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Companies are not natural persons any more than governments are, they don't have their own money. The difference is that shareholders are better at demanding in

Companies are not natural persons any more than governments are, they don't have their own money. The difference is that shareholders are better at demanding independent audits than voters are.

InclinedPlane 14y ago
The government takes money from people involuntarily, corporations receive money due to voluntary transactions. If I never buy a product from Apple or Exxon, there's no problem with that. If I don't pay taxes I go to jail.
- Mvandenbergh 14y ago
  That's true, but it doesn't change the fact that a corporation is not spending its own money either. That money belongs to the shareholders in the same way that tax receipts belong to citizens. Actually you would expect taxpayers to be even more vociferous in pushing audit requirements on government departments than shareholders are in ensuring their portfolio companies are correctly audited.
- jeltz 14y ago
  Your comparison is incorrect. The citizens of a company are its shareholders, not its customers. And if you are a shareholder the company is indeed spending YOUR money.
  - InclinedPlane 14y ago
    Becoming a shareholder is voluntary. And if you discover that a company is not doing enough to prevent fraud then you can divest yourself of that company. This in itself is another form of negative feedback which exists much more strongly for corporations than for government. Because individuals divesting themselves of a public stock company will result in the stock price dropping which will have a negative impact on the company, encouraging it to do something about the problem.
    - jeltz 14y ago
      Yes, it is easier to switch ownership of companies than it is to move between countries. But that does not change the fact that the closest thing to citizens a company has is its owners. And as pointed out in another reply a huge difference between companies and most governments is that countries tend to get the vast majority of their funds from taxes while companies hopefully should get their money from customers. But there are exceptions to this rule, some countries do not have any taxes.
  - RickHull 14y ago
    This is misleading. Becoming a shareholder is a one-time event. Taxes occur continuously. Governments get nearly all of their income from citizens on an involuntary basis. Enterprise gets a one-time infusion of funds from investors, and then nearly all of their income is from customers, all on a voluntary basis.

Companies are not natural persons any more than governments are, they don't have their own money. The difference is that shareholders are better at demanding independent audits than voters are.

InclinedPlane 14y ago

The government takes money from people involuntarily, corporations receive money due to voluntary transactions. If I never buy a product from Apple or Exxon, there's no problem with that. If I don't pay taxes I go to jail.

Mvandenbergh 14y ago
That's true, but it doesn't change the fact that a corporation is not spending its own money either. That money belongs to the shareholders in the same way that tax receipts belong to citizens. Actually you would expect taxpayers to be even more vociferous in pushing audit requirements on government departments than shareholders are in ensuring their portfolio companies are correctly audited.
jeltz 14y ago
Your comparison is incorrect. The citizens of a company are its shareholders, not its customers. And if you are a shareholder the company is indeed spending YOUR money.
- InclinedPlane 14y ago
  Becoming a shareholder is voluntary. And if you discover that a company is not doing enough to prevent fraud then you can divest yourself of that company. This in itself is another form of negative feedback which exists much more strongly for corporations than for government. Because individuals divesting themselves of a public stock company will result in the stock price dropping which will have a negative impact on the company, encouraging it to do something about the problem.
  - jeltz 14y ago
    Yes, it is easier to switch ownership of companies than it is to move between countries. But that does not change the fact that the closest thing to citizens a company has is its owners. And as pointed out in another reply a huge difference between companies and most governments is that countries tend to get the vast majority of their funds from taxes while companies hopefully should get their money from customers. But there are exceptions to this rule, some countries do not have any taxes.
- RickHull 14y ago
  This is misleading. Becoming a shareholder is a one-time event. Taxes occur continuously. Governments get nearly all of their income from citizens on an involuntary basis. Enterprise gets a one-time infusion of funds from investors, and then nearly all of their income is from customers, all on a voluntary basis.