y ago
        Whether it actually gets enforced doesn't matter, what matters whether people refrain from engaging in the activity (or aiding others in doing so) because of the risk that it could be.
        dyno12345 14y ago
        There's always that risk with unenforced laws - there's hardly ever (ever?) a stated policy of non-enforcement, since the executive is also technically obliged to enforce everything congress has told it to. I would generally be interested to know if it ever has actually been enforced so far.
        AnthonyMouse 14y ago
        https://www.eff.org/wp/unintended-consequences-under-dmca https://www.eff.org/wp/unintended-consequences-under-dmca
        dyno12345 14y ago
        Those are civil suits - not criminal enforcement that the administration could choose to pursue or not
- tzisc 14y ago
  Well, I'd argue that cynical responses like these are the most detrimental response of all. Pessimism is not realism. Getting the full verbal support of a second-term lame-duck administration with nothing to lose is not a negligible achievement. Some progress != no progress. You're right that petitions have limited scope and effect, but in successful efforts like these, they can generate publicity and political momentum, giving ammunition and gravitas to Congressmen who would co-sponsor legislation. At the very least it is a step in the right direction. The system is broken, but sitting back and needlessly berating those who would try to take small steps to achieve small goals is hardly an acceptable response. It's calculus; if you integrate a positive attitude over a large enough population of believers, you can effect large-scale change. If you integrate so-called "cynical realism" over the same intelligent population, you create a self-fulfilling prophecy of defeatism which is nothing to pat yourself on the back about, either. I applaud sinak's achievement and I hope that this conversation shifts to what steps need to be taken next.
  - doktrin 14y ago
    >second-term lame-duck administration The term "lame duck" typically refers to Presidents at the tail end of their term, most often used in the time between an election and a transition of power. That isn't the case here.
    - tzisc 14y ago
      Right. I was just trying to refer more specifically to the fact that since the term-limit is already reached, this administration has more political flexibility to back more contentious issues. From wikipedia: A president elected to a second term is sometimes seen as being a lame duck from early in the second term, because presidents are barred from contesting a term four years later, and is thus freer to take politically unpopular action. Nonetheless, as the de facto leader of his or her political party, the president's actions affect how the party performs in the midterm elections two years into the second term, and, to some extent, the success of that party's nominee in the next presidential election four years in the future. But you are certainly correct about typical usage.
  - deleted 14y ago
- mmanfrin 14y ago
  Just last week they mandated publicly-funded research should be publicly available within a year -- thanks to a petition. Quit being such a damn naysaying cynic.
- mikeash 14y ago
  What else are they going to say? "We will issue an illegal decree making it legal to unlock cell phones again?"
- dbecker 14y ago
  I spent about 15 seconds clicking on a petition, and the guy who started the petition was able to use that to start a dialogue? If anything, it's remarkable how effective that was. What sort of change did you expect with so little effort? If you've ever done business development, you'd know that opening that dialog is frequently the hardest step. Meaningful changes are carefully considered, and they don't happen overnight. This is a good first step.
  - larrys 14y ago
    "you'd know that opening that dialog is frequently the hardest step." How true and essentially the value of "connections" I would add. They get the person (you are "selling" to) to at least listen to what you have to say and consider it and to typically be taken more seriously.
- larrys 14y ago
  "getting a response that's designed to get you to stop complaining from a false sense of achievement" I'm also sure they bend over backward to find a reason to agree with something just so they can say they are agreeing with some petitions and get points for it in news stories instead of giving a negative response. Politicians do this as well. If you visit your local congressman he will be glad many times and enthusiastic about supporting your special interests. How much he goes to bat for you depends of course on the issue and who you are. At least he can wave a finger and say "I tried but the others wouldn't vote for it". Much better than telling you up front your issue will never get voted into law.
- deleted 14y ago
  [deleted]
cleis 14y ago
The people's champion
thinklarge 14y ago
Wow this is an awesome step and please keep us appraised of how things are going or if more help is needed. It is this kind of optimism that demands changes from the government. Sometimes it takes the people speaking up about an issue for the government to get a sense of what the people want. Now for anyone else tho is on here call your congressmen and senators! They really do care what you think and about the public opinion even above what lobbyists have to say.
akarpenko 14y ago
Nice petition, but it didn't go far enough. Why should locking phones be legal at all?
- fijal 14y ago
  In a strange twist, it's illegal in South Africa
- TylerE 14y ago
  Why should it be illegal? We really, really, really don't want government interference in voluntary private contracts.
  - akarpenko 14y ago
    Are you saying that there is usually no government interference in private contracts? Or that there should be no government interference just when the consumers rights are being violated?
    - TylerE 14y ago
      Largely, yes, and that is as it should be. It's an agreement between two willing parties with benefit received by both sides. A simple, legal, contract. We're not talking about a legislated monopoly here, like your local power company. No one is FORCING you to go down to your local Verizon reseller and buy a contract phone. You're free to either buy an unlocked smartphone (at full un-subsidized price), or a prepaid phone, or any other of a multitude of options.
      - lysium 14y ago
        I'm with you that you could by a non-subsidized phone. However, one of the points of the petition is that unlocking is currently illegal _even after the original contract has expired_. Why should that be allowed? The original contract is over, after all. No party should have any rights beyond the contract they've agree upon.
moxie 14y ago
If you have some information from the phone call that wasn't in the official response, then it's probably worth sharing it here. Otherwise, the official statement seems to absolutely confirm the doubts of the original skeptical responses.
- dhimes 14y ago
  This is as good of a response as you can expect. This is a win. If you expected anything else (sneak, I'm looking at you here too) then you've never received a response from the White House on an issue on which they truly disagree. That letter would have said something like "While we respect your opinion, we believe that the current law best satisfies the needs of blah blah blah." Here, they are saying: yeah. We agree with you. We don't write the damn laws- but here is what we're willing to sign. Our job is to get our Senators and Representatives to change the law. It may not be pretty, and it's certainly not efficient, but this is democracy in action. It requires effort from its citizens in order to work. Not running away. EDIT: I forgot to add, that I did receive a 'blow it out your ass' response from President Clinton many years ago. He later reversed his stance on the issue, but it was too late for him to affect it and just left it as a recommendation to the next pres- who ignored it.
  - deleted 14y ago
    [deleted]
  - moxie 14y ago
    Based on what you're describing, I think you're going to have a tough sell for the merits of this process if the "win" case and the "lose" case have identical outcomes, but differ only in the language that is used.
    - leetrout 14y ago
      I think everyone has their expectations set too high for A. what a petition will really achieve and B. that the executive branch has any position to change laws. The parent to your comment seems to sum this up pretty well. So while I see your point that many may view this as ineffective and therefore a loss I definitely consider it a win in agreement with the parent. 1. Petition was made 2. Signature goal was met 3. WH responded favorably in agreement with petition supporters. 4. ... 5. Profit! ;)
unreal37 14y ago
Sinak, good job on raising the issue, and getting the White House, the Library of Congress and the FCC to all respond. This is a win for democracy. You must feel great today. For those getting all worked up about how it is still illegal to unlock cell phones, think of it like this. The DMCA makes it illegal to circumvent/crack software security - period. You phone is locked by software. Up til January, there was an exemption for phones. Now there's not. The problem isn't "unlocking phones". The problem is "you can't alter something expensive you've bought and paid for in full". In a way this is good. Regular people will get pissed at the carrier for not unlocking their phone at the end of their contract. And suddenly regular people will see how bad the DMCA is. The DMA targets not just Movie Pirates.
mistercow 14y ago
Petitions do absolutely work, but not how you think. They aren't for convincing the people they're directed at. They're for mobilizing the people who signed them and deepening their commitment to the cause. Signing your name to a statement has an effect on your self perception which causes you to act in a way that is consistent with the statement. Signing a petition to the White House and having the White House respond "we agree with you" does not mean that you convinced them. It means they agree with you.
mtgx 14y ago
Is it me or are they saying they support unlocking "as long as it's out of contract" or something? That doesn't really move the needle, does it?
Legion 14y ago
> "I just got off the phone with the White House" How badass did you feel writing that? I feel badass for you. Good job. Well done.
- sinak 14y ago
  Hah. Quite badass! Next up I'm going to get an unlocking tattoo.
teeja 14y ago
Congratulations for demonstrating once again that it's worth trying to do something about it. It's the only alternative to taking it in the neck over and over whilst crying in bitter beer.
BHSPitMonkey 14y ago
Just a heads up: The current headline on that site says "forom the White House" instead of "from the White House". I wouldn't have said anything, but it's a headline...
ck2 14y ago
You realize the moment President Obama expresses support for this, it will die in congress or be filibustered to death? It's also highly suspect of this administration actually supporting this - HIGHLY suspect. It goes against many things they've done to try to force more commerce and money exchanging hands.

by sinak 14y ago

sneak 14y ago

I hate to break it to you, but their response was effectively: "we agree with you but we respect the process that brought us to this fucked-up state and look forward to continuing to work with congress". Petitions don't have any effect other than getting a response that's designed to get you to stop complaining from a false sense of achievement. In that sense, they work perfectly.

niggler 14y ago
If they (the White House) can point to the guilty parties here (congressmen, senators, lobby groups) or even point to relevant bills or decisions, it will help us in terms of knowing which politicians we should not vote for. Remember: vote with your wallet/ballot. Outrage works when it is concentrated and directed at the right people.
- sneak 14y ago
  I did vote with my wallet: I voted for a different government, by taking my productive energies and contributions to the GDP to another nation, because it's clear to anyone paying attention that the triad of the two parties and the media have reached some sort of perverse Nash Equilibrium in the US. Resultantly, nothing that you put on a ballot is going to reverse the direction at this point. There's only voting with your tax dollars.
- Zak 14y ago
  I'm pretty sure who voted for the DMCA and/or specific anticircumvention provisions is a matter of public record. We don't need any help from the president to identify those legislators and vote for their opponents.
phreeza 14y ago
Sad but true. Is the White House, ie the executive, the right entity to petition in this matter, which seems to be legislative? In Germany we have a mechanism to bring stuff in front of [a committee of] our parliament, is there anything like that in the US?
- mpyne 14y ago
  As far as I know the only way to do so is by lobbying one of your Congressional representatives (or one of the Congression representatives on the subcommittee in question to introduce the question for you).
Cushman 14y ago
If he just got off the phone with the White House, I'd imagine he has a pretty good idea of what their response was. Your cynicism is a big part of the reason it's so hard to change things around here.
- sneak 14y ago
  No it's not. I emigrated from the US after it became clear they weren't going to reinstate the rule of law. Your military-industrial complex is the reason that it's so hard to change things around... there. This is why you have bullshit laws like the DMCA in the first place.
  - jvrossb 14y ago
    Where did you emigrate to?
    - ynniv 14y ago
      Neukölln, Berlin, Germany [https://twitter.com/sneakatdatavibe https://twitter.com/sneakatdatavibe]
      - antimatter 14y ago
        I'd be interested in reading about your experience doing this. I've been considering leaving the US as well lately.
      - cgio 14y ago
        I hope you do not get too dizzy by the swings on the cradle of democracy and peace that you moved to. How would someone compare democracy in the States with that in Germany is beyond me. People tend to forget very easily.
      - socialist_coder 14y ago
        Same here. Berlin is absolutely awesome. My wife and I came back to the US this winter to visit with family so they could meet our new baby. The longer I'm back in the US though, the more I miss Berlin. If anyone is in the video game industry and wants to try and move to Berlin, this is a pretty good company who is hiring right now: http://www.yager.de/career/ http://www.yager.de/career/ The way I immigrated was by having a baby with a German. That allowed me to get a work permit / permanent resident status without any hassle at all.
jbooth 14y ago
Well, if you're looking to feel superior to the rubes, a little tried-and-tested "they're all the same" cynicism will really do it for you. Petitions raise visibility and they require organization to get the signatures. Organizing to get the signatures once means you build the mailing lists etc to organize for other things later. I mean, when they instituted this petition thing in 2009 do you think they were really thinking "We need some kind of 1984 mind control device here after that presidential campaign"? As far as the actual content -- read the word 'respect' in the diplomatic context there and it's pretty clear that they'd love to get rid of this, but don't have the legal authority to just up and do it.
brown9-2 14y ago
What outcome would you have been happier with? The executive branch cannot pass legislation.
- iy56 14y ago
  Refuse to enforce this clause of the DMCA and pardon anyone imprisoned because of it.
  - dyno12345 14y ago
    Has this actually been enforced against anyone so far?
    - AnthonyMouse 14y ago
      Whether it actually gets enforced doesn't matter, what matters whether people refrain from engaging in the activity (or aiding others in doing so) because of the risk that it could be.
      - dyno12345 14y ago
        There's always that risk with unenforced laws - there's hardly ever (ever?) a stated policy of non-enforcement, since the executive is also technically obliged to enforce everything congress has told it to. I would generally be interested to know if it ever has actually been enforced so far.
        AnthonyMouse 14y ago
        https://www.eff.org/wp/unintended-consequences-under-dmca https://www.eff.org/wp/unintended-consequences-under-dmca
        dyno12345 14y ago
        Those are civil suits - not criminal enforcement that the administration could choose to pursue or not
tzisc 14y ago
Well, I'd argue that cynical responses like these are the most detrimental response of all. Pessimism is not realism. Getting the full verbal support of a second-term lame-duck administration with nothing to lose is not a negligible achievement. Some progress != no progress. You're right that petitions have limited scope and effect, but in successful efforts like these, they can generate publicity and political momentum, giving ammunition and gravitas to Congressmen who would co-sponsor legislation. At the very least it is a step in the right direction. The system is broken, but sitting back and needlessly berating those who would try to take small steps to achieve small goals is hardly an acceptable response. It's calculus; if you integrate a positive attitude over a large enough population of believers, you can effect large-scale change. If you integrate so-called "cynical realism" over the same intelligent population, you create a self-fulfilling prophecy of defeatism which is nothing to pat yourself on the back about, either. I applaud sinak's achievement and I hope that this conversation shifts to what steps need to be taken next.
- doktrin 14y ago
  >second-term lame-duck administration The term "lame duck" typically refers to Presidents at the tail end of their term, most often used in the time between an election and a transition of power. That isn't the case here.
  - tzisc 14y ago
    Right. I was just trying to refer more specifically to the fact that since the term-limit is already reached, this administration has more political flexibility to back more contentious issues. From wikipedia: A president elected to a second term is sometimes seen as being a lame duck from early in the second term, because presidents are barred from contesting a term four years later, and is thus freer to take politically unpopular action. Nonetheless, as the de facto leader of his or her political party, the president's actions affect how the party performs in the midterm elections two years into the second term, and, to some extent, the success of that party's nominee in the next presidential election four years in the future. But you are certainly correct about typical usage.
- deleted 14y ago
mmanfrin 14y ago
Just last week they mandated publicly-funded research should be publicly available within a year -- thanks to a petition. Quit being such a damn naysaying cynic.
mikeash 14y ago
What else are they going to say? "We will issue an illegal decree making it legal to unlock cell phones again?"
dbecker 14y ago
I spent about 15 seconds clicking on a petition, and the guy who started the petition was able to use that to start a dialogue? If anything, it's remarkable how effective that was. What sort of change did you expect with so little effort? If you've ever done business development, you'd know that opening that dialog is frequently the hardest step. Meaningful changes are carefully considered, and they don't happen overnight. This is a good first step.
- larrys 14y ago
  "you'd know that opening that dialog is frequently the hardest step." How true and essentially the value of "connections" I would add. They get the person (you are "selling" to) to at least listen to what you have to say and consider it and to typically be taken more seriously.
larrys 14y ago
"getting a response that's designed to get you to stop complaining from a false sense of achievement" I'm also sure they bend over backward to find a reason to agree with something just so they can say they are agreeing with some petitions and get points for it in news stories instead of giving a negative response. Politicians do this as well. If you visit your local congressman he will be glad many times and enthusiastic about supporting your special interests. How much he goes to bat for you depends of course on the issue and who you are. At least he can wave a finger and say "I tried but the others wouldn't vote for it". Much better than telling you up front your issue will never get voted into law.
deleted 14y ago
[deleted]

cleis 14y ago

The people's champion

thinklarge 14y ago

Wow this is an awesome step and please keep us appraised of how things are going or if more help is needed. It is this kind of optimism that demands changes from the government. Sometimes it takes the people speaking up about an issue for the government to get a sense of what the people want. Now for anyone else tho is on here call your congressmen and senators! They really do care what you think and about the public opinion even above what lobbyists have to say.

akarpenko 14y ago

Nice petition, but it didn't go far enough. Why should locking phones be legal at all?

fijal 14y ago
In a strange twist, it's illegal in South Africa
TylerE 14y ago
Why should it be illegal? We really, really, really don't want government interference in voluntary private contracts.
- akarpenko 14y ago
  Are you saying that there is usually no government interference in private contracts? Or that there should be no government interference just when the consumers rights are being violated?
  - TylerE 14y ago
    Largely, yes, and that is as it should be. It's an agreement between two willing parties with benefit received by both sides. A simple, legal, contract. We're not talking about a legislated monopoly here, like your local power company. No one is FORCING you to go down to your local Verizon reseller and buy a contract phone. You're free to either buy an unlocked smartphone (at full un-subsidized price), or a prepaid phone, or any other of a multitude of options.
    - lysium 14y ago
      I'm with you that you could by a non-subsidized phone. However, one of the points of the petition is that unlocking is currently illegal _even after the original contract has expired_. Why should that be allowed? The original contract is over, after all. No party should have any rights beyond the contract they've agree upon.

moxie 14y ago

If you have some information from the phone call that wasn't in the official response, then it's probably worth sharing it here. Otherwise, the official statement seems to absolutely confirm the doubts of the original skeptical responses.

dhimes 14y ago
This is as good of a response as you can expect. This is a win. If you expected anything else (sneak, I'm looking at you here too) then you've never received a response from the White House on an issue on which they truly disagree. That letter would have said something like "While we respect your opinion, we believe that the current law best satisfies the needs of blah blah blah." Here, they are saying: yeah. We agree with you. We don't write the damn laws- but here is what we're willing to sign. Our job is to get our Senators and Representatives to change the law. It may not be pretty, and it's certainly not efficient, but this is democracy in action. It requires effort from its citizens in order to work. Not running away. EDIT: I forgot to add, that I did receive a 'blow it out your ass' response from President Clinton many years ago. He later reversed his stance on the issue, but it was too late for him to affect it and just left it as a recommendation to the next pres- who ignored it.
- deleted 14y ago
  [deleted]
- moxie 14y ago
  Based on what you're describing, I think you're going to have a tough sell for the merits of this process if the "win" case and the "lose" case have identical outcomes, but differ only in the language that is used.
  - leetrout 14y ago
    I think everyone has their expectations set too high for A. what a petition will really achieve and B. that the executive branch has any position to change laws. The parent to your comment seems to sum this up pretty well. So while I see your point that many may view this as ineffective and therefore a loss I definitely consider it a win in agreement with the parent. 1. Petition was made 2. Signature goal was met 3. WH responded favorably in agreement with petition supporters. 4. ... 5. Profit! ;)

unreal37 14y ago

Sinak, good job on raising the issue, and getting the White House, the Library of Congress and the FCC to all respond. This is a win for democracy. You must feel great today. For those getting all worked up about how it is still illegal to unlock cell phones, think of it like this. The DMCA makes it illegal to circumvent/crack software security - period. You phone is locked by software. Up til January, there was an exemption for phones. Now there's not. The problem isn't "unlocking phones". The problem is "you can't alter something expensive you've bought and paid for in full". In a way this is good. Regular people will get pissed at the carrier for not unlocking their phone at the end of their contract. And suddenly regular people will see how bad the DMCA is. The DMA targets not just Movie Pirates.

mistercow 14y ago

Petitions do absolutely work, but not how you think. They aren't for convincing the people they're directed at. They're for mobilizing the people who signed them and deepening their commitment to the cause. Signing your name to a statement has an effect on your self perception which causes you to act in a way that is consistent with the statement. Signing a petition to the White House and having the White House respond "we agree with you" does not mean that you convinced them. It means they agree with you.

mtgx 14y ago

Is it me or are they saying they support unlocking "as long as it's out of contract" or something? That doesn't really move the needle, does it?

Legion 14y ago

> "I just got off the phone with the White House" How badass did you feel writing that? I feel badass for you. Good job. Well done.

sinak 14y ago
Hah. Quite badass! Next up I'm going to get an unlocking tattoo.

teeja 14y ago

Congratulations for demonstrating once again that it's worth trying to do something about it. It's the only alternative to taking it in the neck over and over whilst crying in bitter beer.

BHSPitMonkey 14y ago

Just a heads up: The current headline on that site says "forom the White House" instead of "from the White House". I wouldn't have said anything, but it's a headline...

ck2 14y ago

You realize the moment President Obama expresses support for this, it will die in congress or be filibustered to death? It's also highly suspect of this administration actually supporting this - HIGHLY suspect. It goes against many things they've done to try to force more commerce and money exchanging hands.